Called out in church on my CC

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allisji
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Called out in church on my CC

Postby allisji » Mon Sep 18, 2017 9:00 am

I've been concealed carrying in church now for almost 2 years, and to my knowledge no one has noticed or at least no one has said anything.

The Sr. Pastor knows that I CC every Sunday. The associate Pastor yesterday noticed me while I was sitting down in my pew and saw me "printing". I was carrying my Sig P239 in a Comp-Tac MTac IWB holster with my shirt tucked in. I had black clips over a black belt.

He asked me right then and there before the service was set to begin "Are you packin'?". I was caught off guard and tried to blow it off, but he pressed the issue. "Are you carrying a gun?" So I just said, "Yeah, yes I am." I hadn't really thought about how I would respond if anyone asked me about it, and I wish that I had.

He said that as a Steward of the church that he just wants to know where the guns are just in case or something like that. And then that was that.

I am debating whether or not the next time I see him that I should bring it up again and let him know that I've carried a gun in church every week for nearly 2 years......
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I have contacted my state rep Dennis Paul about co-sponsoring HB560.

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Charles L. Cotton
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Re: Called out in church on my CC

Postby Charles L. Cotton » Mon Sep 18, 2017 9:14 am

allisji wrote:I've been concealed carrying in church now for almost 2 years, and to my knowledge no one has noticed or at least no one has said anything.

The Sr. Pastor knows that I CC every Sunday. The associate Pastor yesterday noticed me while I was sitting down in my pew and saw me "printing". I was carrying my Sig P239 in a Comp-Tac MTac IWB holster with my shirt tucked in. I had black clips over a black belt.

He asked me right then and there before the service was set to begin "Are you packin'?". I was caught off guard and tried to blow it off, but he pressed the issue. "Are you carrying a gun?" So I just said, "Yeah, yes I am." I hadn't really thought about how I would respond if anyone asked me about it, and I wish that I had.

He said that as a Steward of the church that he just wants to know where the guns are just in case or something like that. And then that was that.

I am debating whether or not the next time I see him that I should bring it up again and let him know that I've carried a gun in church every week for nearly 2 years......


I wouldn't say another word about it. He knows you carry a self-defense handgun and is apparently okay with that, if not outright pleased. The issue is closed and I wouldn't re-open it.

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Re: Called out in church on my CC

Postby goose » Mon Sep 18, 2017 9:22 am

allisji wrote:He said that as a Steward of the church that he just wants to know where the guns are just in case or something like that. And then that was that.


Sometimes I can see how folks get put off by a person being a bit of a Barney Fife. I have myself. But other times I am really pleased that folks take some ownership and sense of investment into things that are important to them. By bringing it up for some clarification but then letting it go, I think that this person was leaning to the 'sense of ownership' side. They value their church and the folks in it. Sounds like they value you there. Until further information is given I'd let it be and smile just a smidge bigger when shaking their hand.
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Re: Called out in church on my CC

Postby wally775 » Mon Sep 18, 2017 9:23 am

Charles L. Cotton wrote:
allisji wrote:I've been concealed carrying in church now for almost 2 years, and to my knowledge no one has noticed or at least no one has said anything.

The Sr. Pastor knows that I CC every Sunday. The associate Pastor yesterday noticed me while I was sitting down in my pew and saw me "printing". I was carrying my Sig P239 in a Comp-Tac MTac IWB holster with my shirt tucked in. I had black clips over a black belt.

He asked me right then and there before the service was set to begin "Are you packin'?". I was caught off guard and tried to blow it off, but he pressed the issue. "Are you carrying a gun?" So I just said, "Yeah, yes I am." I hadn't really thought about how I would respond if anyone asked me about it, and I wish that I had.

He said that as a Steward of the church that he just wants to know where the guns are just in case or something like that. And then that was that.

I am debating whether or not the next time I see him that I should bring it up again and let him know that I've carried a gun in church every week for nearly 2 years......


I wouldn't say another word about it. He knows you carry a self-defense handgun and is apparently okay with that, if not outright pleased. The issue is closed and I wouldn't re-open it.

Chas.


:iagree:


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Re: Called out in church on my CC

Postby flechero » Mon Sep 18, 2017 9:26 am

I agree with Charles- if you bring it back up it will likely come off as defensive.

Next time you see him- his reaction should tell you a lot about his feelings. If he makes nervous comments about it or is studying your belt, you'll know he is uncomfortable.

If he's cool with it, you could always invite him to the range. :fire


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Re: Called out in church on my CC

Postby Soccerdad1995 » Mon Sep 18, 2017 9:39 am

Am I the only one surprised that the pastor managed to spot signs of such a small gun in an IWB holster? Even with the exposed black clips on black belt, that was very observant of him. If he isn't a LEO or former LEO, then I would suspect that he also carries. Very few non-gun people are that observant.
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Re: Called out in church on my CC

Postby allisji » Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:03 am

Soccerdad1995 wrote:Am I the only one surprised that the pastor managed to spot signs of such a small gun in an IWB holster? Even with the exposed black clips on black belt, that was very observant of him. If he isn't a LEO or former LEO, then I would suspect that he also carries. Very few non-gun people are that observant.


I am certain that he is not and never has been an LEO. He may be LTC, that I'm not certain of, but I hadn't ever really suspected it.

I'm pretty sure that he saw the grip of the weapon while I was bending over to sit down. Also I had on a well-fitted solid color dress shirt. I usually wear a looser fit shirt with a pattern and often leave it untucked. But I had work this particular shirt several times before.
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Re: Called out in church on my CC

Postby NotRPB » Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:05 am

Soccerdad1995 wrote:Am I the only one surprised that the pastor managed to spot signs of such a small gun in an IWB holster? Even with the exposed black clips on black belt, that was very observant of him. If he isn't a LEO or former LEO, then I would suspect that he also carries. Very few non-gun people are that observant.


Crossbreed clips may be obvious to a person who looks for them, I know of no "non-gun" people who would notice.
I used to wear either Velcro or I prefer J-clip or C-Clip clips which go under a belt instead of on top of it so most "gun people" or LEOs don't notice clips.

My church is a small one. Most in the congregation know where the "gun carriers" (both male & female) sit who aren't standing up front. Perhaps he was just asking to know what areas he should cover if you got your section covered, he can watch the others ... but as Charles said ... let sleeping dogs sleep.
Last edited by NotRPB on Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:08 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Called out in church on my CC

Postby allisji » Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:06 am

Charles L. Cotton wrote:
allisji wrote:I've been concealed carrying in church now for almost 2 years, and to my knowledge no one has noticed or at least no one has said anything.

The Sr. Pastor knows that I CC every Sunday. The associate Pastor yesterday noticed me while I was sitting down in my pew and saw me "printing". I was carrying my Sig P239 in a Comp-Tac MTac IWB holster with my shirt tucked in. I had black clips over a black belt.

He asked me right then and there before the service was set to begin "Are you packin'?". I was caught off guard and tried to blow it off, but he pressed the issue. "Are you carrying a gun?" So I just said, "Yeah, yes I am." I hadn't really thought about how I would respond if anyone asked me about it, and I wish that I had.

He said that as a Steward of the church that he just wants to know where the guns are just in case or something like that. And then that was that.

I am debating whether or not the next time I see him that I should bring it up again and let him know that I've carried a gun in church every week for nearly 2 years......


I wouldn't say another word about it. He knows you carry a self-defense handgun and is apparently okay with that, if not outright pleased. The issue is closed and I wouldn't re-open it.

Chas.


This is probably the tact that I will take. The way that he had asked me about it kinda frustrated me. I wish that he had waited to ask until after service or maybe in a more private setting. He was asking relatively quietly, but there were other people around who may have overheard.
LTC since 2015
I have contacted my state rep Dennis Paul about co-sponsoring HB560.


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Re: Called out in church on my CC

Postby flechero » Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:20 am

allisji wrote: I wish that he had waited to ask until after service or maybe in a more private setting. He was asking relatively quietly, but there were other people around who may have overheard.


I wondered about that in the original post. A general lack of tact may be part of the reason why he's not a head pastor somewhere.


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Re: Called out in church on my CC

Postby Abraham » Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:32 am

No one is required to answer such a personal question.

Without sounding pugnacious or in any way unkind, if I'm ever put on the spot like you were, I'd very politely answer that I'd be willing to discuss it in private...given this person's church position, I wouldn't want to sound rude to him, but many of us like to keep our gun carrying something quite confidential.

That said, if a complete stranger were to ask me if I'm packing (while concealed), I'd smile and say nothing...I'm not, nor is anyone else required to provide an answer to this question.

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Re: Called out in church on my CC

Postby C-dub » Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:41 am

Remember, we are good, honest, law abiding people. We are also supposed to be calm(ish), level-headed, and know about de-escalation. While not being attacked in the OP's situation, he was being challenged, albetit non-threatening. We must also be ready for this type of confrontation and handle it with tact and diplomacy. Just as we contemplate how will might or can react to a direct attack or someone stalking us to determine if we are suitable prey we must also be prepared for this type of "sneak" confrontation. IMHO, this sort of confrontation is less predictable and is more likely to catch us off guard. Think of your response ahead of time, as I am doing now. I haven't considered this type of situation for so long for a few different reasons.

In a calm non-challenging tone, one might respond with a few different questions.
1. Why do you ask?
2. I'm sorry, excuse me?
3. Can we talk about this later? (if the current setting would not be the ideal time or place)

Tone can make a huge difference as I'm sure ya'll are aware. When higher ups at work are questioning me about certain types of things or I get the vibe that they're on a fishing expedition I try not to let on that I know as much as I do. This works very well with one of the women I work with when she gets all riled up about Trump or anything gun and more recently, knife related. She's a gigantic liberal, but still a very nice person :roll: and knows that I'm conservative. Anyway, answering her questions without letting on how much I know about the gun laws and why gets interesting sometimes. As intelligent as she is and thinks she is, I still don't think she has any idea that I have and LTC and carry out in PUBLIC. :shock:

Anyway, these are just a few of my thoughts and things that I'm going to have to work on myself and be more prepared for if and when it happens to me. Hopefully they may also be food for thought for ya'll.
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Re: Called out in church on my CC

Postby couzin » Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:43 am

I am an Elder for our church and I know each parishioner that carries. The topic of carrying in church came up in a session meeting long ago after the General Assembly released a policy statement regarding guns in the churches (in brief, don't!). The discussion at our church session level went toward whether or not to permit or discourage concealed carry. Since two members already knew I was always armed I announced that indeed I was one of several people that carried during service. I did not identify anyone else. The whole issue was put to bed when I said they have no need to fear me or my weapon, nor anyone else carrying on church, that should there be an event, we would rise up to protect everyone in the sanctuary and building (sheepdog speech). Sooo... thank you General Assembly, but this is Texas and we will go our own way on this one.
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Re: Called out in church on my CC

Postby parabelum » Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:49 am

As said above, I would not press the issue.

By the way, you are under no obligation to disclose whether you "have a gun on" or not in situation as this. That was utterly tactless for him to ask like that. In my paranoid mind, I would now consider whether he wants to do something nefarious and is looking for headcount of those who may resist. But that's me.
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Re: Called out in church on my CC

Postby RogueUSMC » Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:49 am

I host an instructor at the church for a LTC class usually in the Spring and in the Fall. Most folks know I carry (but I am certain a few of them think I carry every where else besides church...just not IN church. As I usually say, "others' ignorance is usually my bliss.")

The church staff have been supportive in regards to the classes as well as most of them participating. We lost a few members over the gun issue when we first started doing it. Nowadays, those that were here then are the ones that are ok with it...the rest are folks that have joined us since and are probably unaware...

As for the ones who lack tact or just don't think things through properly, we have a couple...lol. Our church has been reported by one of these people to Texas3006.com as a 30.07 location using the 'signage not valid' tag even though there are no signs whatsoever...lol.
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