Gun 'mistakes' in Books, TV, and Movies - feel free to post your own

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Re: Gun 'mistakes' in Books, TV, and Movies - feel free to post your own

#91

Post by Ruark » Sun Dec 11, 2016 11:27 am

Abraham wrote:I just finished a novel describing a Marline 30-30 Winchester and not once, but about 3 times, arrrggghhh.
Weeellllllll........ the CALIBER is 30-30 Winchester. So it was actually correct.......... :woohoo
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Re: Gun 'mistakes' in Books, TV, and Movies - feel free to post your own

#92

Post by Dadtodabone » Sun Dec 11, 2016 3:17 pm

Ruark wrote:
Abraham wrote:I just finished a novel describing a Marline 30-30 Winchester and not once, but about 3 times, arrrggghhh.
Weeellllllll........ the CALIBER is 30-30 Winchester. So it was actually correct.......... :woohoo
Let's quibble.
The Winchester cartridge was designated, as chambered for the Winchester Model 1894, .30 Winchester Center Fire or .30 WCF. When the cartridge was chambered in the Marlin Model 1893 rifle, Marlin used the designation .30-30 or .30-30 Smokeless. The added -30 stands for the standard load of 30 grains of smokeless powder. The Marlin designation is in accord with late-19th century American naming conventions. UMC (Union Metallic Cartridge Co.) also dropped the Winchester designation, as they did not want to put the name of a rival on their products.

The modern designation of .30-30 Winchester was arrived at by using Marlin's cartridge designation with the Winchester name appended. This designation also probably helped to avoid consumer confusion with the similarly shaped .30-40 Krag, which has been referred to as ".30 US" and ".30 Army".

So, arguably, Marlin products are chambered in .30-30, while Winchester and knock offs are chambered in .30 WCF or .30-30 Winchester.
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Re: Gun 'mistakes' in Books, TV, and Movies - feel free to post your own

#93

Post by G26ster » Sun Dec 11, 2016 4:00 pm

Let's just face it. Producers and directors are not making scenes for firearms expert review. They are making scenes that the public "expects" to see and be exciting. As an example, nearly every war movie/TV show, with few exceptions, shows every single explosion with a fireball. Well that ain't real, but it's visually exciting. Unless there's a secondary explosion of a flammable object, no fireball. So it's not always an error on the part of the maker, it's what excites and captures the attention of the audience. The guy flying across the room from a pistol shot is far more visually exciting than a drop.

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Re: Gun 'mistakes' in Books, TV, and Movies - feel free to post your own

#94

Post by puma guy » Tue Dec 13, 2016 7:06 pm

I'm posting about one that not a mistake, which is an anomaly this day and age. I have never watched Tim Allen's newest TV show, but it when I came home today my wife and daughter who was visiting were watching a marathon of the show "Last Man Standing" . I really wasn't paying attention to an episode about a grizzly bear supposedly shot by Teddy Roosevelt. A "snowflake" was weaseling his way into Tim's daughter's life so he could find a way to protest and act out against the killing of the bear. In the end he's caught red handed vandalizing Tim's store and as punishment Tim makes him dress like Teddy and give a dissertation about our 26th President. The young man is standing in front of the mounted bear holding a Winchester 1895, which was Teddy's favorite rifle. :thumbs2: Kudos to the prop master or maybe even Tim Allen!
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Re: Gun 'mistakes' in Books, TV, and Movies - feel free to post your own

#95

Post by WTR » Fri Dec 16, 2016 2:22 am

I'm not very concerned about mistakes made by fiction writers or Hollywood screen writers. However, I happen to come across the 90s program LAPD Life on the Beat. This program apparently shadowed LA Officers on patrol. In the one episode I watched I was alarmed at the number of Officers who placed their finger inside the trigger guard when training their weapon( in all instances). (Not a majority of Officers, but too many to say the least). Also a Patrolman, a Sgt. and a Lt. all referred to 7.62x39 casings as AK 47 casings ( an AK 47 is the only weapon that shoots that apparently), and .40 cal casings as 40mm casings. I would have expected better from professionals.

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Re: Gun 'mistakes' in Books, TV, and Movies - feel free to post your own

#96

Post by K5CLC » Fri Dec 16, 2016 8:59 am

I made it through this entire thread without the movie WANTED being mentioned. If it was, i missed it. Color me surprised!
But as far as movie mistakes, it has to be this movie. The idea that you can train yourself to curve the trajectory of a bullet around walls, cars, people, like a billiard trick shot..in mid air. If Jerry Miculek hasn't done it (and if anyone could, HE could) then it's just good movie watching. :shock: :roll: :lol:

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Re: Gun 'mistakes' in Books, TV, and Movies - feel free to post your own

#97

Post by Jusme » Fri Dec 16, 2016 9:08 am

WTR wrote:I'm not very concerned about mistakes made by fiction writers or Hollywood screen writers. However, I happen to come across the 90s program LAPD Life on the Beat. This program apparently shadowed LA Officers on patrol. In the one episode I watched I was alarmed at the number of Officers who placed their finger inside the trigger guard when training their weapon( in all instances). (Not a majority of Officers, but too many to say the least). Also a Patrolman, a Sgt. and a Lt. all referred to 7.62x39 casings as AK 47 casings ( an AK 47 is the only weapon that shoots that apparently), and .40 cal casings as 40mm casings. I would have expected better from professionals.

You would be surprised at the number of police officers who never handled a gun until their firearms training in the academy. I saw this first hand. I can imagine in an urban area like LA the numbers are probably higher. I don't know if it has changed but we only had one week of firearms training in the academy, and no further training was required after that, only a biannual qualification.
That's one of the arguments I use for gun grabbers who say the police are the only ones trained enough to carry guns. I did obtain additional training on my own, and practice more now than I did when I was a LEO.
So police officers not being well versed on safety, or terminology is not all that surprising. JMHO
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Re: Gun 'mistakes' in Books, TV, and Movies - feel free to post your own

#98

Post by The Annoyed Man » Fri Dec 16, 2016 11:10 am

I'm sure this has been covered before, but I can't count the number of times I smirked every time Raylan Givens or one of his partners drew his Glock and it made all kinds of clicking noises. :lol:
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Re: Gun 'mistakes' in Books, TV, and Movies - feel free to post your own

#99

Post by JRG » Tue Dec 20, 2016 2:03 am

Catherine Hygle in One For the Money plays a bail bond jumper hunter named Stephanie Plum. She's practicing with her S&W j-frame revolver at the range. She fires 12 shots before hitting the click click click. ha.

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Re: Gun 'mistakes' in Books, TV, and Movies - feel free to post your own

#100

Post by Skiprr » Tue Dec 20, 2016 7:36 am

If I had the time necessary (because there seem to be bizarre gun errors every few minutes, it would take a while) and could stomach watching it again, I'd DVR the pilot episode of the new TV series Shooter, based on the movie of the same name. Which in turn was based on a Stephen Hunter novel...and Hunter is either fuming mad, or shrugging in resignation as he takes his check to the bank. Hunter has admitted he's less a handgun guy, but the knowledge and research shown in his books about rifles is solid.

Not so with this TV series (produced, BTW, by Mark Wahlberg). Now, I can forego some gaffs sometime if it doesn't glaringly break the fictive suspension of disbelief, but if it's a show or movie or book where firearms are so prominent as to be almost a principle character? Mistakes there and the writer, producer, and director should be, well...avoided.

This one starts with Bob Lee Swagger out in the woods with a tranquilizer gun rather than his rifle--a sure sign from the get-go that this was going to PC retelling of the book, if it paralleled the book at all--when he comes across two "hunters" that Bloomberg would consider prototypical: chugging beer, ready to shoot at anything, and completely ignorant about their firearms.

But then, this version of Bob Lee Swagger ain't much more informed than the hunters. He says, "What you got there?" then grabs what looks to be a scoped Remington 700 with cammo furniture away from hunter #1. He asks the guy, "Are you a dentist?" "Orthodontist," he responds. How, or especially why, Swagger seems to be psychic is left unanswered.

Swagger opens the bolt, ejects the round, and catches it in the air. "Two-two-three Remington," he says, holding the round in front of the hunters' noses, a round that dose not look like a .223, either that or the actor is only about 5'3". "55 grain," he says (again, some at-a-glance psychic capability is at least inferred because he doesn't even look at the bullet). "You guys have no idea what I'm talking about, do you? The kid at Wal-Mart who sold you this should have told you. This bullet isn't powerful enough to take anything bigger than a squirrel."

Ignoring that bullets have no power factor at all, just weight, mass, composition, and shape, it will come as a distinct surprise to millions of military veterans and civilian shooters alike that a .223 is useful only against game or threats weighing less than 1.5 pounds. That was my first audible groan when I watched this show. There were many, many others.

Oh, and hunter #2, again with Bloomberg stereotypicality, responds to Swagger's misinformed ballistics lesson by holding up a chrome Beretta 92FS and waggles the 9mm pistol at him. "How about this one? Think it has enough stopping power for ya?" Swagger removes the bolt from the Remington 700 before handing it back to hunter #1. The next, of course, comes the obligatory how-bad-am-I hand-to-hand where Swagger disarms the hunters...then pops them both with a round from the tranq gun and walks away, leaving them sedated and alone in a forest populated with wolves.

After leaving the orthodontist and his buddy for wolf chow, Swagger returns to a loving family scene with his wife and daughter at what has to be a pricey piece of property on a hill next to Puget Sound. He goes to a standalone structure below the main house, his work- and reloading-room and gun "safe." Plain wooden door with a deadbolt, windows overlooking at least two sides--including by the door--with no curtains or blinds. High-end rifles are openly on display, just hanging on the walls. He does have lockers for some weapons, including multiple handguns; these lockers are open-grate-front, cabinet affairs.

Rule #1: The best way to secure your dozens of firearms and accessories is to place them where they are easily visible through a window and secured by nothing that one smack of a framing hammer can't get through.

Rule #2: If you live right by an open body of salt water, never ever try to keep your guns in any kind of sealed container. Constant high humidity and salt air are the best friends your firearms can have. Keep them exposed to those conditions and they'll last you several lifetimes.

Then the setup recruitment briefing by the fed. A tablet PC goes onto the reloading bench and photos are displayed. "Shot by a sniper. We found the hide. Fourteen-hundred yards away."

Swagger's eyebrows rise. "Dang; 1,400 yards." He scrolls through photos to a close-up. "That doesn't look like a 50-cal."

"Three thirty-eight based on the slug." [Note to self: evidently a tiny shotgun slug, smaller than a .410, can serve as a sniper round from long distances. Who knew?"]

Swagger thinks out loud. "Okay. So, 3/4 mile shot through the woods... Boy's a shooter. Only a handful of shooters in the world can take a headshot from 3/4 of a mile away."

In a flashback to Afghanistan, we see Chechen sniper Salatov kill Swagger's spotter with a round through the chest. "He was dead before he fell," says Swagger. Which, of course, contradicts the show's little opening scene which talks about three ways to die from a gunshot, that a headshot is the only "killshot." But never mind. By now we know beyond a shadow of a doubt that Swagger has no clue about his supposed area of expertise.

The sniper, Slatov, uses a .338 Lapua Magnum. The feds provide Swagger with what they believe is an exact duplicate of Salatov's "highly customized SABER-FORSST." Swagger is visibly impressed by such a top-end, exotic firearm.

The problem? The SABER-FORSST is a modular stock; it isn't a firearm at all.

Swagger receives the rifle completely assembled and scope mounted (suitable background music ensues). The first thing he does after pulling it from the case is shoulder it with his finger on the trigger.

The second thing he does is put it a mount/vise and take a Tru-Value crescent wrench to the bolts anchoring the rings to the Picatinny rail. It's obvious he is fine-tuning this precision optic because he looks through the scope multiple times, inserts a laser boresighter, and goes back to cranking on the Picatinny attachment bolts with his crescent wrench, supposedly getting the scope honed in before the first live fire.

Now I know what I've been doing wrong. Thanks to this font of knowledge, I'm giving away my scope-ring lapping rods and precision torque wrenches and Wheeler leveling set. I'm buying a cheap crescent wrench and randomly and alternately tightening and loosening the Picatinny rail attachment bolts--undoubtedly scratching the receiver, barrel, and body of the scope along the way--until I get a precise, super-sniper zero. :roll:

Best-of-the-best sniper Bob Lee Swagger then goes into his local gun store. "I'm trying out a new rifle, Henry. You got any three thirty-eight Lapua Magnum?"

"Sure we do."

"I need some powder and some three thirty-eight bullets, too."

So take whatever commercial rounds your local gun store has in stock. It matters not what they are. And here's the big lesson to all you reloaders. You have been completely wrong, this whole time, to worry about bullet weight and composition and shape. Just buy the right caliber bullet. And it doesn't make any difference what kind of powder you use, either: gunpowder is gunpowder. Silly people.

Last tidbit, then I can't take it any more. And, no: I never watched another episode of Shooter.

Bob Lee takes his new, highly modified SABER-FORSST complete with screwed-up Picatinny mounts and crescent wrench scratches all over it to a river to sight it in live-fire.

I now really, really want a .338 Lapua Magnum. I've always known they had impressive ballistics. But, wow; add to that they have absolutely zero recoil? I mean, not on a sled or in a vise, just on a rest, and you can balance a shot-glass full of water on the barrel and never spill a drop. Less recoil than a rubber-band gun. Just, wow! (And we're barely halfway through the first episode at this point.)

Oh, and if you want to take one-mile shots, all you need is what seems to be a very basic Bushnell reticle in mils. You don't need no fancy reticles with superfine holdover markings. And you guys thought you had to spend more than $250 on a scope. Pshaw. After all, if it isn't necessary, why would you want a $3,000 scope if, to get it truly right, you were going to scratch it up with your $3 crescent wrench, anyway?
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Re: Gun 'mistakes' in Books, TV, and Movies - feel free to post your own

#101

Post by Jusme » Tue Dec 20, 2016 8:07 am

Skiprr wrote:If I had the time necessary (because there seem to be bizarre gun errors every few minutes, it would take a while) and could stomach watching it again, I'd DVR the pilot episode of the new TV series Shooter, based on the movie of the same name. Which in turn was based on a Stephen Hunter novel...and Hunter is either fuming mad, or shrugging in resignation as he takes his check to the bank. Hunter has admitted he's less a handgun guy, but the knowledge and research shown in his books about rifles is solid.

Not so with this TV series (produced, BTW, by Mark Wahlberg). Now, I can forego some gaffs sometime if it doesn't glaringly break the fictive suspension of disbelief, but if it's a show or movie or book where firearms are so prominent as to be almost a principle character? Mistakes there and the writer, producer, and director should be, well...avoided.

This one starts with Bob Lee Swagger out in the woods with a tranquilizer gun rather than his rifle--a sure sign from the get-go that this was going to PC retelling of the book, if it paralleled the book at all--when he comes across two "hunters" that Bloomberg would consider prototypical: chugging beer, ready to shoot at anything, and completely ignorant about their firearms.

But then, this version of Bob Lee Swagger ain't much more informed than the hunters. He says, "What you got there?" then grabs what looks to be a scoped Remington 700 with cammo furniture away from hunter #1. He asks the guy, "Are you a dentist?" "Orthodontist," he responds. How, or especially why, Swagger seems to be psychic is left unanswered.

Swagger opens the bolt, ejects the round, and catches it in the air. "Two-two-three Remington," he says, holding the round in front of the hunters' noses, a round that dose not look like a .223, either that or the actor is only about 5'3". "55 grain," he says (again, some at-a-glance psychic capability is at least inferred because he doesn't even look at the bullet). "You guys have no idea what I'm talking about, do you? The kid at Wal-Mart who sold you this should have told you. This bullet isn't powerful enough to take anything bigger than a squirrel."

Ignoring that bullets have no power factor at all, just weight, mass, composition, and shape, it will come as a distinct surprise to millions of military veterans and civilian shooters alike that a .223 is useful only against game or threats weighing less than 1.5 pounds. That was my first audible groan when I watched this show. There were many, many others.

Oh, and hunter #2, again with Bloomberg stereotypicality, responds to Swagger's misinformed ballistics lesson by holding up a chrome Beretta 92FS and waggles the 9mm pistol at him. "How about this one? Think it has enough stopping power for ya?" Swagger removes the bolt from the Remington 700 before handing it back to hunter #1. The next, of course, comes the obligatory how-bad-am-I hand-to-hand where Swagger disarms the hunters...then pops them both with a round from the tranq gun and walks away, leaving them sedated and alone in a forest populated with wolves.

After leaving the orthodontist and his buddy for wolf chow, Swagger returns to a loving family scene with his wife and daughter at what has to be a pricey piece of property on a hill next to Puget Sound. He goes to a standalone structure below the main house, his work- and reloading-room and gun "safe." Plain wooden door with a deadbolt, windows overlooking at least two sides--including by the door--with no curtains or blinds. High-end rifles are openly on display, just hanging on the walls. He does have lockers for some weapons, including multiple handguns; these lockers are open-grate-front, cabinet affairs.

Rule #1: The best way to secure your dozens of firearms and accessories is to place them where they are easily visible through a window and secured by nothing that one smack of a framing hammer can't get through.

Rule #2: If you live right by an open body of salt water, never ever try to keep your guns in any kind of sealed container. Constant high humidity and salt air are the best friends your firearms can have. Keep them exposed to those conditions and they'll last you several lifetimes.

Then the setup recruitment briefing by the fed. A tablet PC goes onto the reloading bench and photos are displayed. "Shot by a sniper. We found the hide. Fourteen-hundred yards away."

Swagger's eyebrows rise. "Dang; 1,400 yards." He scrolls through photos to a close-up. "That doesn't look like a 50-cal."

"Three thirty-eight based on the slug." [Note to self: evidently a tiny shotgun slug, smaller than a .410, can serve as a sniper round from long distances. Who knew?"]

Swagger thinks out loud. "Okay. So, 3/4 mile shot through the woods... Boy's a shooter. Only a handful of shooters in the world can take a headshot from 3/4 of a mile away."

In a flashback to Afghanistan, we see Chechen sniper Salatov kill Swagger's spotter with a round through the chest. "He was dead before he fell," says Swagger. Which, of course, contradicts the show's little opening scene which talks about three ways to die from a gunshot, that a headshot is the only "killshot." But never mind. By now we know beyond a shadow of a doubt that Swagger has no clue about his supposed area of expertise.

The sniper, Slatov, uses a .338 Lapua Magnum. The feds provide Swagger with what they believe is an exact duplicate of Salatov's "highly customized SABER-FORSST." Swagger is visibly impressed by such a top-end, exotic firearm.

The problem? The SABER-FORSST is a modular stock; it isn't a firearm at all.

Swagger receives the rifle completely assembled and scope mounted (suitable background music ensues). The first thing he does after pulling it from the case is shoulder it with his finger on the trigger.

The second thing he does is put it a mount/vise and take a Tru-Value crescent wrench to the bolts anchoring the rings to the Picatinny rail. It's obvious he is fine-tuning this precision optic because he looks through the scope multiple times, inserts a laser boresighter, and goes back to cranking on the Picatinny attachment bolts with his crescent wrench, supposedly getting the scope honed in before the first live fire.

Now I know what I've been doing wrong. Thanks to this font of knowledge, I'm giving away my scope-ring lapping rods and precision torque wrenches and Wheeler leveling set. I'm buying a cheap crescent wrench and randomly and alternately tightening and loosening the Picatinny rail attachment bolts--undoubtedly scratching the receiver, barrel, and body of the scope along the way--until I get a precise, super-sniper zero. :roll:

Best-of-the-best sniper Bob Lee Swagger then goes into his local gun store. "I'm trying out a new rifle, Henry. You got any three thirty-eight Lapua Magnum?"

"Sure we do."

"I need some powder and some three thirty-eight bullets, too."

So take whatever commercial rounds your local gun store has in stock. It matters not what they are. And here's the big lesson to all you reloaders. You have been completely wrong, this whole time, to worry about bullet weight and composition and shape. Just buy the right caliber bullet. And it doesn't make any difference what kind of powder you use, either: gunpowder is gunpowder. Silly people.

Last tidbit, then I can't take it any more. And, no: I never watched another episode of Shooter.

Bob Lee takes his new, highly modified SABER-FORSST complete with screwed-up Picatinny mounts and crescent wrench scratches all over it to a river to sight it in live-fire.

I now really, really want a .338 Lapua Magnum. I've always known they had impressive ballistics. But, wow; add to that they have absolutely zero recoil? I mean, not on a sled or in a vise, just on a rest, and you can balance a shot-glass full of water on the barrel and never spill a drop. Less recoil than a rubber-band gun. Just, wow! (And we're barely halfway through the first episode at this point.)

Oh, and if you want to take one-mile shots, all you need is what seems to be a very basic Bushnell reticle in mils. You don't need no fancy reticles with superfine holdover markings. And you guys thought you had to spend more than $250 on a scope. Pshaw. After all, if it isn't necessary, why would you want a $3,000 scope if, to get it truly right, you were going to scratch it up with your $3 crescent wrench, anyway?

I know better than to try to drink coffee while reading this forum first thing in the morning. It is almost impossible to clean off of my monitor and keyboard.
"rlol"

Thanks for the laugh Skiprr!!!
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Re: Gun 'mistakes' in Books, TV, and Movies - feel free to post your own

#102

Post by vjallen75 » Tue Dec 20, 2016 10:48 am

When I was younger I was fascinated by the game called "Hitman." Basically your a paid assassin and you do various things to "take people out." Yes I know I probably shouldn't have played that game at the age I was in but it was fun and my mom didn't care. I recently watched one of the newer movies that came out, either earlier this year or last. There are so many things wrong with this movie I really don't want to have to watch it again. The one that really sticks out to me is the hitman's choice of handgun, a 1911. Now I've never shot one but it's on my to do list (I'll also accept donations since it's so close to Christmas :biggrinjester: ). I'm still wonder how he cleared a hotel with 20+ floors while only reloading once, granted he had two beautiful 1911s with what I assumed to be the standard 8 round mag (or is it clip). Either way if you want a good laugh it's worth a watch.. while you're sleeping.
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Re: Gun 'mistakes' in Books, TV, and Movies - feel free to post your own

#103

Post by Mxrdad » Tue Dec 20, 2016 11:28 am

K5CLC wrote:I made it through this entire thread without the movie WANTED being mentioned. If it was, i missed it. Color me surprised!
But as far as movie mistakes, it has to be this movie. The idea that you can train yourself to curve the trajectory of a bullet around walls, cars, people, like a billiard trick shot..in mid air. If Jerry Miculek hasn't done it (and if anyone could, HE could) then it's just good movie watching. :shock: :roll: :lol:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lGZQi3ODB-U

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HUH???? This is insane. LOL. Ya know, these kind of movies are very likely the driving force behind the gun ignorance in Hollyweird. I can just imagine the younger folks watching this nonsense and believing that "bullets" can turn corners like this.

I hope I don't ever get a hold of one of these magic bullets!!!
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Re: Gun 'mistakes' in Books, TV, and Movies - feel free to post your own

#104

Post by Pawpaw » Tue Dec 20, 2016 12:25 pm

Mxrdad wrote:
K5CLC wrote:I made it through this entire thread without the movie WANTED being mentioned. If it was, i missed it. Color me surprised!
But as far as movie mistakes, it has to be this movie. The idea that you can train yourself to curve the trajectory of a bullet around walls, cars, people, like a billiard trick shot..in mid air. If Jerry Miculek hasn't done it (and if anyone could, HE could) then it's just good movie watching. :shock: :roll: :lol:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lGZQi3ODB-U

Chris
HUH???? This is insane. LOL. Ya know, these kind of movies are very likely the driving force behind the gun ignorance in Hollyweird. I can just imagine the younger folks watching this nonsense and believing that "bullets" can turn corners like this.

I hope I don't ever get a hold of one of these magic bullets!!!
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Re: Gun 'mistakes' in Books, TV, and Movies - feel free to post your own

#105

Post by gregthehand » Tue Dec 20, 2016 2:48 pm

I've seen too many movies to list that make the mistake of showing a view through a scoped rifle and having the sight picture so magnified. I'm talking close enough to see dirt in the bad guys fingernails. Even Shooter did that. It makes people who don't know think sniping must be super easy.

Also movies where people get blown through windows, doors, etc after being shot. That's just a basic fail in physics. If that happened to the person who was shot the recoil would do the same thing to the shooter.
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