First encounter with LEO after witnessing accident

[chlag01]

This weekend I witnessed an accident in Austin and stuck around to make sure the police got an unbiased account of events. While I waited for the police to arrive, I debated whether I should immediately volunteer to the police that I was carrying, or only if they asked for ID. I chose to volunteer the info (after reflection on the Canton Ohio video), and told the officer I had a CHL and was carrying as soon as I got him alone. He looked at me like I was crazy for telling him, and ?jokingly? asked if I was planning on shooting anyone. A nervous laugh, a "No Sir", and an oral account of the accident and I was free to go.

I was already nervous, but his look of 'Why are you telling me this?' made me even more so. I guess I made the right choice. He asked for my info after a while, but never for ID. I did give him both IDs anyway, and he immediately handed back the CHL with another "Why did you give me this?" look. I suppose its better I volunteer it up front than he find out after we've been interacting for 20-30 minutes, but whole situation just felt uncomfortable.

[stroguy]

CHL = a license. Would you hand over your welding license? Your Amateur radio license? There should be no guilt or shame associated with it, you have passed the test. If you did things just the opposite the officer would have never known and would have went home never knowing or caring. But he went home just knowing.

[Heartland Patriot]

I understand what both the OP and stroguy are getting at...what stroguy said is the way it SHOULD be, and probably ends up in most cases...that is, no need to volunteer things that aren't requested/required. However, I also understand that the OP, having seen that video of "over-the-top" LEOs basically freaking out, was more than a little nervous about the situation. I interacted with an LEO in Oklahoma some time ago while involved in a probate property matter, and didn't feel any need to disclose that I was carrying. After about the first 30 seconds of seeing his demeanor and attitude were so positive, I kind of forgot about it. However, IF I had been pulled over for a traffic violation, then I would certainly have handed over my CHL with driver's license and other documentation. I guess its really situational.

[stroguy]

Very good H P. Hope I didn't come off as rude. You are just not required by law to show it in that situation. The officer was there doing a job for the accidentees (is that a word?). No need to distract him with that info imo. It may have been his tenth of the day and he was just tired of accident reports.

[mikeintexas]

I had a similar incident happen to me last spring. When the officer asked for ID, I handed over my TXDL and CHL. He looked at the CHL and handed it back. Got my info from my DL and handed it back, then the officer walked away. A few minutes later, the officer found me again. He asked me if I was armed. I answered "yes". He then asked where the weapon was. I said on my right hip under my jacket. He said "Oh, OK" and walked away.

All that to say I won't volunteer information unless asked for ID. Just my $0.02 worth...

[thatguy]

Good post. I have had my CHL for about 14 years and carry my gun every day but I will confess, the few times I have had interaction with LE I am a bit apprenhensive. I make a judgement call but usually will look for a way to ID myself, which includes my CHL. As I see it I am not sure what reaction I may get from the officer, I know that I am not required to tell him or her that I am armed until they ask but that does not mean they know.
So far they just hand it back to me looking a little dis-interested but we have seen the other side of the situation on video.


As they say, you might beat the rap but not the ride.

[RoyGBiv]

Having received my first carry permit when I was a resident of NC, it was (still is) required to notify any LEO when "approached or addressed". It was a bit strange to me in TX the first time I had a conversation with a local LEO standing in line to order lunch at a restaurant and felt no obligation to inform him that I was carrying. Even in NC that would not constitute "approached or addressed", but still a bit strange, in a 2nd Amendment Freedom sort of way.

However, if I am ever "approached or addressed" by LE, even if no ID is requested, but assuming the contact is "professional" in nature (LE related), I would likely notify verbally (still depends on specifics of the situation). Of course I would not notify if I wasn't carrying.

"Officer, just so there's no surprises, I want to let you know that I have a CHL and am currently carrying."
If the officer reacted in a way as to try and make me feel stupid about it, shame on him/her. I wouldn't lose a wink of sleep over it.

YMMV

[lws380]

A few minutes later, the officer found me again. He asked me if I was armed. I answered "yes". He then asked where the weapon was.

My response might have been, "Which one".

[ELB]

I am of the school "don't give the officer more information than he asked for." People volunteer information that they are nervous about, and that in itself draws attention. My take is if the officer asks for ID, I just give DL and CHL together, rather than saying something about a gun -- then the officer gets the "good news" (genuine CHL holder) before hearing "gun" "weapon" whatever. I have witnessed accidents, handed over the two licenses when asked for ID, and just like above got the CHL back immediately without comment. As it should be.

It is curious that the officer above came around later to ask about the weapon, but maybe he was just curious because he couldn't make it out, or wanted to check his guess about where it was being carried?

[johnson0317]

I think this situation falls under what the youngsters call, "TMI"...too much information. Since notification is not required under Texas law, unless asked for ID, then the officer was probably wondering why you felt the need to make this information available. I think it created a little dissonant cognizance for him, and he had to process it. I don't think he thought you were wrong to make sure he knew about it, but he also probably was a little curious as to why you felt the need.

RJ

[CrimsonSoul]

I know that I am not required to tell him or her that I am armed until they ask

While you "technically" have to tell them that you have a CHL if they ask for ID (while you are carrying) there is no penalty for not doing so. They really screwed it up, instead of just appealing that section of it being a requirement with a penalty they just said Eh, it's still a requirement.. but no penalty now! It makes no sense, but there you go.

[thatguy]

Just to play devils advocate, lets say you witnessed a fist fight/possible attempted robbery in a parking lot and the local PD responds and starts asking the standard questions of what happended but do not ask you for ID. Say this goes off and on for an hour or so until an officer asks you (being a witness that seems to have some snap) to jump in his patrol car to go to the second scene where they have detained a subject that fits your description, remember he has still not asked for your ID (still devils advocate). What to do? Do you still wait for the officer to officially ask for ID or do you volunteer before getting into the car. Maybe the LEO would be upset that he has been questioning you for about an hour and you had a GUN on you. Also remember he may be ticked off because of HIS mistake for not asking for ID but since he does not want to fade heat from his supervisor turns this "thing" back on you....

This does not mean I stop every officer I see to tell him I have a CHL but once it turns to "police business" I am digging out DL and CHL because as previously posted I would rather them see my plastic than hear the word gun.

Brian Mobley I think I feel better...?

[Keith B]

Just to play devils advocate, lets say you witnessed a fist fight/possible attempted robbery in a parking lot and the local PD responds and starts asking the standard questions of what happended but do not ask you for ID. Say this goes off and on for an hour or so until an officer asks you (being a witness that seems to have some snap) to jump in his patrol car to go to the second scene where they have detained a subject that fits your description, remember he has still not asked for your ID (still devils advocate). What to do? Do you still wait for the officer to officially ask for ID or do you volunteer before getting into the car. Maybe the LEO would be upset that he has been questioning you for about an hour and you had a GUN on you. Also remember he may be ticked off because of HIS mistake for not asking for ID but since he does not want to fade heat from his supervisor turns this "thing" back on you....

This does not mean I stop every officer I see to tell him I have a CHL but once it turns to "police business" I am digging out DL and CHL because as previously posted I would rather them see my plastic than hear the word gun.

Brian Mobley I think I feel better...?

It would depend on the officer. My opinion is if he didn't ask for ID and has talked to me for an hour, then he is not too concerned about my being a threat since he is willing to allow me to jump into the car with him.

Now, on the OP's post: Never give them more than they asked for. If he had asked for ID or asked if you had any weapons, then you would need to volunteer you have a CHL and show the ID. Otherwise, you are just John Q. Public out there and even if he asks for Name and Address (not requesting to see your license), then you are not obligated to tell him and can keep your carry status to yourself.

On another angle, not that you were, but some LEO's may see it as bragging or wanting to let them know you have a gun like them. There are a lot of wanna'-be LEO's out there, many with CHL's. Some of those have badges (CHL badges.)

[speedsix]

I think this situation falls under what the youngsters call, "TMI"...too much information. Since notification is not required under Texas law, unless asked for ID, then the officer was probably wondering why you felt the need to make this information available. I think it created a little dissonant cognizance for him, and he had to process it. I don't think he thought you were wrong to make sure he knew about it, but he also probably was a little curious as to why you felt the need.

RJ

...agree with this...the one non-traffic incident I've been involved in...cops got there...I carried the offender's gun out to them by the barrel...gave it to one of 'em to unload, pointed out the one I'd taken it from...they went in and arrested him and brought the others out to question...after all that, one asked for my ID for the report...when I gave him both...he looked at me and said "he's lucky you didn't just shoot him."...told him the guy never knew I had a gun...

[mikeintexas]

It is curious that the officer above came around later to ask about the weapon, but maybe he was just curious because he couldn't make it out, or wanted to check his guess about where it was being carried?

I thought that was odd also. But that is all that was made of it. Maybe he was just wondering where I was carrying or "if" I was carrying at all. He didn't offer the "why" and I didn't ask...