Search found 4 matches

by 2firfun50
Mon Jun 03, 2013 11:04 am
Forum: 2013 Texas Legislative Session
Topic: SB299 to Governor
Replies: 61
Views: 12556

Re: SB299 to Governor

jerry_r60 wrote:
Lucky wrote:Is a holstered handgun considered displayed or do you have to put hands on it to count as use of force? Does it matter if the person wearing the holster is a bank guard at the bank or a landowner on their property?
I've seen what i think is a good answer to the oposit of this question but talking about this same topic. The question there is what is concealed. What looks like good answers to this question revolve around, "concealed means concealed". It's not covered by your clothing, a towl, something.

With that in mind, if the holster is of a type that you can see the gun, then i'd say it's not concealed and therefore it has been displayed. If the holster was of a fashion that you could not see the gun or tell that it was a holster, that's a different story but I don't think that's what you asked about. So, IMHO if i can see the gun, it's been displayed.

So post SB299, we are allowed to carry concealed unless the use of force has been justified, in which case we may display.
I tend to agree with this line of thought. 411.171 is not changing and still defines concealed as
"“Concealed handgun” means a handgun, the presence of which is not openly discernible to the ordinary observation of a reasonable person.
So once the presence becomes openly discernable, you are displaying. Accidental is not a crime, but intentional is unless use of force or threat of force is justified under 9.04.

I'm concerned that some will try and take advantage of this by using intentially inadequate concealment such as not buttoning their cover garment, or a shirt that is known to be too short and allowing the intential flashing of the gun or bottom of an obvious holster.

This is not "open carry Lite". :rules:
by 2firfun50
Fri May 10, 2013 11:46 am
Forum: 2013 Texas Legislative Session
Topic: SB299 to Governor
Replies: 61
Views: 12556

Re: SB299 to Governor

2firfun50 wrote:
CJD wrote:Possibly, but to me, it seems that if you are intentionally not concealing, then you are purposefully showing it, which seems like display to me. If you intentionally do not conceal, your intent is for it to be visible.
I understand failing to conceal, my problem is with the word intentionally.
In my little brain, we are required to "carry concealed", so we must have left the house with the proper "intention" and dress to be concealed. If we did not, then we "intentionally" displayed. When the wind blows the cover garment open inadvertently "displaying", no crime has been committed as we did not "intentionally" display. We can restore concealment and go about our business.

If we are in a situation where force, or possibly deadly force is addresses in the statute, and we "intentionally" display to deal with the situation, no crime has been committed as we're justified.

Unless I get better direction, that is how I will address it to my students.

Just my opinion, and no, I won't volunteer to be a test case.
CJD, please don't take my post the wrong way. I'm agreeing with you.
by 2firfun50
Fri May 10, 2013 11:44 am
Forum: 2013 Texas Legislative Session
Topic: SB299 to Governor
Replies: 61
Views: 12556

Re: SB299 to Governor

CJD wrote:Possibly, but to me, it seems that if you are intentionally not concealing, then you are purposefully showing it, which seems like display to me. If you intentionally do not conceal, your intent is for it to be visible.
I understand failing to conceal, my problem is with the word intentionally.
In my little brain, we are required to "carry concealed", so we must have left the house with the proper "intention" and dress to be concealed. If we did not, then we "intentionally" displayed. When the wind blows the cover garment open inadvertently "displaying", no crime has been committed as we did not "intentionally" display. We can restore concealment and go about our business.

If we are in a situation where force, or possibly deadly force is addresses in the statute, and we "intentionally" display to deal with the situation, no crime has been committed as we're justified.

Unless I get better direction, that is how I will address it to my students.

Just my opinion, and no, I won't volunteer to be a test case.
by 2firfun50
Fri May 10, 2013 9:52 am
Forum: 2013 Texas Legislative Session
Topic: SB299 to Governor
Replies: 61
Views: 12556

Re: SB299 to Governor

Fancy holsters/grips may not fare well when exposed to a hot grill or BBQ sauce.

Return to “SB299 to Governor”