OC Has Gun Taken Away

Reports of actual crimes and investigations, not hypothetical situations.

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cedarparkdad987
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Re: OC Has Gun Taken Away

Postby cedarparkdad987 » Thu Dec 28, 2017 8:06 am

Jay2121 wrote:Concealed means concealed. Open means everyone knows my business and my business is protecting me and my family. I want them to know. No guessing, no question.

While we may disagree on the relative merits, we definitely are on the same page for the purpose.


WTR
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Re: OC Has Gun Taken Away

Postby WTR » Thu Dec 28, 2017 9:54 am

I think as long as you can keep a reasonable "bubble" around you either method of carry is fine. I think OC carry requires more SA. However, carry.


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Re: OC Has Gun Taken Away

Postby kw5kw » Thu Dec 28, 2017 11:39 am

Liberty wrote::iagree:
The thing is these sort of disagreements tend to stifle real constructive discussions on advantages, and methods. There are some important issues that deserve discussion about CC and OC. but the bigger issue of whether one should or shouldn't matter to anyone but oneself. Calling people dumb because they choose to carry a different method than you do is insensitive inappropriate and just plain dumb.

I would like to point out that there is no one perfect way to carry for every single person. I am a critic of SOB, pocket Gonad femoral artery, or Open carry. But circumstances vary and have made these the best option at sometimes for me. Any method that we do choose to carry does have disadvantages or drawbacks. But sometimes an often criticised unpopular method of carry may be the best for a given situation or individual.

:iagree:

I like OC. I believe that it does provide the visual that you are able to protect yourself not just another person walking around with nothing on their shoulders except a cap. At a gas station Open Carrying of your weapon, keeping your head on a swivel, staying in Condition Yellow to Orange depending on the neighborhood, locking your vehicle is the best way to stay safe.

Just My Humble Opinion.
Russ
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Charles L. Cotton
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Re: OC Has Gun Taken Away

Postby Charles L. Cotton » Thu Dec 28, 2017 12:53 pm

This thread came very close to being locked a few times, but folks seem to have toned down the rhetoric. When Carl posted the account of a handgun being snatched from a holster, it was good information for people who carry openly. I guess it was predictable that the more ardent open-carry supporters wouldn't like reading the report and would try to downplay it. No one is saying guns are snatched from holsters daily, but it is a risk that must be weighed when determining when, where and how (retention holster or not) one will carry openly.

Some folks got upset with OldCannon's post, but considering his entire post wouldn't lead to the conclusion that a number of Members apparently believe. He posted, in part, "I fully support the change in laws that support open carry, but doesn't change the fact that if you're open carrying in a crowded public environment, I'm just gonna think, "Bless his heart." I dare say no one would argue that openly carrying in a crowded public environment increases the risk of your gun being snatched, just as the risk of a pickpocket increases. Some Members got really upset that he said it was dumb to carry openly in such environments. Be honest. Some of these same folks have accused others of being anti-gun or not supporting the Second Amendment if they don't fully support OC with their heart, mind and soul.

The law now allows us to carry handguns openly; some will do so others will not. Some will argue that OC puts one at a tactical disadvantage while others will argue the opposite. We all need to respect the fact that reasonable minds can differ on this issue and a the end of the day, it's a personal choice.

Happy New Year folks!!!
Chas.
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bblhd672
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Re: OC Has Gun Taken Away

Postby bblhd672 » Thu Dec 28, 2017 1:12 pm

Charles L. Cotton wrote:This thread came very close to being locked a few times, but folks seem to have toned down the rhetoric. When Carl posted the account of a handgun being snatched from a holster, it was good information for people who carry openly. I guess it was predictable that the more ardent open-carry supporters wouldn't like reading the report and would try to downplay it. No one is saying guns are snatched from holsters daily, but it is a risk that must be weighed when determining when, where and how (retention holster or not) one will carry openly.

Some folks got upset with OldCannon's post, but considering his entire post wouldn't lead to the conclusion that a number of Members apparently believe. He posted, in part, "I fully support the change in laws that support open carry, but doesn't change the fact that if you're open carrying in a crowded public environment, I'm just gonna think, "Bless his heart." I dare say no one would argue that openly carrying in a crowded public environment increases the risk of your gun being snatched, just as the risk of a pickpocket increases. Some Members got really upset that he said it was dumb to carry openly in such environments. Be honest. Some of these same folks have accused others of being anti-gun or not supporting the Second Amendment if they don't fully support OC with their heart, mind and soul.

The law now allows us to carry handguns openly; some will do so others will not. Some will argue that OC puts one at a tactical disadvantage while others will argue the opposite. We all need to respect the fact that reasonable minds can differ on this issue and a the end of the day, it's a personal choice.

Happy New Year folks!!!
Chas.

:iagree:
Thanks Charles. Everyone have a Happy New Year and carry safely in whatever manner best fits your life and situation! :txflag:
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oljames3
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Re: OC Has Gun Taken Away

Postby oljames3 » Thu Dec 28, 2017 1:43 pm

Charles L. Cotton wrote:This thread came very close to being locked a few times, but folks seem to have toned down the rhetoric. When Carl posted the account of a handgun being snatched from a holster, it was good information for people who carry openly. I guess it was predictable that the more ardent open-carry supporters wouldn't like reading the report and would try to downplay it. No one is saying guns are snatched from holsters daily, but it is a risk that must be weighed when determining when, where and how (retention holster or not) one will carry openly.

Some folks got upset with OldCannon's post, but considering his entire post wouldn't lead to the conclusion that a number of Members apparently believe. He posted, in part, "I fully support the change in laws that support open carry, but doesn't change the fact that if you're open carrying in a crowded public environment, I'm just gonna think, "Bless his heart." I dare say no one would argue that openly carrying in a crowded public environment increases the risk of your gun being snatched, just as the risk of a pickpocket increases. Some Members got really upset that he said it was dumb to carry openly in such environments. Be honest. Some of these same folks have accused others of being anti-gun or not supporting the Second Amendment if they don't fully support OC with their heart, mind and soul.

The law now allows us to carry handguns openly; some will do so others will not. Some will argue that OC puts one at a tactical disadvantage while others will argue the opposite. We all need to respect the fact that reasonable minds can differ on this issue and a the end of the day, it's a personal choice.

Happy New Year folks!!!
Chas.

:iagree:
How and what we carry are personal decisions. We should be able to discuss our choices respectfully. I have chosen to carry openly as my best option. Others will choose to carry diferently or not to carry at all. My reasons fit me and may not fit others. I will discuss my decissions with those who are interested but will not argue. Y'all be safe and carry.
O. Lee James, III Captain, US Army (Retired 2012), Honorable Order of St. Barbara
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JustSomeOldGuy
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Re: OC Has Gun Taken Away

Postby JustSomeOldGuy » Fri Dec 29, 2017 10:55 am

To parody the Dos Equis "most interesting man" commercials; :shock:

:anamatedbanana
I don't always open carry, but when I do, it will be because my draw will be AT LEAST three quarters of a second faster over concealed carry.
:woohoo :fire
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oljames3
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Re: OC Has Gun Taken Away

Postby oljames3 » Fri Dec 29, 2017 12:54 pm

I don't often carry concealed, but when I do, I consider it to be a degraded mode. For me, carrying openly is more efficient. So I seek out training in drawing from concealment and I practice the skill. This is the same concept I used in training my soldiers. I train harder than I expect to fight.

This week I attended a two day class at KR Training in which I fired 318 rounds, most drawing from concealment. This allowed me to improve my skill and measure myself against the shot timer and my fellow students. I had no late shots and was able to keep up with everyone else. I easily passed the state mandated course of fire for this certification.
https://krtraining.com/KRTraining/Classes/SchoolSafety.html

Works for me. At least once a week (church sanctuary during worship) and sometimes more (hospitals), I will be carrying concealed.

For those who prefer to carry openly, I recommend the Safariland 7TS ALS retention holster with QLS locking system (QLS 22L) and Guard. Also, the Kore Essentials gun belt. Stiff enough to carry my S&W M&P Mod 2.0 9mm 5inch plus 2 extra mags (48+1), phone, pepper gel and tourniquet. Costs $60.

I also suggest practicing drawing from concealment and seeking out training and other opportunities to measure yourself against time and/or other shooters. Work with the gear you will actually be wearing. I changed concealment garments during the above class and found that the heavier jacket was easier to work with as the lighter one, being more flexible, was harder to manage. My suit coat would be somewhere between these. It takes practice.

I may never be a Master level competitor, but I am working to be the best I can be.
O. Lee James, III Captain, US Army (Retired 2012), Honorable Order of St. Barbara
2/19FA, 1st Cavalry Division 73-78; 56FA BDE (Pershing) 78-81
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Jay2121
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Re: OC Has Gun Taken Away

Postby Jay2121 » Fri Dec 29, 2017 1:54 pm

Well said. Thanks for the info.


K.Mooneyham
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Re: OC Has Gun Taken Away

Postby K.Mooneyham » Fri Dec 29, 2017 1:57 pm

As I've said before in other somewhat related posts, I consider the method of carry utilized to be situational. What works in my small-town/rural environment might not be the best for a crowded big-city environment. It is nice to have options now. Additionally, the OWB holsters I own all have some sort of strap to secure the firearm, what I believe is known as Level I retention. It would seem that such should prevent a simple "grab-and-go" as in the OP's story but primarily gives me a bit of mental security that my handguns won't inadvertently snag on something and fall out.

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oljames3
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Re: OC Has Gun Taken Away

Postby oljames3 » Fri Dec 29, 2017 7:38 pm

There is a good deal of confusion concerning the definition of "retention level." See the Safariland site for details. https://www.safariland.com/holsters-and-gear-resources/holster-retention-levels.html#sm.0001k7sc5pvnne8xqhf2hkm27ry1u
O. Lee James, III Captain, US Army (Retired 2012), Honorable Order of St. Barbara
2/19FA, 1st Cavalry Division 73-78; 56FA BDE (Pershing) 78-81
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