Note to .45 1911 Owners

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Jago668
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Re: Note to .45 1911 Owners

Postby Jago668 » Fri Apr 29, 2016 1:01 pm

Should have threatened to call the ATF. "Yes these gentlemen just sold me this gun without a background check." ATF looks and sure enough there is a .40 missing and in a customers hand with no receipt and no 4473. Far more effective than a lawyer.
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Javier730
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Re: Note to .45 1911 Owners

Postby Javier730 » Fri Apr 29, 2016 1:17 pm

Jago668 wrote:Should have threatened to call the ATF. "Yes these gentlemen just sold me this gun without a background check." ATF looks and sure enough there is a .40 missing and in a customers hand with no receipt and no 4473. Far more effective than a lawyer.

:iagree: Not to mention they had sold him a pistol without giving it to him.
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Re: Note to .45 1911 Owners

Postby Pariah3j » Fri Apr 29, 2016 1:23 pm

The Annoyed Man wrote:One time I actually did load a few rounds of .40 into a .45 magazine, but discovered the error after having loaded 2-3 rounds and never tried to fire it.

I was at Bass Pro Shop in Grapevine one time about 7 or 8 years ago and witnessed the following: there was a guy sitting on a bench next to the sales counter at the BPS gun range, and he was plenty PO'd. It seems that he had purchased a 9mm Glock and a box of 9mm ammo for it and then took it into the range to shoot it. The problem was that he purchased a 9mm (said so on the receipt), but the sales clerk handed him a boxed .40 cal. I don't know if BPS had mistakenly put a .40 in a 9mm box at some point, or if the clerk had simply handed him the wrong boxed gun, but it ended up with him trying to shoot 9mm ammo in a .40 cal gun. The gun actually did fire the 9mm round, but the case was all belled out, just like the one on the left below:
Image

The customer rightfully demanded that they give him the correct 9mm pistol, but sales clerk tried to deny responsibility for the incorrect sale and said they couldn't take the gun back because it had been fired. The customer rightfully demanded to see the store manager. The manager arrived, and HE started to try and evade responsibility and refuse to take the fired gun back in exchange for the correct gun. That's when the customer got out his cellphone and said "fine, hang on a minute here and I'll just call my lawyer" ......which appeared to be the magic words. All of a sudden the manager allowed that the store was responsible, and they brought the guy a correct 9mm gun and he went on his way.


Funny - when working retail we were told those were the magic words to ask the customer to leave the premises as we were done dealing with them. We would speak to their legal counsel from there on out.

As I see it, in retail you have 2 types of managers - those who will capitulate to any demand, even outrageous ones... And those who will go down fighting for just about anything if they have policy to back them up. There isn't much middle ground.


(edited to add emphasis on the part of the quote I was responding to)
"When governments fear the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny" - Thomas Jefferson

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Re: Note to .45 1911 Owners

Postby Flightmare » Fri Apr 29, 2016 1:29 pm

Javier730 wrote:
Jago668 wrote:Should have threatened to call the ATF. "Yes these gentlemen just sold me this gun without a background check." ATF looks and sure enough there is a .40 missing and in a customers hand with no receipt and no 4473. Far more effective than a lawyer.

:iagree: Not to mention they had sold him a pistol without giving it to him.


I think we have 3 crimes committed by the retail establishment.
Fraud: Sold him a 9mm, and gave him a .40
Theft: He did not take possession of the 9mm he gave them money for until he threatened to call his lawyer.
And as Javier730 pointed out, gave him a .40 without a background check for it.
:biggrinjester: "rlol"
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Re: Note to .45 1911 Owners

Postby Pariah3j » Fri Apr 29, 2016 1:43 pm

Flightmare wrote:
Javier730 wrote:
Jago668 wrote:Should have threatened to call the ATF. "Yes these gentlemen just sold me this gun without a background check." ATF looks and sure enough there is a .40 missing and in a customers hand with no receipt and no 4473. Far more effective than a lawyer.

:iagree: Not to mention they had sold him a pistol without giving it to him.


I think we have 3 crimes committed by the retail establishment.
Fraud: Sold him a 9mm, and gave him a .40
Theft: He did not take possession of the 9mm he gave them money for until he threatened to call his lawyer.
And as Javier730 pointed out, gave him a .40 without a background check for it.
:biggrinjester: "rlol"


I bet they did give him a background check for it - the whole paperwork probably reflected the wrong gun, S/N and all.
"When governments fear the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny" - Thomas Jefferson

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Re: Note to .45 1911 Owners

Postby joe817 » Fri Apr 29, 2016 3:05 pm

To all forum members who contributed to this thread, I apologize for the totally uncalled for and rude comment I made last night, which I truly regret. :oops: :tiphat:
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The Annoyed Man
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Re: Note to .45 1911 Owners

Postby The Annoyed Man » Fri Apr 29, 2016 3:20 pm

AndyC wrote:Is it really so hard nowadays to say "Whoops, we messed up"? :roll:

Apparently it is. Nobody is big enough to admit they made a booboo an longer. :roll:
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ScottDLS
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Re: Note to .45 1911 Owners

Postby ScottDLS » Fri Apr 29, 2016 3:24 pm

Flightmare wrote:
Javier730 wrote:
Jago668 wrote:Should have threatened to call the ATF. "Yes these gentlemen just sold me this gun without a background check." ATF looks and sure enough there is a .40 missing and in a customers hand with no receipt and no 4473. Far more effective than a lawyer.

:iagree: Not to mention they had sold him a pistol without giving it to him.


I think we have 3 crimes committed by the retail establishment.
Fraud: Sold him a 9mm, and gave him a .40
Theft: He did not take possession of the 9mm he gave them money for until he threatened to call his lawyer.
And as Javier730 pointed out, gave him a .40 without a background check for it.
:biggrinjester: "rlol"


Would he have justification for deadly force to get his 9mm? :biggrinjester:
4/13/1996 Completed CHL Class, 4/16/1996 Fingerprints, Affidavits, and Application Mailed, 10/4/1996 Received CHL, renewed 1998, 2002, 2006, 2011, 2016...). "ATF... Uhhh...heh...heh....Alcohol, tobacco, and GUNS!! Cool!!!!"

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Re: Note to .45 1911 Owners

Postby Javier730 » Sat Apr 30, 2016 8:08 am

ScottDLS wrote:
Flightmare wrote:
Javier730 wrote:
Jago668 wrote:Should have threatened to call the ATF. "Yes these gentlemen just sold me this gun without a background check." ATF looks and sure enough there is a .40 missing and in a customers hand with no receipt and no 4473. Far more effective than a lawyer.

:iagree: Not to mention they had sold him a pistol without giving it to him.


I think we have 3 crimes committed by the retail establishment.
Fraud: Sold him a 9mm, and gave him a .40
Theft: He did not take possession of the 9mm he gave them money for until he threatened to call his lawyer.
And as Javier730 pointed out, gave him a .40 without a background check for it.
:biggrinjester: "rlol"


Would he have justification for deadly force to get his 9mm? :biggrinjester:

Only if it was nighttime. :biggrinjester:
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― Horace Mann

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LSUTiger
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Re: Note to .45 1911 Owners

Postby LSUTiger » Mon May 02, 2016 4:28 pm

stranger things have happened.........

f9a4d56a302e3af34cd4598f5a1b48e3.jpg
Chance favors the prepared. Making good people helpless doesn't make bad people harmless.
There is no safety in denial. When seconds count the Police are only minutes away.
Sometimes I really wish a lawyer would chime in and clear things up. Do we have any lawyers on this forum?

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LAYGO
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Re: Note to .45 1911 Owners

Postby LAYGO » Mon Aug 08, 2016 6:34 pm

AndyC wrote:Is it really so hard nowadays to say "Whoops, we messed up"? :roll:


Yes. Admitting liability in this litigious society? Mortal sin.
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Re: Note to .45 1911 Owners

Postby jrs_diesel » Mon Aug 08, 2016 6:56 pm

I did the math on this. .45 ACP = 11.43 mm, which is a 21% increase in diameter. Overall length is also 9% longer for the 45 as well (29.69 mm length for 9mm and 32.4mm length for a 45).

I'm still amazed that a 9mm can be fired out of anything chambered for 45. :shock:
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RPBrown
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Re: Note to .45 1911 Owners

Postby RPBrown » Mon Aug 08, 2016 7:10 pm

ScottDLS wrote:My near vision is terrible and I wasn't wearing readers under my goggles...Anyway, that's my story... :shock:


I really wasn't going to question although I had suspected
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Soccerdad1995
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Re: Note to .45 1911 Owners

Postby Soccerdad1995 » Tue Aug 09, 2016 10:08 am

Flightmare wrote:
Javier730 wrote:
Jago668 wrote:Should have threatened to call the ATF. "Yes these gentlemen just sold me this gun without a background check." ATF looks and sure enough there is a .40 missing and in a customers hand with no receipt and no 4473. Far more effective than a lawyer.

:iagree: Not to mention they had sold him a pistol without giving it to him.


I think we have 3 crimes committed by the retail establishment.
Fraud: Sold him a 9mm, and gave him a .40
Theft: He did not take possession of the 9mm he gave them money for until he threatened to call his lawyer.
And as Javier730 pointed out, gave him a .40 without a background check for it.
:biggrinjester: "rlol"


The customer did the store a huge favor by staying there and talking to them. If he had left the premises with a gun for which there was no background check (presuming that the paperwork reflected the 9mm S/N), and without the gun that he had paid for and which was reflected on the paperwork, then I believe the store would have been in far worse shape. Hopefully the manager threw in a gift card or something as a thank you to the customer.
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TreyHouston
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Re: Note to .45 1911 Owners

Postby TreyHouston » Tue Aug 09, 2016 6:42 pm

Agreed, after inventory, all those involved possibly even the GM would be in deep doodo! That would have been a NIGHTMARE! Funny thing is, im sure the manager called him a %^%^* once he left!

FYI, im sure the manager or GM bought the used gun to avoid having to explain this to corporate!
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