Dealing with Anti's and the dreaded "Canada" argument

[Corona]

Hey all.

Great forum here, and I've been a reader for quite some time now.

Where can I get some statistics (or a list of articles) on incidents in the US where someone with a CHL stopped someone's murdering rampage in a public place?

The latest Illinois college event has spurred some discussion on another message board (not related to CHL) and a canadian member has thrown out the "you need more restrictions like Canada, look at our crime rates" argument to me.

thanks!

[45 4 life]

After I read your post I performed a quick search and found this. It should be interesting to here what your canadian friend says about it.

archive.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2006/1/24/150547.shtml

[anygunanywhere]

Tell the canadian anti-rights individual that for a country that bans weapons they sure do have a lot of bad guys shooting folks.

I am in Edmonton right now. Go to the Globe and Mail", the national propaganda rag and do some searches. Try Toronto, Montreal, Quebec, Edmonton, and Vancouver for searches.

I am very careful about where I go up here. When I was staying in downtown Edmonton a few years back there was a drive-by shooting almost in front of the Hotel McDonald, which is a really nice hotel.

I will take USA anyday over this land of subjects. I bow to no royalty.

Anygunanywhere

[WarHawk-AVG]

89 pages of gun facts Gun Facts should help

And if that doesn't help smacking them repeatedly until they are unconscious with 89 pages of printed facts will make you feel better

[frankie_the_yankee]

Canada has had its share of shooting rampages. Just keep in mind that they have only one tenth of our population (approximately) so the absolute number will be fewer.

Ask your Canadian friends to explain their much higher (than ours) rate of "hot" burglaries - burglaries committed while the residents are home. IIRC, it's similar to that of the UK - about 4 or 5 times higher than ours, mainly because in America a burglar breaking into an occuppied home is at a great risk of getting shot.

Sure, their homicide rate is lower than ours. But IIRC, our homicide rate for homicides committed with weapons other than guns is higher than their total rate (including all types of weapons). For a lot of reasons, our society is simply more violent than theirs (though their rates are climbing and they are slowly catching up with us).

Then ask them if they think it is really a better world where the weak are at the mercy of the strong.

Mao said, "Power flows from the barrel of a gun." He was right.

I don't blame Canadians for being jealous. They are living right next door to the greatest country in the history of the planet.

God Bless America, and God Bless Texas!

[BambooShoots]

Everytime someone says something as asinine as "I don't believe in guns," I reply "You mean you don't think they exist?"

Their way of thinking makes as much sense as saying "I don't believe in gravel."

[KBCraig]

I despise racism, so I hesitate to post anything that suggests otherwise, but I recall seeing a statistical analysis a few years ago that when you compare demographic to demographic, all rates of crime are almost equal in both countries.

That means instead of comparing the total population of the U.S. to the total population of Canada (even on a per/100,000 basis), if you compare rural whites to rural whites, urban blacks to urban blacks, immigrants from South/Central America to immigrants from South/Central America, etc., etc., the rates are almost identical.

Canada also has a different philosophy about drug prohibition; while I don't want to stir up the legalization debate again, it's undeniable that a great deal of violent crime is because of drug prohibition. (You see darn few drive-by shootings between owners of competing tobacco shacks or convenience stores.)

[mgood]

You see darn few drive-by shootings between owners of competing tobacco shacks or convenience stores.

[Stupid]

As a Canadian, I have had the luxury experiencing both gun laws. I feel American gun law is too loose while the Canadian law is too strict. However, the American law is too loose on criminals while the Canadian law is too strict on decent citizens - guns become almost non-existing in large cities.

You must also understand Canada is a very socialized and liberal country where refugees get more monthly pay from the government than its citizens. Liberal is not bad and I used to be an liberal, but when everybody stops to be responsible for his/her own action, it's not liberal, it's madness.

You must understand, crime rate does not have much to do with good gun law. What I would call a good gun is that giving automatic life sentence for:
1. any felony committed with any type of firearm
2. any felon caught carrying any type of firearm or ammo

It's late. i don't know what i am saying.

[Stupid]

OK, if you want to talk about crime rate, don't look at "gun" related crime. Look at violent crime as a whole - rape, murder, robbery, gang etc. Also look at how many crimes are committed by recidivists.

If you really want to off crime, (1) longer sentence for any violent crime, (2) life sentence for any crime committed with a firearm and for any repeated offenders, (3) hold those parole board responsible if they release someone who commits another crime, and (4) actually create a channel for criminals to work inside and outside of prison.

[frankie_the_yankee]

I despise racism, so I hesitate to post anything that suggests otherwise, but I recall seeing a statistical analysis a few years ago that when you compare demographic to demographic, all rates of crime are almost equal in both countries.

I believe you're right about this.

[Zero_G]

[shootthesheet]

England doesn't count multiple murders or multiple crimes that occur at the same time. It is counted as one crime. Is Canada the same way. I know much of their law reflects English law and it may be that they have a much higher rate of so called "gun crime" than we do per 100,000 but it isn't reflected because the crime is counted as only the worst crime committed and to only one victim. And I don't think they count any crime until a conviction has been made in England. So, put that together and a clear picture of what is really going on will never be seen. The crime is hidden behind a lack of conviction which may depend on how good a lawyer is or is not.

[Bodacious]

Civillian Gun Self-Defense Blog links to several news stories daily about civilians defending themselvs with a firearm. There are thousands of entries.

[Penn]

And I don't think they count any crime until a conviction has been made in England. So, put that together and a clear picture of what is really going on will never be seen. The crime is hidden behind a lack of conviction which may depend on how good a lawyer is or is not.

I'm not saying you're wrong, I just find that hard to believe. If a serial killer isn't caught, than the murders aren't counted as murders?