Recoil sensitive shotgun advice needed

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Soccerdad1995
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Re: Recoil sensitive shotgun advice needed

Postby Soccerdad1995 » Thu Sep 14, 2017 9:57 am

flechero wrote:
Soccerdad1995 wrote: And the range I belong to does not allow birdshot. Only buckshot and slugs.



In this particular case, I'd go to a different range that allowed birdshot. That or use a 28 ga. loaner gun. Do you have a skeet range close by? Maybe a 20 ga with #8 shot target loads.


The only skeet range nearby is American Shooting Center, but I would be concerned about the attitude of the folks who work there ruining her experience. They tend to be intimidating for novice shooters.

The range where I am a member (Boyert) has a loaner 20 gauge. That and a recoil pad may work. I'll also bring a .22 lever action and an AR along with the GP 100.
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Lynyrd
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Re: Recoil sensitive shotgun advice needed

Postby Lynyrd » Thu Sep 14, 2017 10:34 am

I have a friend who taught all of his daughters to shoot shotguns at an early age. These ladies bird hunt, and shoot skeet. Boxes of shells in a day. They use something like this to help manage the recoil impact.

https://www.amazon.com/LimbSaver-90102-Protective-Shooting-Pad/dp/B002K2O3Y0/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1505403141&sr=8-1&keywords=limbsaver+protective+shooting+pad
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rotor
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Re: Recoil sensitive shotgun advice needed

Postby rotor » Thu Sep 14, 2017 10:40 am

The laws of physics are hard to overcome. 1 oz of birdshot or 1 oz of buckshot at the same velocity produce the same recoil effect. The solution is a lighter load of lead at a lower velocity regardless if it is slug, birdshot or buckshot. Since the lady involved is frail(?) she will need a gun that has a LOP and fit so that she can firmly place it in her shoulder and not get slapped by it when fired. Preferably a fairly heavy automatic with a good recoil pad. Add on recoil pads that increase the LOP may cause her to get face slapped and that will be a downer. A 20 gauge with the same load and velocity of a 12 gauge will produce the same recoil and may even be worse because the 20 gauge tends to be lighter. I reload 7/8 oz 12gauge for the recoil sensitive smaller friends and they can shoot these all day in my wife's Beretta A400 xcel with reduced LOP, excellent recoil system and short (28") barrel. Even then, my wife says Monarch shells kick like the dickens so we don't believe the label and she won't buy those shells even on sale.


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Re: Recoil sensitive shotgun advice needed

Postby flechero » Thu Sep 14, 2017 11:08 am

Soccerdad1995 wrote:The range where I am a member (Boyert) has a loaner 20 gauge. That and a recoil pad may work.


I wonder if you call ahead and explain what you are doing it they will let her fire 1-2 rounds of low velocity birdshot into the berm before shooting buckshot? Worth a quick call to see.


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Re: Recoil sensitive shotgun advice needed

Postby cyphertext » Thu Sep 14, 2017 11:11 am

I would postpone the trip to the range until I had more info... still have her come over, verify it is unloaded, show her how to verify and how to operate it. She may be more at ease just knowing those things. I certainly wouldn't have her shoot buck shot out of it for the first go, and she may not really be interested in going to the range to shoot other stuff.

Have her over, figure out what she has, teach her a little about it, go to dinner... then you can gauge if a range trip is in order for the future.


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Soccerdad1995
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Re: Recoil sensitive shotgun advice needed

Postby Soccerdad1995 » Thu Sep 14, 2017 11:33 am

cyphertext wrote:I would postpone the trip to the range until I had more info... still have her come over, verify it is unloaded, show her how to verify and how to operate it. She may be more at ease just knowing those things. I certainly wouldn't have her shoot buck shot out of it for the first go, and she may not really be interested in going to the range to shoot other stuff.

Have her over, figure out what she has, teach her a little about it, go to dinner... then you can gauge if a range trip is in order for the future.


The idea of having her shoot other things with less recoil would be to see if she might be interested in switching HD weapons. I have since learned that her ex husband has been an ex for around 40 years and I don't believe she has fired any guns at all. So in addition to other concerns, the shotgun is apparently very old and likely not well maintained. As I mentioned, this lady is a friend of my wife, so I would be happy to even give her a reasonably priced HD weapon that might be more appropriate. Revolvers are simple to operate, so the learning curve is easy.
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Re: Recoil sensitive shotgun advice needed

Postby cyphertext » Thu Sep 14, 2017 12:38 pm

Soccerdad1995 wrote:
cyphertext wrote:I would postpone the trip to the range until I had more info... still have her come over, verify it is unloaded, show her how to verify and how to operate it. She may be more at ease just knowing those things. I certainly wouldn't have her shoot buck shot out of it for the first go, and she may not really be interested in going to the range to shoot other stuff.

Have her over, figure out what she has, teach her a little about it, go to dinner... then you can gauge if a range trip is in order for the future.


The idea of having her shoot other things with less recoil would be to see if she might be interested in switching HD weapons. I have since learned that her ex husband has been an ex for around 40 years and I don't believe she has fired any guns at all. So in addition to other concerns, the shotgun is apparently very old and likely not well maintained. As I mentioned, this lady is a friend of my wife, so I would be happy to even give her a reasonably priced HD weapon that might be more appropriate. Revolvers are simple to operate, so the learning curve is easy.


But is she interested in HD weapons? Or has she had this shotgun laying around for 40 yrs and it makes her nervous? I guess that is what I am missing from this story.


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Soccerdad1995
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Re: Recoil sensitive shotgun advice needed

Postby Soccerdad1995 » Thu Sep 14, 2017 1:25 pm

cyphertext wrote:
Soccerdad1995 wrote:
cyphertext wrote:I would postpone the trip to the range until I had more info... still have her come over, verify it is unloaded, show her how to verify and how to operate it. She may be more at ease just knowing those things. I certainly wouldn't have her shoot buck shot out of it for the first go, and she may not really be interested in going to the range to shoot other stuff.

Have her over, figure out what she has, teach her a little about it, go to dinner... then you can gauge if a range trip is in order for the future.


The idea of having her shoot other things with less recoil would be to see if she might be interested in switching HD weapons. I have since learned that her ex husband has been an ex for around 40 years and I don't believe she has fired any guns at all. So in addition to other concerns, the shotgun is apparently very old and likely not well maintained. As I mentioned, this lady is a friend of my wife, so I would be happy to even give her a reasonably priced HD weapon that might be more appropriate. Revolvers are simple to operate, so the learning curve is easy.


But is she interested in HD weapons? Or has she had this shotgun laying around for 40 yrs and it makes her nervous? I guess that is what I am missing from this story.


Sorry, I should have been more clear. I am getting all this second hand from my wife, but my understanding is that the lady is concerned about crime in her neighborhood and wants to know how to use the shotgun that her ex-husband left her. I am taking this as a concern for her safety first and foremost, with the shotgun being a means to that end.

I will get a better understanding after I talk with her on Saturday.
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JustSomeOldGuy
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Re: Recoil sensitive shotgun advice needed

Postby JustSomeOldGuy » Thu Sep 14, 2017 4:24 pm

Odds are that whatever her husband left her is unsuitable for someone of her size. The best choice would be something gas operated like a Remington 1100 or Benelli M4 and use the lightest suitable loads. And use her husband's shotgun as a wall-hanger.
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Re: Recoil sensitive shotgun advice needed

Postby Soccerdad1995 » Mon Sep 18, 2017 1:53 pm

OK, so here is an update. I met my wife's friend on Saturday and everything went well. But I discovered that my wife's info was about as reliable as my info would be if I told her that a coworker wanted advice on a designer bag purchase. Basically accurate, but a lot of important details were incorrect.

My wife's friend may be 70, but she looked at least 10 years younger. Very fit and definitely not frail. Her shotgun was a Mossberg Maverick 88 that she bought about 18 months ago, so not an old, unmaintained gun left to her by her ex. She also had a Ruger LCR, with laser. In addition to these guns, we also brought my wife's Ruger SP 101 and my Mossberg Shockwave to the range. The Shockwave was just to show her how a light / laser combo works, and NOT for her to shoot (although I couldn't resist firing off a few shells). The SP 101 was to show her the recoil difference based on the weight of a revolver.

Friend had a bad shoulder and insisted on firing her shotgun from the hip. I was surprised that both she and I were able to maintain effective accuracy using this method. It probably helped that the target was only 10 yards out, of course, but that approximates typical HD distances in a normal house. We were able to fire a few rounds of birdshot, which she was very comfortable with. She also insisted on firing some buckshot, and after two rounds decided that she definitely wanted to stick with birdshot.

As for the revolvers, she was OK with the SP 101, but only managed to fire two rounds out of the LCR before deciding that the recoil was too much for her. I am currently exploring a couple options for a heavier / lower recoil revolver for her to consider. She is also thinking about getting something chambered in .22 caliber, which would be great on recoil, at the cost of stopping power.

At dinner, I did my best to answer her questions about the legal use of deadly force if someone was to break into her house. She also asked me about the rules and process for getting her LTC. All in all, it was a very good day. I got to meet a great person and she left with greatly increased confidence, especially after seeing what 5 rounds of birdshot will do to a target (yes, I know her gun will hold 5+1 but we started with an empty chamber).
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Re: Recoil sensitive shotgun advice needed

Postby Lynyrd » Mon Sep 18, 2017 3:16 pm

Soccerdad1995 wrote:OK, so here is an update. I met my wife's friend on Saturday and everything went well. But I discovered that my wife's info was about as reliable as my info would be if I told her that a coworker wanted advice on a designer bag purchase. Basically accurate, but a lot of important details were incorrect.

My wife's friend may be 70, but she looked at least 10 years younger. Very fit and definitely not frail. Her shotgun was a Mossberg Maverick 88 that she bought about 18 months ago, so not an old, unmaintained gun left to her by her ex. She also had a Ruger LCR, with laser. In addition to these guns, we also brought my wife's Ruger SP 101 and my Mossberg Shockwave to the range. The Shockwave was just to show her how a light / laser combo works, and NOT for her to shoot (although I couldn't resist firing off a few shells). The SP 101 was to show her the recoil difference based on the weight of a revolver.

Friend had a bad shoulder and insisted on firing her shotgun from the hip. I was surprised that both she and I were able to maintain effective accuracy using this method. It probably helped that the target was only 10 yards out, of course, but that approximates typical HD distances in a normal house. We were able to fire a few rounds of birdshot, which she was very comfortable with. She also insisted on firing some buckshot, and after two rounds decided that she definitely wanted to stick with birdshot.

As for the revolvers, she was OK with the SP 101, but only managed to fire two rounds out of the LCR before deciding that the recoil was too much for her. I am currently exploring a couple options for a heavier / lower recoil revolver for her to consider. She is also thinking about getting something chambered in .22 caliber, which would be great on recoil, at the cost of stopping power.

At dinner, I did my best to answer her questions about the legal use of deadly force if someone was to break into her house. She also asked me about the rules and process for getting her LTC. All in all, it was a very good day. I got to meet a great person and she left with greatly increased confidence, especially after seeing what 5 rounds of birdshot will do to a target (yes, I know her gun will hold 5+1 but we started with an empty chamber).


Good job! :patriot:
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Re: Recoil sensitive shotgun advice needed

Postby C-dub » Tue Sep 19, 2017 9:14 am

If she's going to stick with birdshot then any information regarding lethal force might be irrelevant. :biggrinjester:
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Soccerdad1995
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Re: Recoil sensitive shotgun advice needed

Postby Soccerdad1995 » Tue Sep 19, 2017 10:04 am

C-dub wrote:If she's going to stick with birdshot then any information regarding lethal force might be irrelevant. :biggrinjester:


At least she isn't planning to use rock salt.
Ding dong, the witch is dead


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