300 Blk for self-defense subsonic loads needed

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troglodyte
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300 Blk for self-defense subsonic loads needed

Postby troglodyte » Wed Jul 27, 2016 10:28 am

As not to hijack the other topic.

I have a couple of 300 BLK 9" AR pistol kits w/ KAK flashcans coming (sooner than expected :hurry: ) and now I need to start reloading for them.

A little info so you may get an idea of what kind of loads I'm looking for.

These will be truck/get home guns. These are to supplement our EDC handguns in the event something goes south. On every work day my wife and I go in opposite directions and are about 20 minutes from home for each of us and about 30 minutes from office to office. If I'm out in the country then that time can be greatly increased. Mine will eventually be SBR'd and hopefully suppressed. The wife's will need to stay a pistol as not to violate the 1000' GFZ at her place of employment. Ideally they will be loaded with premium subsonic self-defense loads for the first 20 round mag or two. The loadout will be rounded out with a couple of more 30 round mags with "cheaper" subsonic loads. Subsonic is desired for reduced recoil and, hopefully, reduced noise and concussion. As these may need to be deployed indoors or in a car trying to keep the crack to a minimum is desired. While hearing protection will be at hand, there may not be the time or desire to put them on or there may be others in close proximity. While any round will still be loud, taking the edge off of the blast would still help. Suppressors are desired but will have to wait until the coffers are rejuvenated.

Weg has what appears to be a good subsonic load for the Lehigh ME in the companion topic so that will be one of the first I'll try. With Lehigh bullets coming in at over a $1.50 each I probably won't be loading up many mags with them. Enter the cheaper 220 Sierra Match King that seems to be a standard for subsonics. I can't find any definitive information on how well it will really work in a soft target. Some say it will start tumbling immediately while others say it may take several inches to start tumbling. It seems in all cases there is over-penetration. Twist rates and velocity seem to play a big part but I can't get all the dots to connect to make any real evaluation. I would really like to avoid over-penetration if possible.

First question, Does anyone have any good subsonic loads to share that also includes some comparisons regarding expansion/tumble, noise, penetration, and flash? Anecdotal info is useful, first-hand info is better.

Second, Does anyone know of any expanding subsonic bullets? Lehigh ME, Maker REX, and BlackOutBullets (sold out) are what I have found. The Lehigh is the only one I've found gel tests on. The REX looks promising (and significantly cheaper). Do you have any experience with any?

Another thing I like about the 300 Blk is you can run supersonics in them without much ado. I'd also like to load up some coyote supersonics to have on hand. It is easier to find load data on supers but maybe someone here has a favorite or two they would share.

And lastly, any good practice/plinking loads?

After numerous hours of searching the web I don't think I've reached any good conclusions. It seems most sites focus on accuracy, which is important, but say nothing about terminal performance. Most sites that address terminal performance are mostly for supersonics.

If we want to post the load data in the Anyone Reloading .300 Blackout thread i think that would be great. It would help to keep all the info in one place for easy reference.


stroo
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Re: 300 Blk for self-defense subsonic loads needed

Postby stroo » Wed Jul 27, 2016 12:59 pm

Make sure that any subsonic loads will cycle your guns. I have tried a couple of subsonic loads in my 300 BLK AR pistol and I had problems with them reliably cycling.

I have not looked into how to fix it and am anything but an AR expert, but since I will be using supersonic, it isn't a problem for me. Might be for you particularly in a self defense situation.

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AndyC
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Re: 300 Blk for self-defense subsonic loads needed

Postby AndyC » Wed Jul 27, 2016 8:10 pm

troglodyte wrote:I can't find any definitive information on how well it will really work in a soft target. Some say it will start tumbling immediately while others say it may take several inches to start tumbling. It seems in all cases there is over-penetration. Twist rates and velocity seem to play a big part but I can't get all the dots to connect to make any real evaluation. I would really like to avoid over-penetration if possible.

Problem is, those 30-cal HP bullets were specifically-designed:

1. to expand/fragment/deform/tumble etc at supersonic rifle velocities or
2. for accuracy and expansion is a bonus.

At subsonic velocities even those designed to expand won't have the expected level of pressure to do so, so it seems that they'll stay closed and hence penetrate deeper.

Don't know if anyone has yet designed a 30-cal rifle bullet designed to 1. expand at subsonic velocities and 2. conform to the FBI 12-18" range - but that could be a niche market. Me, I'll use my suppressor to save my ears but don't care about the projectiles staying subsonic; I'm after terminal effects, not playing super-secret silent sniper with anyone.
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WTR
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Re: 300 Blk for self-defense subsonic loads needed

Postby WTR » Wed Jul 27, 2016 8:36 pm

One report I read claimed 19 " of penetration and .715" of expansion useing the fore mentioned Lehigh maximum expansion 194 gr bullet at subsonic velocity.


Weg
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Re: 300 Blk for self-defense subsonic loads needed

Postby Weg » Sun Aug 07, 2016 3:42 pm

I've shot a few deer with the Lehigh 194's in Handloads ( all shots around 50 yards, heart/lung), and witnessed another. They definitely expand as advertised at subsonic velocities. 3 out of 4 of the deer we shot, we were able to recover the projectile in the rib cage, or under the skin on the opposite side of entry. One of them exited and we could not find it. None of them ran more than 30 yards or so before dropping. The one thing we did notice was the wounds looked more like the damage a broadhead arrow would do than what a bullet would do ( compared to deer we shot with 30.06's) In other words, there just was not very much tissue damage outside of the path the bullet traveled through the deer.


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Re: 300 Blk for self-defense subsonic loads needed

Postby WTR » Sun Aug 07, 2016 5:02 pm

Aay trouble cycling the action?


Weg
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Re: 300 Blk for self-defense subsonic loads needed

Postby Weg » Sun Aug 07, 2016 5:24 pm

Nope, it's a 16" barrel with a pistol length gas system, never jams or fails to feed.


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