Had an interesting experience yesterday

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imkopaka
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Had an interesting experience yesterday

Postby imkopaka » Tue Feb 09, 2016 10:27 am

I was in my driveway cleaning my car yesterday afternoon when I heard screaming down the street. At first it sounded like kids playing (and maybe a bit dissatisfied with the intensity of said playing), but after a couple seconds I heard "HELP ME!! SOMEBODY HELP ME!!" I ran out into the street to get a better view of what was happening. 3 or 4 houses down on the opposite side of the street, a man was pulling a woman away from a pickup in the driveway toward the front door of the house, with a firm grip on her clothes or hair (couldn't quite tell, but she was hunched over too far for me to believe he was pulling her arm).

Of course me being the amazing CHL holder that I am, obviously I...didn't have my gun on me. I was in my driveway in sweatpants and loafers cleaning trash out of my car. I didn't think it was necessary. Fortunately, I knew exactly where my gun was, so I sprinted inside to get it. I told my wife to call 911 for domestic violence (though now that I think about it I could have made a case for aggravated kidnapping),and I ran out the door at the low ready. When I got back outside the woman was already halfway between me and the guy, running towards me. Apparently she saw me come to investigate and decided I looked safe enough given the circumstances. I told her she was safe now and that police were on the way, introduced myself and told her my qualifications to make her feel safer, and tried to get her behind my car and out of sight.

While I was trying to calm her down, I had my eyes on the guy the whole time. He kept going back and forth between the house and car for reasons unknown. At one point I swear I saw him holding a handgun while he looked at me. Before the police arrived, he went into the house and stayed there.

When the police arrived (three police units AND the sheriff), I flagged them down, placed my gun on the roof of my car, and approached the closest officer. Obviously nervous, the officer got out of the car with his hand on his pistol. I quickly told him, "Hi, sir - my name is Aaron Cook, I'm a CHL holder and I've got my ID in my pocket so you don't need to worry about the gun." He seemed quite comfortable after that. He asked me for a sit-rep, I explained what happened, and the officers went to the house.

They knocked on the door for close to 10 minutes before this guy came out. According to a neighbor who's lived here longer than I have, the guy is a meth dealer. Other people have since told me this as well. I don't know what he told the cops, but they all eventually left...and he didn't. After the police left I saw him look in his own front window (???), then stoop and pick something off the ground. I couldn't see what it was because he was facing away from me, but I heard a sound that was unmistakably a slide being racked.

At this point, I've already changed into jeans and running shoes and strapped on my open-carry serpa holster. An officer came to get a written statement from me and told me what I already suspected - they've had problems of an undisclosable nature with this guy before.

Analysis:

Things that went wrong.
+I didn't have my gun on me.
+I wasn't sure what to do with my gun once the police arrived. Initially I tried to conceal it in my pants, but since I was holster-less and in sweatpants, it almost fell out. That's when I decided to stick it on the roof of the car.
+I wasn't able to convince the woman to go into my house, where it would have been easier to defend her and myself if the guy followed her.
+Police couldn't get a warrant to enter his home, so his alleged meth operation went uninvestigated.

Things that went right.
+We got the woman out of there. I don't know where she went after the fact, but we still got her out of there in that moment.
+I kept my cool. No tunnel vision, shakes, confusion, rage, "bulletproof syndrome", etc.
+I didn't piss of the police.
+Police response was timely, large, and coordinated.
+My wife had the kids in our bedroom and had her 9mm at the ready in case anything crazy happened.

Thoughts?
Never bring a knife to a gun fight.
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Soccerdad1995
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Re: Had an interesting experience yesterday

Postby Soccerdad1995 » Tue Feb 09, 2016 10:37 am

I think you did well.

Watch your 6 with this guy going forward.
Ding dong, the witch is dead

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baldeagle
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Re: Had an interesting experience yesterday

Postby baldeagle » Tue Feb 09, 2016 10:39 am

I don't see anything wrong with what you did. I'm always armed when I leave the house but not when I take the trash out. (I have been a few times.) Unless you live in a really bad area, it's not surprising that you wouldn't be armed when you're on your own property. I would be concerned about future interactions with this individual. If he's really cooking meth in his house, that could lead to all sorts of bad incidents in the future. Now that he has his eye on you, I would not go outside with being armed. Carry all the time, keep your head on a swivel and especially watch in his direction, at least until some time has passed. And if there's anything you can do to facilitate his arrest, I would do it. Film or photograph cars and license plates coming and going from his house. (Try to do it unobtrusively so he won't notice.) Record anything unusual and report it to the police. Make it your goal to get this guy out of the neighborhood.
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TVegas
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Re: Had an interesting experience yesterday

Postby TVegas » Tue Feb 09, 2016 10:43 am

Seems like you did very well under the circumstances.
You already noted that not having your gun on you was an issue.

Some would probably say this is a good situation for a truck gun (handgun or long gun), and I would agree.

Regardless, you may have saved that woman's life. Good job!
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fast86gn
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Re: Had an interesting experience yesterday

Postby fast86gn » Tue Feb 09, 2016 10:48 am

Wow... I would say you did alright. But for sure watch your back. People on Meth are very unpredictable. If he is cooking he is probably using too.
David

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The Annoyed Man
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Re: Had an interesting experience yesterday

Postby The Annoyed Man » Tue Feb 09, 2016 10:50 am

baldeagle wrote:I don't see anything wrong with what you did. I'm always armed when I leave the house but not when I take the trash out. (I have been a few times.) Unless you live in a really bad area, it's not surprising that you wouldn't be armed when you're on your own property. I would be concerned about future interactions with this individual. If he's really cooking meth in his house, that could lead to all sorts of bad incidents in the future. Now that he has his eye on you, I would not go outside with being armed. Carry all the time, keep your head on a swivel and especially watch in his direction, at least until some time has passed. And if there's anything you can do to facilitate his arrest, I would do it. Film or photograph cars and license plates coming and going from his house. (Try to do it unobtrusively so he won't notice.) Record anything unusual and report it to the police. Make it your goal to get this guy out of the neighborhood.

In my old neighborhood back in California, we had a neighbor across the street and one or two houses down who represented the same kind of threat to the neighborhood. In our case, we were able to leverage a city police program to put pressure on the property owner (in this case, the addict/dealer's parents) to evict him from the home or face some kind of legal issues....the details of which I no longer remember.

It may be worth investigating whether or not the resident is the property owner, and if he is not, then bringing pressure to bear against that owner to force an eviction from the property.

I think you did the best you could under the circumstances, AND learned some valuable lessons without paying a high price for them. Not a bad outcome....
"Give me Liberty, or I'll get up and get it myself."—Hookalakah Meshobbab
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Lynyrd
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Re: Had an interesting experience yesterday

Postby Lynyrd » Tue Feb 09, 2016 11:04 am

I don't know what you could have done differently except for what you have already pointed out. A drug dealer in the neighbor hood is something I have lived with before. It was nerve wracking. I was armed all the time. Unfortunately, I had a wife and small children at home and I worried most about them when i was at work. I got all the neighbors together and we talked about the situation. All of us carried in our yards, all the time. And many did not have CHL's. It was strange seeing people mowing yards on our block carrying guns. The guy eventually moved. Someone said he went to Houston.

You didn't mention who owned the house. If it is a rental, maybe several of you could go talk to the owner of the house?
Do what you say you're gonna do.


treadlightly
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Re: Had an interesting experience yesterday

Postby treadlightly » Tue Feb 09, 2016 11:05 am

The owner ought to be very willing to get rid of a meth dealer.

If there is any meth cooking going on, the owner is who will be stuck with hazmat remediation costs. We had a meth dealer once in a rent house - and never suspected a thing, actually - and after the police busted his sorry butt we were told to consider ourselves lucky.

The police said they had heard of environmental remediation going as far as careful deconstruction and removal of an entire house.

If the property owner is skeptical, inform him of the risks of his property's involvement with meth. There are probably ways the police can seize the property, too.

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Beiruty
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Re: Had an interesting experience yesterday

Postby Beiruty » Tue Feb 09, 2016 11:10 am

Why the bad guy was not arrested? Was she not cooperative and decided not file charges? If so, this the classic story of good guy getting into the skins of the onion layaers. Only bad smell would follow.
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atx2a
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Re: Had an interesting experience yesterday

Postby atx2a » Tue Feb 09, 2016 11:19 am

Sounds like you did everything you could and learned some good lessons. Scenarios never go the way we imagine them in our heads or how training says are "best practices" - it's all about making split-second decisions and doing the best you can. If more people understood this, they'd be a lot more forgiving and understanding of law enforcement. We're all humans, and performing under pressure like that is tough to do. Looks like you made fairly easy work of it. Good job.
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ELB
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Re: Had an interesting experience yesterday

Postby ELB » Tue Feb 09, 2016 11:38 am

Soccerdad1995 wrote:I think you did well.

Watch your 6 with this guy going forward.


+1 to each comment.
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Topic author
imkopaka
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Re: Had an interesting experience yesterday

Postby imkopaka » Tue Feb 09, 2016 11:51 am

Yes, I will definitely be armed even just going to get the mail from now on. Sadly, I'm not much of a people person, so I don't know anyone in my neighborhood really. I've lived here for 2 years and just learned the name of my next door neighbor last month. Suddenly organizing a community against this guy seems awfully confrontational and ill-advised. If I had relationships with my neighbors already, that would be one thing, but to suddenly knock on someone's door and say, "hi, you don't know me, but I think you should carry a gun from now on" seems kind of...off-putting.

I would love to help the police out with pictures and whatnot, but my responsibility is to my family first, so I don't want make myself any more of a thorn in his side than I already am...because the more I impede his "business", the more I become a target.

TVegas: I would like to keep a gun in the car, but I don't have the funds to mount a safe in there, and that's the only way I would feel comfortable leaving a gun unattended like that.

I don't know if he owns or rents, but since I don't even know his name, I'm not sure how I would find out. Even then, I have no evidence to bring against him other than what the police already know, so I don't have anything to present to the owner (if it isn't him).

Beiruty: I don't know what happened with the woman. After the police arrived I lost track of her. She was on the phone while we waited for police to arrive, so it's possible she called a friend to come pick her up. It's also possible she left with the cops, but it's also possible she went with the guy. I was angry that they didn't arrest him, but it's likely he knows how to play the system well enough to avoid getting hauled off immediately.
Never bring a knife to a gun fight.
Carry gun: Springfield XD Tactical .45

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Jusme
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Re: Had an interesting experience yesterday

Postby Jusme » Tue Feb 09, 2016 12:03 pm

I think you did everything correctly under the circumstances. If the police told you they knew about him being a dealer, then there have been interactions with him in the past. You can contact your county drug task force if they have one. It is usually under the direction of the DPS. Let them know of the incident, they can pull the report. As one poster suggested, keep a log of cars and LPs that frequent the BGs house, then turn over the list to the task force. They will advise you regarding any other things to look out for. The difficulty in prosecuting a lot of these people, is that there is no one willing to provide enough info to obtain a warrant, the task force may set up surveillance, and stop anyone leaving. if they can get one of his customers to roll over on him then they can take further action.

But as most have said on here, don't turn your back on him, and see if you can find out about the property ownership. A meth lab is not only a hazard for the chemical dangers, but meth addicts are very prone to violence and will stop at nothing to get their drugs.

Keep us updated. Stay safe and Good luck. :tiphat:
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Jusme
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Re: Had an interesting experience yesterday

Postby Jusme » Tue Feb 09, 2016 12:09 pm

I don't know if he owns or rents, but since I don't even know his name, I'm not sure how I would find out. Even then, I have no evidence to bring against him other than what the police already know, so I don't have anything to present to the owner (if it isn't him).

The property ownership records are kept at the county. You won't need his name just the address, Usually if its a rental property, it will be owned by a company or corporate name rather than an individual.

I hope they eventually put this guy away, I hate drug dealers as much as I hate bullies who abuse women. :mad5
Take away the Second first, and the First is gone in a second :rules: :patriot:


Topic author
imkopaka
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Re: Had an interesting experience yesterday

Postby imkopaka » Tue Feb 09, 2016 12:37 pm

Okay, I looked the house up on the appraisal district's website. Got the owner's name and address. He lives somewhere else, so I'm assuming the place is rented. I think I might initiate some form of contact with the owner.
Never bring a knife to a gun fight.
Carry gun: Springfield XD Tactical .45


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