EDC knife

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The Annoyed Man
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Re: EDC knife

#16

Post by The Annoyed Man » Wed Jan 08, 2020 9:48 am

K-Texas wrote:
Tue Jan 07, 2020 3:03 pm
For those who may not be aware, and I heard about it on Tom Gresham's Gun Talk Radio, Benchmade was caught in-the-act of destroying firearms for Liberal Oregon LE agencies who would not simply sell confiscated firearms back to the shooting public. Then it was found out that they had been contributing to the campaigns of some of Oregon's most liberal politicians. I did not need a replacement for the Bencmade Pica, but I knew it would be my last Benchmade. For more on that go to Gun Talk Media.
That story was blown all out of proportion, and very much out of context. There was a longish thread about it right here on this site, back when it was a fresh story. BTW, the "liberal democrats" Benchmade made donations to were supporting a PRO knife carry bill in the Oregon Legislature, and their donations were in support of that bill......in a Democrat majority state where Benchmade had to deal with the political realities on the ground. The NRA has supported pro-gun democrats in the past for exactly the same reasons. It’s always easy for Gresham to snipe from 1500 miles away when he isn’t possessed of all the facts. Read his take, and then take a minute to read Benchmade's response to the accusations. Then you’ll have a more accurate picture.



Their response to OTH the gun destruction AND the donations is in this video: https://www.full30.com/watch/MDE5NDE3/b ... -the-fight.

All of this is much more nuanced and factual than the flames of outrage stoked by Gresham and others. Gresham provides a valuable service, but he’s human, and like everyone else, he sometimes gets things wrong.
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K-Texas
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Re: EDC knife

#17

Post by K-Texas » Wed Jan 08, 2020 2:57 pm

Sorry, buddy, but after Tom Gresham brought this to light, he had one of the Benchmade execs on the show as a guest. Part of the issue was something about interstate commerce, but in any event, I would expect the story to still be running on Gun Talk Media. Names were named, and there's no doubt that Benchmade was working with renegade LE Agencies like Oregon City who made the decision to destroy firearms, which Benchmade certainly did. I don't doubt that after some time to plan a strategy and develop their spin they came up with a counter-response. The exec whom was on Gun Talk had no time to do so. I will carefully view the info in the link you provided, but I've already looked at some of the responses that followed. The exec that Tom had on his show was Matt Elliott, Director of Marketing for Benchmade. Here's a link to the broadcast when Elliott was tasked with spin-control.

Their history of campaign contributions to liberal Oregon gun control morons is fact. I personally will not abide ANY contibution to Anti-Gun demo-commies. Help get pro gun candidates elected instead.Tom Gresham is not one to advance heresay or inuendo. Since I heard the broadcast, myself, where the Benchmade exec was clearly caught with his pants down, that pretty much does it for me. Too many other good knifemakers like Cold Steel, Spyderco and Buck to consider. ;-)
Last edited by K-Texas on Wed Jan 08, 2020 3:52 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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Re: EDC knife

#18

Post by K-Texas » Wed Jan 08, 2020 3:35 pm

OOO000ooops
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Re: EDC knife

#19

Post by E.Marquez » Thu Jan 09, 2020 11:26 am

My EDC knife is a Benchmade AFO II auto opener, Blade Steel: 154CM (58-61) Handle Material: 6061-T6 Aluminum(Black)
There may in fact be "better" knifes, but for me, as I've carried an AFO (the version before the AFO II) for many years having been issued one a long time ago..this design is well known to my hand and its employment and use requires no thought
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Re: EDC knife

#20

Post by Richbirdhunter » Thu Jan 09, 2020 11:41 am

SpyderCo with Emerson opener
Disclaimer: Anything I state can not be applied to 100% of all situations. Sometimes it's ok to speak in general terms.

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Re: EDC knife

#21

Post by The Annoyed Man » Thu Jan 09, 2020 11:58 am

.... Benchmade was working with renegade LE Agencies like Oregon City who made the decision to destroy firearms....
The Oregon City PD didn’t make that decision. They were court-ordered destructions, which the PD was bound by law to carry out....and that’s the part that "our side" loses track of in this discussion. And frankly, we lose track of it because it’s not convenient to our narrative. We accuse the left, and rightfully so, of this kind of willful dishonesty all the time; but it is no less dishonest when we do it. You can’t maintain the moral high ground if you’re willing to bend your morals to fit a narrative. It should always be the other way around.

I’ll grant that Benchmade had no legal obligation to help the destruction effort. OTH, they had what they viewed as a social and business obligation to maintain a good relationship with their local PD, and to be helpful when asked for it. The PD had no real choice but to destroy those guns ... it was either that, or defy a lawful court order. I am certain that the PD viewed themselves as upholders of the law, and as such, I seriously doubt that they even considered civil disobedience over a relatively small number of firearms.

You are, of course, free to hold different views than mine in the matter. But if so, I would also challenge you to be consistent and divest yourself of any Ruger or Smith & Wesson firearms you might own because of their past actions.....not to mention Colt deciding not to sell AR15s to civilians anymore. I could go on with other examples, but the main point is an expectation of consistency from the side of the gun debate with which I align myself.

Have a great day.
Give me Liberty, or I'll get up and get it myself.—Hookalakah Meshobbab
I don't carry because of the odds, I carry because of the stakes.—The Annoyed Boy
My dream is to have lived my life so well that future generations of leftists will demand my name be removed from buildings.

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Re: EDC knife

#22

Post by Lena » Thu Jan 09, 2020 1:03 pm

Have 2 favorites here both Kershaw assisted opening and the other OTF which lately I find myself carrying more that I ever thought I would, also a fixed blade sheath knife a friend made me in the daily carry, I lost my Benchmade feeding cattle cutting hay string so after that I went to $1 knives for that, sharpen with a file, on my 3rd one now and work fine for the use there. Use and abuse and replace when need be. I use a carried knife a lot every day as a tool here.
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Re: EDC knife

#23

Post by K-Texas » Thu Jan 09, 2020 1:45 pm

The Annoyed Man wrote:
Thu Jan 09, 2020 11:58 am
.... Benchmade was working with renegade LE Agencies like Oregon City who made the decision to destroy firearms....
The Oregon City PD didn’t make that decision. They were court-ordered destructions, which the PD was bound by law to carry out....and that’s the part that "our side" loses track of in this discussion. And frankly, we lose track of it because it’s not convenient to our narrative. We accuse the left, and rightfully so, of this kind of willful dishonesty all the time; but it is no less dishonest when we do it. You can’t maintain the moral high ground if you’re willing to bend your morals to fit a narrative. It should always be the other way around.

I’ll grant that Benchmade had no legal obligation to help the destruction effort. OTH, they had what they viewed as a social and business obligation to maintain a good relationship with their local PD, and to be helpful when asked for it. The PD had no real choice but to destroy those guns ... it was either that, or defy a lawful court order. I am certain that the PD viewed themselves as upholders of the law, and as such, I seriously doubt that they even considered civil disobedience over a relatively small number of firearms.

You are, of course, free to hold different views than mine in the matter. But if so, I would also challenge you to be consistent and divest yourself of any Ruger or Smith & Wesson firearms you might own because of their past actions.....not to mention Colt deciding not to sell AR15s to civilians anymore. I could go on with other examples, but the main point is an expectation of consistency from the side of the gun debate with which I align myself.

Have a great day.
Your first sentence in the second paragraph is interesting.
they had what they viewed as a social and business obligation to maintain a good relationship with their local PD
I think they should have been a bit more cognizant about where their true obligations lay. What did they stand to lose by refusing to chop up the firearms for liberals, be it LE leadership or the liberal Oregon courts. How much did they stand to lose by not accepting that commission? On the other-hand, most firearms owners also own and carry knives. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know which was the greater obligation. It seems rather obvious that Benchmade felt there would be no repercussions for their actions and were more interested in easy money than their true customer base, as well as the fight for 2nd amendment rights.

There were some very interesting comments I've read from Oregon residents themselves. "go along to get along" is nothing more than appeasing a political group who do not believe in the right of self-protection. If they could stop firearms ownership in Oregon altogether, they would. What do you suppose would follow? Knives would not be necessary or essential in utopia either.

Your points about S&W and Ruger are well taken. It was, however, a very different time 23 years ago as far as the national climate being affected by the Assault Weapons Ban. As we know, S&W is and was a publicly traded corporation, and did go through a change in corporate leadership as a result. They did not, however, have any history in making campaign contributions to Anti-Gun politicians. Bill Ruger's statement that magazine capacities over 10 rounds just aren't necessary proved to be a huge embarrassment that did affect their bottom line. Might as well add the NRA who did make campaign contributions to scum like Harry Reid who had a track record of supporting the 2nd amendment until it was evident that his party's political platform went rabid Anti-Gun.

Colt did not decide to stop sales of of AR15s to civilians as a corporate policy. There was an interruption in civilian sales due to Colt fulfilling orders for military contracts. Which they are legally bound to do. And it has been announced that with them meeting those obligations, the civilian market will once again be serviced.

Obviously, I do hold a different view than yours. Particularly in any notion of the term Pro-Gun Democrat being anything but an oxymoron. I provided a link to the broadcast as it aired with Benchmade's Director of Marketing getting a fair opportunity to defend their actions immediately after they occurred. Your philosophical meanderings are a bit confusing. There is no land of neutrality between the nations of Pro-Gun and Anti-Gun in a similar fashion to No-Mans-Land between the opposing, entrenched armies of WWI, The boundaries are unmistakable, and it's very unfortunate that Benchmade ownership couldn't see the forest for the trees. ;-)
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Re: EDC knife

#24

Post by The Annoyed Man » Fri Jan 10, 2020 12:41 am

One correction....
... and were more interested in easy money than their true customer base....
As I understand it, Benchmade did this as a free service, and were not paid for chopping up those guns, so this was not a matter of easy money, as much as it was a matter of poorly thought out civic duty. I absolutely concede that, when they made the decision to cooperate with the PD, they did so without raising their eyes to the horizon to see if it was a smart thing to do or not. But making a dumb decision is not the same as being "anti-gun".

And your previous point is well taken that Benchmade could move to a more weapons-friendly state....although the reality of moving even a small business is that it is hugely expensive to do so. (I helped plan and execute moving a business from California to Texas.) Moving a larger business from one state to another is a bigger undertaking yet, and realistically, it may not be financially feasible for Benchmade to move.

I am a second amendment absolutist, but one of the things I despise most about the left is the whole "cancel culture" thing, which is a phenomenon they created. I refuse to engage in it unless the transgression is so clearly egregious that it would be immoral to respond in any other way. I despise Leonardo DiCaprio's politics, but he makes some pretty good movies; and I’m not going to deny myself some decent entertainment just because the lead actor is wrong on the issues in his personal life. I thought it was kind of silly when people set fire to perfectly good Yeti coffee mugs and ice chests because of Yeti's kerfuffle with the NRA. Sure, don’t buy more Yeti products if they made you angry. But while burning perfectly good Yeti products you’ve already bought and paid for because you’re mad at Yeti is certainly within your rights as the owner of the property, it’s also a classic example of cutting off your nose to spite your face.

Like I said, you’re certainly entitled to your opinions, and to act on them as you see fit. I’m just nowhere near as worked up about Benchmade as you are, I’m OK with owning the ones I have, and if I see another one that I like and can afford, I might buy another.
Give me Liberty, or I'll get up and get it myself.—Hookalakah Meshobbab
I don't carry because of the odds, I carry because of the stakes.—The Annoyed Boy
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Re: EDC knife

#25

Post by Liberty » Fri Jan 10, 2020 7:50 am

The Annoyed Man wrote:
Fri Jan 10, 2020 12:41 am

I am a second amendment absolutist, but one of the things I despise most about the left is the whole "cancel culture" thing, which is a phenomenon they created. I refuse to engage in it unless the transgression is so clearly egregious that it would be immoral to respond in any other way. I despise Leonardo DiCaprio's politics, but he makes some pretty good movies; and I’m not going to deny myself some decent entertainment just because the lead actor is wrong on the issues in his personal life. I thought it was kind of silly when people set fire to perfectly good Yeti coffee mugs and ice chests because of Yeti's kerfuffle with the NRA. Sure, don’t buy more Yeti products if they made you angry. But while burning perfectly good Yeti products you’ve already bought and paid for because you’re mad at Yeti is certainly within your rights as the owner of the property, it’s also a classic example of cutting off your nose to spite your face.

To expand on the Hollywood example. I might watch DiCrapio's stuff. But refuse to let a Jane Fonda film play in my home. I will not hold anyone with disrespect that will watch it in their own home. Folks have to draw their own lines and live up to their own ethics.
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Re: EDC knife

#26

Post by K-Texas » Fri Jan 10, 2020 12:21 pm

The Annoyed Man wrote:
Fri Jan 10, 2020 12:41 am
One correction....
... and were more interested in easy money than their true customer base....
As I understand it, Benchmade did this as a free service, and were not paid for chopping up those guns, so this was not a matter of easy money, as much as it was a matter of poorly thought out civic duty. I absolutely concede that, when they made the decision to cooperate with the PD, they did so without raising their eyes to the horizon to see if it was a smart thing to do or not. But making a dumb decision is not the same as being "anti-gun".

And your previous point is well taken that Benchmade could move to a more weapons-friendly state....although the reality of moving even a small business is that it is hugely expensive to do so. (I helped plan and execute moving a business from California to Texas.) Moving a larger business from one state to another is a bigger undertaking yet, and realistically, it may not be financially feasible for Benchmade to move.

I am a second amendment absolutist, but one of the things I despise most about the left is the whole "cancel culture" thing, which is a phenomenon they created. I refuse to engage in it unless the transgression is so clearly egregious that it would be immoral to respond in any other way. I despise Leonardo DiCaprio's politics, but he makes some pretty good movies; and I’m not going to deny myself some decent entertainment just because the lead actor is wrong on the issues in his personal life. I thought it was kind of silly when people set fire to perfectly good Yeti coffee mugs and ice chests because of Yeti's kerfuffle with the NRA. Sure, don’t buy more Yeti products if they made you angry. But while burning perfectly good Yeti products you’ve already bought and paid for because you’re mad at Yeti is certainly within your rights as the owner of the property, it’s also a classic example of cutting off your nose to spite your face.

Like I said, you’re certainly entitled to your opinions, and to act on them as you see fit. I’m just nowhere near as worked up about Benchmade as you are, I’m OK with owning the ones I have, and if I see another one that I like and can afford, I might buy another.
TAM, I didn't state that they should move out of Oregon, but it would be an obvious consideration. Logistically and financially, it isn't nearly as easy as it sounds. Such a demand would also apply to Beretta, Colt, S&W, REM, Ruger, and SIG to name a few. Sierra Bullet Co. pulled up stakes in CA and moved to MO, but that was some years ago, and I can't honestly remember if the decision was based on the political climate. I suspect it was, but I'm also aware of CALs taxation issues and that might have been Sierra's motivation.

Obviously, I'm not as invested in Benchmade as you are with just the 1 Benchmade knife I own. If you can find any evidence that Benchmade ran the firearms through the chop-shop for free, I'd like to see that. I think it's worth the time to hear the statements and reactions of their marketing director during the radio broadcast just after the news broke. Still, though, if a company is dedicated to the 2nd amendment, how do they agree to chop up firearms for anyone? Even philosophically it is problematic. At least knowing that selling the confiscated firearms back to the public could have put $ into the LE Budget.

Sorry Your Honor, but we're just to busy to add any work outside of our regular production just now. Thank you, just the same!

I won't condemn anyone who decides to buy Benchmade now or in the future. Obviously, the mistake was gross enough that they're not likely to repeat it. But combined with their contributions to obvious liberal, Anti-Gunners, I've made my personal decision. ;-)
Anything that can be corrupted by man; will be corrupted.

The Lord is my shepherd; I shall not want . . .


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patterson
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Re: EDC knife

#27

Post by patterson » Mon Jan 13, 2020 2:38 pm

Im hooked on Spyderco now I want the Para Military 2


K-Texas
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Re: EDC knife

#28

Post by K-Texas » Mon Jan 13, 2020 3:19 pm

Spyderco makes good knives. I had the Endura I got in a pistol trade with my dealer back in 1998. My shooting partner has the current version. 3 1/2" is about minimum for my blades and the lockback is as strong as any. ;-)
Anything that can be corrupted by man; will be corrupted.

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Re: EDC knife

#29

Post by parabelum » Tue Jan 14, 2020 12:29 am

Congrats, tenacious is great. My favorite these days is Manix 2 lightweight in Maxamet steel. At < 3oz, it is a nice blade.
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Re: EDC knife

#30

Post by maximus2161 » Fri Jan 24, 2020 12:03 pm

I have often carried a lot of high end folders. Now I don’t. One of my favorite knives is the Ontario Rat II. It’s cheap and well bult. Spyderco is a good choice.

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