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gemini wrote:maybe out of two highly trained officers only one felt the need to fire even though
both were approaching the suspect, seeing the same "perceived" threat or not.

It is kind of funny you mention this. When I was in teh Army, the MPs always patrolled in two man cars. One of the things we were taught in MP school was that if there is a shooting, and only one of the officers shoot, then there will always be the question of whether one officer used too much force or if the other officer was derelict in his duty to shoot. That was in 1975 and the times and legal attitudes were way different from now.

But, in 1991, I was involved in a shooting as an SAPD officer. I was facing down an armed robber who had fired his weapon at the robbery seen and had challenged another officer to a draw contest before running off again. I was facing him head on across a parking lot and he had his pistol in his hand by his ear when I stopped him. A second officer pulled into the parking lot at a 90 degree angle to me and the suspect (the suspect's left side). I was yelling at the suspect to drop the gun and it seemed like a long time. Just as he started to lower the gun, my partner fired at him. I also fired and then my partner fired a second time. His first bullet hit the suspect in the left side and went through the lungs. I remember telling the department psychologist that I did not remember deciding to fire and one of the thoughts that wen through my mind was that he shot so I should (training comes back under stress).

It was only the next day when we were talking about the shooting that my partner told me he saw that the suspect was bringing the gun down to shoot. The autopsy confirmed this. When I was facing the suspect at the beginning of the scene, his left arm was hanging down and his right hand was by his ear with the gun. I focused tightly on the gun (as most will under stress). But the bullet did not go through the arm, just through the side under where his arm was. That means he was bringing his left hand up from his side as his right hand was coming down. This meant he was moving to a shooting position.

Two experienced and trained officers saw two different things based on their focus at the time. I focused on the threat to me and he focused on the suspect as a threat to his partner. The psychologist says I must have seen the movement also but not consciously recognized it as a threat since i did fire. He pointed out that I did not have time to think anything during the shootings since I fired in between my partners two shots. To this day, I cannot say I saw his left arm move though.

Among several other lessons from this incident, I learned that it really is very reasonable for two officers to see the same event and see two different things. This is true for all witnesses, not just officers. Point of view and stress levels do make a difference.

This is one of those cases where the video cannot give you enough information to make a reasonable decision on justification. What was the officer told and what did he think before the shooting occurred? He must have been told something because officers do not just go stop people or start yelling at them at random, especially not after passing a couple other people. That indicates to me that the officer was given some information from someone about this individual or someone like him where the description matches. The officer's mindest and knowledge or belief AT THE TIME are critical do deciding on whether or not he was justified, even if he was wrong in his knowledge.

Also be careful of comments made by people publishing the video if they were not the original person involved. For example, in this video, it says the officer was desperately looking for evidence of a weapon when he searched the body, implying the officer knew he was wrong. But that is an assumption because he doesn't know what the officer was really doing or why, and these type of comments bias the public.

Having said all that, I am very concerned about shootings where the officer pulls the trigger too quickly. I know that there is absolutely no reason the officer should wait for the other guy to shoot first, but I would like them to wait a little longer to make sure they have the right person and the right information. The rest of this is almost standard procedure (cuffing and searching the person who was shot).