KT: Louisville woman killed by police after serving a no knock warrant. CHL boyfriend fired at plainclothed officers

[03Lightningrocks]

Christ! Now they are saying no knock warrant but the cops did knock and announce. It sux there is no body cam footage.

That was my understanding. A no knock warrant was issued, but for some reason the officers decided knock and announce. KY Attorney General said there was corroboration on the knock and announcement.
Still, something feels off. Why would you knock with a no knock warrant? Body cam would sure clear up some of the mystery.

I was listening to an interview with one of the senior offices from Dallas PD on talk radio this afternoon. The officer said that one of the most important parts of gaining community support in some of these high profile (for right or wrong) is transparency. Sometimes, like in the Michael Brown matter with "hands up, don't shoot" the facts don't matter. In others, some straight information would help to keep the media from playing with facts. If any of the facts are true about packages of drugs being sent to her house by her previous boyfriend, some of the reasons for the raid are more clear. I've always had a problem with the no-knock premise that the evidence can be flushed down the toilet before the officers can get in to seize it. I'm not sure breaking down doors for the quantities of drugs that can be quickly flushed down toilets is the best strategy.

As for the packages of drugs. I am assuming they must have been ordering them off the dark web. It is common to have the drugs mailed to an address other than your own. They will often put a fake name on the package. The thinking being plausible deniability if the postal inspector happens to catch the drugs in the mail system and decides to follow them. Often they will even have the drugs mailed to an address where they know there is nobody living in the house. Then they go by and take them out of the mail box. Her ex boyfriend may have been having them sent to her address to keep the law away from his "trap house".

[philip964]

Christ! Now they are saying no knock warrant but the cops did knock and announce. It sux there is no body cam footage.

That was my understanding. A no knock warrant was issued, but for some reason the officers decided knock and announce. KY Attorney General said there was corroboration on the knock and announcement.
Still, something feels off. Why would you knock with a no knock warrant? Body cam would sure clear up some of the mystery.

I was listening to an interview with one of the senior offices from Dallas PD on talk radio this afternoon. The officer said that one of the most important parts of gaining community support in some of these high profile (for right or wrong) is transparency. Sometimes, like in the Michael Brown matter with "hands up, don't shoot" the facts don't matter. In others, some straight information would help to keep the media from playing with facts. If any of the facts are true about packages of drugs being sent to her house by her previous boyfriend, some of the reasons for the raid are more clear. I've always had a problem with the no-knock premise that the evidence can be flushed down the toilet before the officers can get in to seize it. I'm not sure breaking down doors for the quantities of drugs that can be quickly flushed down toilets is the best strategy.

End no knock warrants. Period.

I remember when the "WAR" on drugs started. The War has killed a lot of people and I see today that we are no more winning it than when Nixon declared war in 1971. I feel a lot less safe in America, than I did in 1971. Maybe police resources could be used in better ways. I have always felt that the government should take the profit motive out of it. Have government drug stores where addicts can get the stuff at low cost with a little advice on the side.

[03Lightningrocks]

Christ! Now they are saying no knock warrant but the cops did knock and announce. It sux there is no body cam footage.

That was my understanding. A no knock warrant was issued, but for some reason the officers decided knock and announce. KY Attorney General said there was corroboration on the knock and announcement.
Still, something feels off. Why would you knock with a no knock warrant? Body cam would sure clear up some of the mystery.

I was listening to an interview with one of the senior offices from Dallas PD on talk radio this afternoon. The officer said that one of the most important parts of gaining community support in some of these high profile (for right or wrong) is transparency. Sometimes, like in the Michael Brown matter with "hands up, don't shoot" the facts don't matter. In others, some straight information would help to keep the media from playing with facts. If any of the facts are true about packages of drugs being sent to her house by her previous boyfriend, some of the reasons for the raid are more clear. I've always had a problem with the no-knock premise that the evidence can be flushed down the toilet before the officers can get in to seize it. I'm not sure breaking down doors for the quantities of drugs that can be quickly flushed down toilets is the best strategy.

End no knock warrants. Period.

I remember when the "WAR" on drugs started. The War has killed a lot of people and I see today that we are no more winning it than when Nixon declared war in 1971. I feel a lot less safe in America, than I did in 1971. Maybe police resources could be used in better ways. I have always felt that the government should take the profit motive out of it. Have government drug stores where addicts can get the stuff at low cost with a little advice on the side.

I agree completely. The war on drugs has turned into a revenue generator for the government. The DEA and even the local police agencies are making huge profits off drug sales. They simply sit back and allow the dealers to collect the money then they rush in and scoop it all up. It is no longer about eliminating drugs. One great idea would be to put the funds they confiscate from drug dealers towards drug rehabilitation instead of putting the money into local police departments and actually have some affect on the issue. Hopefully an end is put to no knock warrants.

[FastCarry]

Seems like violence is kicking off, LEOs shot in Louisville

[Grayling813]

So What’s Happening In Louisville?
https://www.captainsjournal.com/2020/09 ... ouisville/

[Rafe]

Seems like violence is kicking off, LEOs shot in Louisville

[C-dub]

Here we go!

[philip964]

Two officers shot in Louisville last night.

Saw a guy on TV say “ sure they charged the one officer, he fired into a White apartment “

https://apple.news/Ash-83pmZTju7fwJqm3tyTw

[03Lightningrocks]

Two officers shot in Louisville last night.

Saw a guy on TV say “ sure they charged the one officer, he fired into a White apartment “

https://apple.news/Ash-83pmZTju7fwJqm3tyTw

Just goes to show how stupid these people will get to claim racism.

[philip964]

https://news.yahoo.com/louisville-polic ... 23651.html

Louisville police major said BLM and Antifi “ will be washing our cars”.

I thought it was a pretty good comment. Commie pinko news media didn’t like it as well.

[Grayling813]

Charles Barkley questions the narrative...and Shaquille O’Neal agrees with him
https://townhall.com/tipsheet/bronsonst ... h-n2576893

"I don't think this one was like George Floyd or Ahmaud Arbery and things like that," said Barkley. "I feel sad that this young lady lost her life. I think ... the no-knock warrant is something we need to get rid of ... across the board. But I am worried to lump all these situations in together."

"And I just feel bad that the young lady lost her life," Barkley continued. "But we do have to take into account that her boyfriend shot at the cops and shot a cop. So like I say, even though I am really sorry she lost her life, I just don't think we can put this in the same situation as George Floyd or Ahmaud Arbery."

[MaduroBU]

The circumstances of this tragedy are of relatively minor importance compared to the broad societal issue at hand: we send cops with guns drawn in the dead of night to citizens' homes to confiscate contraband. Breonna Taylor, the Tuttles, and innumerable other people have been and will continue to be killed in these enforcement efforts. What is the good obtained as a society or secured for individuals that makes such a death toll worthwhile?

Are we trying to prevent addiction? Well, the War on Drugs failed at that: The people who want to do illegal drugs obtain and do them. The people who want to do drugs but are dissuaded by the laws against illegal drugs obtain legal drugs (fentanyl, Norco, benzodiazepines, oxycodone/contin, ethanol, and nicotine) and do those. The people who want to be addicted to a chemical are actively addicted to a chemical.

Are we trying to prevent the blight of drug houses? Well, the War on Drugs failed at that: drug houses and their societal blight are possible only because of the War on Drugs. Cocaine and heroin are cheap to grow, manufacture and transport. They are profitable only due to the massive risk premium which is the exclusive result of the War on Drugs. Cocaine would sell for no more than coffee without that risk premium. The line of cars outside of the local Starbuck's can be annoying, but it's not the same thing. You cannot sell enough coffee to make rent on your meth/coke/heroin den.

Are we trying to prevent the rise of criminal cartels whose violence and influence have overtaken many Central and South American countries and whose influence is spreading here? Well, the War on Drugs CAUSED that. Folger's doesn't have a crew of brutal enforcers who pay off politicians or kill the truck drivers from Maxwell House. Black Rifle Coffee roasts some excellent beans and they appear to LOVE firearms, but apart from horrifying Democrats with their M61 Vulcan-equipped Prius, don't hassle anyone. Meanwhile, the cartels in countries that have essentially banned firearms have near monopolies on violence and reign as a collection of warlords. They don't have some Dune-like monopoly on a valuable and exceptionally rare luxury item; they are willing to grow and smuggle a cheap agricultural product that we make expensive with a risk premium. Cocaine and heroin are not more addictive or difficult to produce than cigarettes, but they are FAR more expensive.

In the grand, multi-billion dollar drug economy, there is exactly one group of people who is irreplaceable. The Sinaloa cartel could vanish tomorrow and another would take its place. Colombia could eradicate coca production and another nation state would take up the mantle. Texas could close its entire border and the narco subs would pick up the slack. But if the DEA ,state and local law enforcement stopped locking up a (mostly minority) fraction of dealers, mules and users, then the price of drugs would plummet and the entire operation would end.

The only groups who benefit from the War on Drugs are the cartels, local law enforcement through highly questionable seizures and the prison-industrial complex. The stated benefits of the War on Drugs are, in fact, pathetic efforts to address the problems created BY the War on Drugs.

So in the moment were the cops shooting back, who was right, et c. is a much smaller issue than the fact that law enforcement is routinely tasked with acting as a massive price support for some of the most violent, ruthless and evil groups on the planet. There shouldn't have been any reason to care if those folks were making an extra $100 a month selling cocaine (which is a very generous estimate of their proceeds were the cops not adding the giant risk premium to drug sales).

[srothstein]

The circumstances of this tragedy are of relatively minor importance compared to the broad societal issue at hand: we send cops with guns drawn in the dead of night to citizens' homes to confiscate contraband.

I am not sure that I agree with your ranking or combination of the two issues. Especially if we make the minor technical correction of changing the word "contraband" to the phrase "evidence of a crime".

Our police MUST be able to serve a search warrant to look for evidence of a crime. That makes the circumstances of the incident Involving Ms. Taylor of much greater importance. I am convinced that the police were generally right in serving the warrant and in the manner in which they did. I am also convinced that Kenneth Walker was well within his rights in shooting to defend his property during the incident. Much of the public (read media based) narrative on this case appears to be incorrect on factual specifics, which I believe is what led the grand jury to act as they did, with the indictments and lack of indictments.

Having said that, I have to agree with the concept of you other problem. Why is the US trying to ban drugs at all? What gives the government the authority to ban any drugs? Why did it take a Constitutional Amendment to ban alcohol (which is just another type of drug) but not take an amendment to ban these other drugs? And speaking of Prohibition, did our society not learn from it? You cannot ban any substance that people want to have. It just doesn't work.

Drug abuse is a problem in our society. It directly affects our national productivity and our national crime rates. But I believe we have successfully proven that laws banning them do not work. And all the war on drugs has done, in addition to helping the cartels and prison-industrial complex that you mention, is contribute to the greatest loss of rights by individuals since the founding of the country. Read SCOTUS cases and see how many of them come from drug cases.

I am a firm believer that the single greatest factor that would improve the relationship of the police to the community is if we repealed all of the nanny state laws that say what you can or cannot do when it does not directly harm another person.

[Grayling813]

I am a firm believer that the single greatest factor that would improve the relationship of the police to the community is if we repealed all of the nanny state laws that say what you can or cannot do when it does not directly harm another person.

X1000!

[philip964]

I agree with almost all of this above.

It is high time we address the issue of legally armed civilians being served with no knock warrants. We need to end them.

The similarities between the Tuttles and Ms Taylor are great as well as the differences in the reaction and media coverage.

To me it is totally unfair to put our police officers in this situation.

Reconsidering the war on drugs is a good second step. We only have to look at prohibition and the violence and criminality it created to see that, it doesn’t work.

Our war on drugs has destroyed our neighbor.