Church shooting in Tarrant County - White Settlement

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C-dub
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Re: Church shooting in Tarrant County - White Settlement

#106

Post by C-dub » Wed Jan 01, 2020 5:00 pm

Charles L. Cotton wrote:
Wed Jan 01, 2020 2:26 pm
KC5AV wrote:
Wed Jan 01, 2020 2:19 pm
Has anyone seen calculations on how far Wilson's shot was?
I read that Wilson said it was about 10 yds, but it looked more like 12 to 15 yds. The angle of the camera makes it hard to estimate.

Chas.
I think you may be correct. That pew arrangement is the same as in our church. The lengths might be different, but I would guess that his distance might be closer to 15 yards or even another yard or two.
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Lena
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Re: Church shooting in Tarrant County - White Settlement

#107

Post by Lena » Wed Jan 01, 2020 5:43 pm

I read 20 but did not look like that
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Re: Church shooting in Tarrant County - White Settlement

#108

Post by troglodyte » Wed Jan 01, 2020 10:10 pm

I found another image of the auditorium from the position the pastor was sitting in (second pew from front). Using people on the back wall for a scale it looks to be 40-45'ish. There is still some perspective to deal with but I think the 15 yard mark is pretty close.

[url][/ur(l]
Photo by Bobby Ross Jr. found @ ChristianChronicle.com

I have an acquaintance at WFCC and I can ask him. It may come out before I get word back from him.

He was in the auditorium during the attack so I want to respect his healing and his energy as he helps the congregation heal.
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Re: Church shooting in Tarrant County - White Settlement

#109

Post by baseballguy2001 » Thu Jan 02, 2020 1:10 am

Just a couple of points - 1) - Yes, the former LEO did a terrific job, no doubt. If you haven't seen the video, it was quite a long shot. Not difficult, but it was no gimme either. The bad guy had a not very good disguise on, and the Church security already had their eye on him. 2) - This is absolutely not an insult, but I think the first armed security guy made a fatal mistake. He had sort of an awkward draw, it was a delayed draw if you will. My instructors have always taught me, the threshold to draw is extremely high, but if you have to, draw and shoot. Don't go for your weapon to scare anybody, don't draw to try and intimidate them because you could wind up dead. That, is what happened. He stood up with his arm behind him, sending all the signals to the bad guy - "I'm drawing my weapon now" then the bad guy shot him. The good guy is a hero, it appeared to me he and the LEO were drawing at the same time, had he followed thru, or had he drawn his weapon and fired while he was seated, he might still be with us. Years ago I confronted an invader one day when I was working from home. He didn't think anyone was here and I had my 870 on him before he had time to get to his pistol. The point is, train, practice, and then practice more.
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Re: Church shooting in Tarrant County - White Settlement

#110

Post by philip964 » Thu Jan 02, 2020 1:37 pm

https://news.yahoo.com/armed-even-churc ... 07681.html

Gun grabbers at USA Today not happy about this church shooting.


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Re: Church shooting in Tarrant County - White Settlement

#111

Post by jb2012 » Thu Jan 02, 2020 1:42 pm

This story is only proof that this battle will never be won with some folks. This is proof, gun control is not about saving lives.

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Re: Church shooting in Tarrant County - White Settlement

#112

Post by WildBill » Thu Jan 02, 2020 2:01 pm

jb2012 wrote:
Thu Jan 02, 2020 1:42 pm
This story is only proof that this battle will never be won with some folks. This is proof, gun control is not about saving lives.
Some people refuse to allow facts to alter their beliefs or their actions.
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Re: Church shooting in Tarrant County - White Settlement

#113

Post by crazy2medic » Thu Jan 02, 2020 3:08 pm

WildBill wrote:
Thu Jan 02, 2020 2:01 pm
jb2012 wrote:
Thu Jan 02, 2020 1:42 pm
This story is only proof that this battle will never be won with some folks. This is proof, gun control is not about saving lives.
Some people refuse to allow facts to alter their beliefs or their actions.
Gun Control is not about guns, it's about control! You represent a freedom and independence, they despise that! They will never be happy until you are subjugated and totally depend on the Government!
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Re: Church shooting in Tarrant County - White Settlement

#114

Post by carlson1 » Thu Jan 02, 2020 4:22 pm

crazy2medic wrote:
Thu Jan 02, 2020 3:08 pm
WildBill wrote:
Thu Jan 02, 2020 2:01 pm
jb2012 wrote:
Thu Jan 02, 2020 1:42 pm
This story is only proof that this battle will never be won with some folks. This is proof, gun control is not about saving lives.
Some people refuse to allow facts to alter their beliefs or their actions.
Gun Control is not about guns, it's about control! You represent a freedom and independence, they despise that! They will never be happy until you are subjugated and totally depend on the Government!
:iagree: 100% correct.
... We know firearms are readily available to anyone who wants one, really. And that’s part of the problem. Sunday’s shooting isn’t just about Jack Wilson’s heroism. It’s about how Kinnunen got a hold of a weapon in the first place, given his criminal record.
They answered their own question. The shooter/criminal got a firearm because criminals do not obey LAWS so what is the point of more gun CONTROL laws? Because they want to just CONTROL.
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Re: Church shooting in Tarrant County - White Settlement

#115

Post by OldCurlyWolf » Thu Jan 02, 2020 6:12 pm

Charles L. Cotton wrote:
Wed Jan 01, 2020 2:26 pm
KC5AV wrote:
Wed Jan 01, 2020 2:19 pm
Has anyone seen calculations on how far Wilson's shot was?
I read that Wilson said it was about 10 yds, but it looked more like 12 to 15 yds. The angle of the camera makes it hard to estimate.

Chas.
My initial estimate was 40-50 feet. 13-17 yards
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Lena
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Re: Church shooting in Tarrant County - White Settlement

#116

Post by Lena » Thu Jan 02, 2020 7:00 pm

Blue line said 60' 20 yds, oddly a week ago at our last match we had 2 20 yd headshots, nothing new there.
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Re: Church shooting in Tarrant County - White Settlement

#117

Post by Paladin » Thu Jan 02, 2020 9:45 pm

baseballguy2001 wrote:
Thu Jan 02, 2020 1:10 am
Just a couple of points - 1) - Yes, the former LEO did a terrific job, no doubt. If you haven't seen the video, it was quite a long shot. Not difficult, but it was no gimme either. The bad guy had a not very good disguise on, and the Church security already had their eye on him. 2) - This is absolutely not an insult, but I think the first armed security guy made a fatal mistake. He had sort of an awkward draw, it was a delayed draw if you will. My instructors have always taught me, the threshold to draw is extremely high, but if you have to, draw and shoot. Don't go for your weapon to scare anybody, don't draw to try and intimidate them because you could wind up dead. That, is what happened. He stood up with his arm behind him, sending all the signals to the bad guy - "I'm drawing my weapon now" then the bad guy shot him. The good guy is a hero, it appeared to me he and the LEO were drawing at the same time, had he followed thru, or had he drawn his weapon and fired while he was seated, he might still be with us. Years ago I confronted an invader one day when I was working from home. He didn't think anyone was here and I had my 870 on him before he had time to get to his pistol. The point is, train, practice, and then practice more.
:iagree:
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Charles L. Cotton
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Re: Church shooting in Tarrant County - White Settlement

#118

Post by Charles L. Cotton » Thu Jan 02, 2020 10:39 pm

Lena wrote:
Thu Jan 02, 2020 7:00 pm
Blue line said 60' 20 yds, oddly a week ago at our last match we had 2 20 yd headshots, nothing new there.
I agree that a 20 yd head shot against a stationary target in a match is no big deal. Twenty yards against a moving target under extreme stress is an entirely different matter.

Chas.

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Lena
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Re: Church shooting in Tarrant County - White Settlement

#119

Post by Lena » Thu Jan 02, 2020 11:07 pm

Charles totally agree there and yes I did slow down and get a perfect sight picture on both I admit, I have a feeling our next match will have several 20 yd ones.
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Re: Church shooting in Tarrant County - White Settlement

#120

Post by Rob72 » Fri Jan 03, 2020 9:33 am

philip964 wrote:
Wed Jan 01, 2020 4:14 pm


So he could not legally buy a gun. Where did he get the shotgun? Why was he not in a mental institution for his and the public's good? New Jersey? Oklahoma? Mental illness is generally not something you can be cured of.
I believe it was under Peanut Farmer Carter, in the 70s, that Fed assistance to State Mental Health facilities was stopped, again, as they were considered, "inhumane". The State Oklahoma facility is in Norman (Griffin Memorial), with only (IIRC) 3 of the 12 or so buildings still in use.
https://www.google.com/maps/uv?hl=en&pb ... CnoECA0QBg

As of 2013, they were operating under the "non-interventional" therapy model, in which the patients will not be directed/restrained/coerced, i.e., they do not have to take meds, assaults on staff are frequent, and sexual "events" are a daily event(e.g., it can't be called "rape" because the staff cannot "make judgments" about behaviors, unless at least one individual has family and a court order stating that such activity would be harmful/detrimental). This is fairly typical, from what I have seen in two other States, as well.

He got the shotty the same way every other drug dealer/pimp/armed robber gets them.

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