If Const. Carry passes, a signage question

[Papa_Tiger]

I'm still not quite wrapping my head around the implications of HB 1927. Can anyone help clarify:

1. Does this mean that an LTC holder would be prohibited from carrying in an establishment with legal 30.06/30.07 signage, but someone with no license would be allowed to carry there?

2. Is there an equivalent sign giving legal notice for prohibiting people without an LTC from entering a building with a handgun?


I hope that constitutional carry would not lead to a situation where someone with a license could carry in fewer places than someone without. Also it would be undesirable for businesses to start posting 30.06 signs if that was what they thought they had to do to prohibit unlicensed people from carrying. I thought open carry was handled pretty well by creating a separate sign, would hope the same would be done here.

Answering question 2 first - In the current amended version of HB 1927 there is no legally defined sign for preventing unlicensed handgun carriers from entering a building.

To answer question 2: In my opinion (which is worth what you have paid for it), based off of the legal definition of notification required for trespass provided in TPC 30.05 which includes:

a sign or signs posted on the property or at the entrance to the building, reasonably likely to come to the attention of intruders, indicating that entry is forbidden;

As well as the Dan Morales AG opinion prior to the creation of the 30.06 statute, I believe that many of the most commonly used 30.06/7 signs with a gun-buster logo would serve as a trigger for criminal trespass charges. Additionally, in many respects it will be much easier to prohibit unlicensed carry as any "Weapons Prohibited" sign likely to come to the attention of intruders could also serve as notice. Now keep in mind that much like for LTC holders and 30.06/7, any trespass violation will be a class C misdemeanor with a fine not to exceed $200 unless they are asked to depart and then do not. If they promptly depart, they have a defense to prosecution.

In practice, there will likely be very few places that an unlicensed person could carry that a licensed person could not.

[txmatt]

Answering question 2 first - In the current amended version of HB 1927 there is no legally defined sign for preventing unlicensed handgun carriers from entering a building.

To answer question 2: In my opinion (which is worth what you have paid for it), based off of the legal definition of notification required for trespass provided in TPC 30.05 which includes:

a sign or signs posted on the property or at the entrance to the building, reasonably likely to come to the attention of intruders, indicating that entry is forbidden;

As well as the Dan Morales AG opinion prior to the creation of the 30.06 statute, I believe that many of the most commonly used 30.06/7 signs with a gun-buster logo would serve as a trigger for criminal trespass charges. Additionally, in many respects it will be much easier to prohibit unlicensed carry as any "Weapons Prohibited" sign likely to come to the attention of intruders could also serve as notice. Now keep in mind that much like for LTC holders and 30.06/7, any trespass violation will be a class C misdemeanor with a fine not to exceed $200 unless they are asked to depart and then do not. If they promptly depart, they have a defense to prosecution.

In practice, there will likely be very few places that an unlicensed person could carry that a licensed person could not.

Thank you for the reply, this does make a lot of sense.

Based on what you are saying any business that has a 30.06/30.07 sign but no generic "gun busters" or the like would be legal for an unlicensed individual but not for a LTC holder. I have no idea how many of those are out there. I guess it would just be an even stronger statement of "We really don't want your business".

Who knows, maybe it would be a net positive if word got out that putting up a gun buster sign had legal meaning for people carrying without an LTC and places might not bother with a compliant 30.06 sign.

[LDB415]

30.06, 30.07. 14.29, 53.71, 29.29, and BR549. Way too many numbers and way too many rules and way too many exceptions for this that and the other. The good thing about concealed is that unless there are metal detectors or bad guys force usage nobody knows nuthin' and you don't have to worry about alphanumeric soup.