40 S&W v. .357 Mag. (Spin-off thread)

[cheezit]

Hopefully this isnt derailing the thread.
The .40 @ 135 gr at 1200 to 1400 fps should preform at the same level as .357 if not better do to starting diameter, or am I wrong.

[Charles L. Cotton]

I split the above-post from the thread "9mm just as effective as .357 Mag. -- NOT!!!!"

135 gr. is light for caliber and the only testing LuckyGunner.com did in this weight was Federal Guard Dog135 gr. JHP at 1,134 fps. It's penetration was only 10.8". That compares to .357 Sig 125 gr. JHP at 1,423 and 15.4" of penetration. That's no comparison.

You aren't going to find any factory loads for 135 gr. 40 S&W at 1,300 fps much less 1,400 fps. Corbon claims to have a 135 gr. load at 1,350 from a 4" barrel, but I'm skeptical. Corbon has a reputation of being "generous" with their velocity figures. Plus, if you are going to use hyper-velocity for a 40 S&W, then we'd need to do likewise with the .357 Mag. where we can get 1,500 with Blackhills 125 gr.

My 9X23 can push a 125 gr. JHP at well over 1,500 fps, but that's not a reasonable comparison.

Paul has a few test videos using the 40 S&W, but I don't think he has any with a 135 gr.

Chas.

[WTR]

I go heavy for caliber in the .40 S&W and .45 ACP.

[MaduroBU]

I prefer .357 Sig, but the question is far more complicated. A firearm is a pressure vessel composed of a chamber and a barrel. The cartridge and loading cannot be considered independently from the barrel length. Heavy bullets with lighter, faster burning powder charges make the most of short barrels while proportionally bullets (vs powder weight, not bore diameter) over slower powder economize longer barrels.

The .40 really shines with a 200 grain bullet, which is just subsonic from a 4" barrel. A .357 mag/Sig can't touch that, but ffom a 5-6" barrel, the .357 Sig 147 grain bullet can reach 1400 FPS or 1625 with a 115 grain copper solid (though not the pointed ones as they're too long). The barrier penetration of these loads leaves the .40 S&W in the dust. Neither of these statements implies that one cartridge is universally best, just differently optimized.

In my Sig X5, I use a Barsto ported barrel in .40 S&W to make major using 135 grain bullets at 1350 FPS. For real world use (not sure what that would be really, so hypothetical), I have a 5.7" threaded 357 Sig barrel for the loads listed above. I thought about a P239 in .40 S&W to add to my P232, and might still try that out.

[cheezit]

I split the above-post from the thread "9mm just as effective as .357 Mag. -- NOT!!!!"

135 gr. is light for caliber and the only testing LuckyGunner.com did in this weight was Federal Guard Dog135 gr. JHP at 1,134 fps. It's penetration was only 10.8". That compares to .357 Sig 125 gr. JHP at 1,423 and 15.4" of penetration. That's no comparison.

You aren't going to find any factory loads for 135 gr. 40 S&W at 1,300 fps much less 1,400 fps. Corbon claims to have a 135 gr. load at 1,350 from a 4" barrel, but I'm skeptical. Corbon has a reputation of being "generous" with their velocity figures. Plus, if you are going to use hyper-velocity for a 40 S&W, then we'd need to do likewise with the .357 Mag. where we can get 1,500 with Blackhills 125 gr.

My 9X23 can push a 125 gr. JHP at well over 1,500 fps, but that's not a reasonable comparison.

Paul has a few test videos using the 40 S&W, but I don't think he has any with a 135 gr.

Chas.

Thank you.

[Charles L. Cotton]

I split the above-post from the thread "9mm just as effective as .357 Mag. -- NOT!!!!"

135 gr. is light for caliber and the only testing LuckyGunner.com did in this weight was Federal Guard Dog135 gr. JHP at 1,134 fps. It's penetration was only 10.8". That compares to .357 Sig 125 gr. JHP at 1,423 and 15.4" of penetration. That's no comparison.

You aren't going to find any factory loads for 135 gr. 40 S&W at 1,300 fps much less 1,400 fps. Corbon claims to have a 135 gr. load at 1,350 from a 4" barrel, but I'm skeptical. Corbon has a reputation of being "generous" with their velocity figures. Plus, if you are going to use hyper-velocity for a 40 S&W, then we'd need to do likewise with the .357 Mag. where we can get 1,500 with Blackhills 125 gr.

My 9X23 can push a 125 gr. JHP at well over 1,500 fps, but that's not a reasonable comparison.

Paul has a few test videos using the 40 S&W, but I don't think he has any with a 135 gr.

Chas.

Thank you.

Paul has a video dealing with the excuses given for several LEO agencies going back to 9mm from 40 S&W. I found it interesting and you may also.

Chas.

[Keith B]

I split the above-post from the thread "9mm just as effective as .357 Mag. -- NOT!!!!"

135 gr. is light for caliber and the only testing LuckyGunner.com did in this weight was Federal Guard Dog135 gr. JHP at 1,134 fps. It's penetration was only 10.8". That compares to .357 Sig 125 gr. JHP at 1,423 and 15.4" of penetration. That's no comparison.

You aren't going to find any factory loads for 135 gr. 40 S&W at 1,300 fps much less 1,400 fps. Corbon claims to have a 135 gr. load at 1,350 from a 4" barrel, but I'm skeptical. Corbon has a reputation of being "generous" with their velocity figures. Plus, if you are going to use hyper-velocity for a 40 S&W, then we'd need to do likewise with the .357 Mag. where we can get 1,500 with Blackhills 125 gr.

My 9X23 can push a 125 gr. JHP at well over 1,500 fps, but that's not a reasonable comparison.

Paul has a few test videos using the 40 S&W, but I don't think he has any with a 135 gr.

Chas.

I agree Corbon is generous with their numbers. I do carry Corbon Pow'RBall 9mm in my 3" Kahr PM9. Corbon boasts a FPS rating of 1475fps and 483ftlbs of energy out of a 4" barrel with a 100 grain bullet. That kinetic energy level is getting close to a standard .357 mag, but not quite there. And, as Paul states, that is just a standard round of .357 without even pushing the capabilities of the round. There are YouTube videos that show this round doesn't perform as well as others.

While I think the Corbon 9mm stats are exagerated, and the performance could be better with some other rounds, the reason I carry this is the nylon ball in the bullet slides easily up the steep feed ramp in my sub-compact gun and seems to work well. Is it the ultimate defense round? No way, but it works well for my set-up and pocket carry.

[flechero]

works well for my set-up

And that's the key!