A reminder why we need the 2nd amendment:

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rickb308
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#16

Post by rickb308 »

gigag04 wrote:
txinvestigator wrote: a) move without confronting anyone with a gun
b) die after confronting the govt with a gun.

Sounds like a stupid battle to me. I don't believe for 1 second you would pull a gun, but I DO understand your aversion to this.

As responsible gun owners we should refrain from lunatical comments about "the wrong side of our guns".[/quote]

Surely 200 something yrs ago there too was a voice:

would you rather?

a.)go ahead and pay a tax without proper representation

OR

b.)die after confronting the (british) governement.

I'm glad they choose to ingore that voice.

You can say you wouldn't "bet for one second", but I bet you won't be first in line to come and be a test case to call my bluff either.
[/quote]

He wouldn't be the 5th or 100th. He also has a problem with the 1st Amendment.

"As responsible gun owners we should refrain from lunatical comments about "the wrong side of our guns".

Or, at least, anyone excersizing it other than him.

We are all going to die someday. Beats laying in a nursing home bed in your soiled Depends.

There are two sets of 10 Commandments.
1st - Biblical. 2nd - Constitutional.

The first 10 Amendments of the Constitution are/were supposed to be inviolate.

They have raped the 4th with the US Patriot Act. Now they have raped the 5th. How long until your precious 2nd goes down the porcelin fixture?

Go ahead, stick your head back in the sand. All is well. They're from the government and they're here to help. Tune back in to "Desperate Housewives".

You sound like the duck hunters and the pistol shooters during the debate before the AWB. "Why should I care, doesn't affect me. I don't own an AW".

As true today as they were 230 years ago.

"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." - Ben Franklin

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
-- Thomas Jefferson

´´...Sir, we are not weak, if we make a proper use of the means which the God of nature hath placed in our power. Three millions of people, armed in the Holy cause of Liberty, and in such a country as that which we posses, are invincible by any force which our enemy can send against us. Besides, sir, we shall not fight our battle alone. There is a just God who presides over the destinies of nations; and who will raise up friends to fight our battle for us. The battle, sir, is not to the strong alone; it is to the vigilant, the active, the brave... Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!´´
--Patrick Henry

Patrick Henry [3 J. Elliot, Debates in the Several State Conventions 45, 2d ed. Philadelphia, 1836]:
"Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect everyone who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are inevitably ruined."

"The spirit of the times may alter, will alter. Our rulers will become corrupt, our people careless. A single zealot may commence persecutor, and better men be his victims. It can never be too often repeated that the time for fixing every essential right on a legal basis is while our rulers are honest and ourselves united. From the conclusion of [their] war [for independence, a nation begins] going down hill. It will not then be necessary to resort every moment to the people for support. They will be forgotten, therefore, and their rights disregarded. They will forget themselves but in the sole faculty of making money, and will never think of uniting to effect a due respect for their rights. The shackles, therefore, which shall not be knocked off at the conclusion of [that] war will remain on [them] long, will be made heavier and heavier, till [their] rights shall revive or expire in a convulsion." --Thomas Jefferson: Notes on Virginia Q.XVII, 1782. (*) ME 2:225
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#17

Post by BobCat »

The relevance to the Second Amendment is simply that, by attacking the Fifth, the Court has gone farther down the road of making the entire Bill of Rights a dead letter.

This is not to say anything about my personal intent to "take arms against a sea of troubles, and, by opposing, end them" or not to do so. If Hamlet was conflicted, I suppose those of us who are similarly conflicted are in good company.

Look at the Bill of Rights and see which ones are still in force, and which have been severely constrained or negated, and then tell me we have no need to watch out for the future.

Regards,
Andrew
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The Third

#18

Post by tomneal »

The Third amendment is the only one where all of seem to be in agreement.
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rickb308
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Re: The Third

#19

Post by rickb308 »

tomneal wrote:The Third amendment is the only one where all of seem to be in agreement.
Amendment III

No Soldier shall, in time of peace be quartered in any house, without the consent of the Owner, nor in time of war, but in a manner prescribed by law.

With base closures, that's coming. :(
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#20

Post by onerifle »

For those that care to read the actual text of the opinion:

http://a257.g.akamaitech.net/7/257/2422 ... 04-108.pdf
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#21

Post by Paladin »

Looks like one local government isn't wasting any time:

http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mp ... an/3239024
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#22

Post by txinvestigator »

gigag04 wrote:
txinvestigator wrote: a) move without confronting anyone with a gun
b) die after confronting the govt with a gun.

Sounds like a stupid battle to me. I don't believe for 1 second you would pull a gun, but I DO understand your aversion to this.

As responsible gun owners we should refrain from lunatical comments about "the wrong side of our guns".
Surely 200 something yrs ago there too was a voice:

would you rather?

a.)go ahead and pay a tax without proper representation

OR

b.)die after confronting the (british) governement.



I'm glad they choose to ingore that voice.

You can say you wouldn't "bet for one second", but I bet you won't be first in line to come and be a test case to call my bluff either.
If you truly believe that we are again at those times, then I just don't know what to say. Except I feel badly for you.

txinvestigator
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#23

Post by txinvestigator »

rickb308 wrote:
He wouldn't be the 5th or 100th. He also has a problem with the 1st Amendment.

"As responsible gun owners we should refrain from lunatical comments about "the wrong side of our guns".

Or, at least, anyone excersizing it other than him.
If that is directerd at ME, you are foolish. You have no idea of my feelings on the 1st, nor of whom I believe it applies. :roll:

The 1st applies to the GOVERNMENT, not other people telling you that your words have consequences, that you should choose your words wisely and speak responsibly.

While he has a right to say whatever he wishes, it DOES fuel the fires of those who would disarm us when we make statements about resisting court orders with illegal acts using firearms.

Just because we disagree does not mean I am wrong, or that you should attack me and my beliefs. Its seems the pot caling the kettle black, sir.

I NEVER said imminent domain was not a concern to us all (nice of you to make assumptions and statements that are untrue to foster your argument).

You believe I sound like hunters not worried about the AWB, I say you sound like some right-wing, fanatical militia member sitting around watching Red-Dawn and imagining being there. :roll:

txinvestigator
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#24

Post by txinvestigator »

BobCat wrote:The relevance to the Second Amendment is simply that, by attacking the Fifth, the Court has gone farther down the road of making the entire Bill of Rights a dead letter.

This is not to say anything about my personal intent to "take arms against a sea of troubles, and, by opposing, end them" or not to do so. If Hamlet was conflicted, I suppose those of us who are similarly conflicted are in good company.

Look at the Bill of Rights and see which ones are still in force, and which have been severely constrained or negated, and then tell me we have no need to watch out for the future.

Regards,
Andrew
Agreed 100%

txinvestigator
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#25

Post by txinvestigator »

rickb308 wrote:
txinvestigator wrote:First of all, they PAY you fair market value for yout home. But the bottom line is if they go through the legal motions you WILL move out.
You think so? Ask the people losing their homes to the new Dallas Cowboys stadium. They are not even paying appraised values.
Been in the news.

Appraised = what I am taxed at = fair market value.

Me asking 10 15,000 more? May be fair, may not be. But appraised, taxable value IS fair market value.

Now, in light of the US Stupid court, they DON'T have to even offer "fair" market value. The can get the city council to claim emminent domain.

Investment tip: Buy hemp rope.

Because when it comes time to start hanging the SOB's, it'll be in short
supply.
DO you have a link to that info? The last I heard was they WERE being paid FMV?????
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gigag04
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#26

Post by gigag04 »

txinvestigator wrote: If you truly believe that we are again at those times, then I just don't know what to say. Except I feel badly for you.
I shall respectfully close with this:

My family has apporoximately 150 acres with 3 generations living on it. My mom and my uncle and aunt each have newly built homes out there. My grandparents just moved back as their "final move" so that we can help take care of them (granted I'm at school). My younger cousins still live out there...its OUR place. We bbq, have pool parties, ride our horses, bail hay etc.

If someone were to come out there and try and take that land so some yuppie developer could put a resort there, you can bet everything you own that I would be ready to fight, legally and physically, in a new york minute.

The 2A provides protection, even from our own gov't. We can disagree, and you can think I'm some war hungry, trash talking youth, and that's fine. I'm actually finishing and engineering degree and plan to be a constructive member of society. I will however ask that you refrain from pitying me because of how I feel.

respectfully,

Nick
Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work. - Thomas Edison
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gigag04
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#27

Post by gigag04 »

txinvestigator wrote: If you truly believe that we are again at those times, then I just don't know what to say. Except I feel badly for you.
I shall respectfully close with this:

My family has apporoximately 150 acres with 3 generations living on it. My mom and my uncle and aunt each have newly built homes out there. My grandparents just moved back as their "final move" so that we can help take care of them (granted I'm at school). My younger cousins still live out there...its OUR place. We bbq, have pool parties, ride our horses, bail hay etc.

If someone were to come out there and try and take that land so some yuppie developer could put a resort there, you can bet everything you own that I would be ready to fight, legally and physically, in a new york minute.

The 2A provides protection, even from our own gov't. We can disagree, and you can think I'm some war hungry, trash talking youth, and that's fine. I'm actually finishing and engineering degree and plan to be a constructive member of society. I will however ask that you refrain from pitying me because of how I feel.

respectfully,

Nick
Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work. - Thomas Edison
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Paladin
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#28

Post by Paladin »

Looks like some Texas lawmakers are fighting for the American way:

http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mpl/front/3239023
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Paladin
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#29

Post by Paladin »

Locate your representative's here:

http://www.capitol.state.tx.us/fyi/fyi.htm

I am sending emails to my representatives now.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

example:

"Please act to defend property rights

I am strongly opposed to the U.S. Supreme Court's ruling that local governments may seize land for private development.

It is un-American and unjust.

I strongly support a state constitutional amendment limiting local powers of eminent domain at the earliest opportunity.

Thank you,"
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gigag04
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#30

Post by gigag04 »

Paladin - thanks for the info!

-nick
Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work. - Thomas Edison
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