Shoulder Holster?
Moderator: carlson1
-
Topic author - Senior Member
- Posts in topic: 3
- Posts: 406
- Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2018 7:15 pm
- Location: DFW Area
Shoulder Holster?
Would this be considered a shoulder holster and thus be legal for open carry?
ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
Nevermind...
All lost in a tragic kayaking incident.
Bring back BitterClinger
Nevermind...
All lost in a tragic kayaking incident.
Bring back BitterClinger
-
- Senior Member
- Posts in topic: 2
- Posts: 5350
- Joined: Tue Jan 19, 2016 4:23 pm
- Location: Johnson County, Texas
Re: Shoulder Holster?
As far as I know, the law has never defined a shoulder holster. But that looks more like a belt holster with a Tek-Lok attachment that’s been put on a backpack shoulder strap. I think it’s going to take case law to determine what is, and what is not, a shoulder holster.
Take away the Second first, and the First is gone in a second
Re: Shoulder Holster?
I would say that it is not. As Jusme pointed out, it is just a holster attached to a backpack shoulder strap. I heard what I just wrote. Now I don't know!
I am not and have never been a LEO. My avatar is in honor of my friend, Dallas Police Sargent Michael Smith, who was murdered along with four other officers in Dallas on 7.7.2016.
NRA Patriot-Endowment Lifetime Member---------------------------------------------Si vis pacem, para bellum.................................................Patriot Guard Rider
NRA Patriot-Endowment Lifetime Member---------------------------------------------Si vis pacem, para bellum.................................................Patriot Guard Rider
-
Topic author - Senior Member
- Posts in topic: 3
- Posts: 406
- Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2018 7:15 pm
- Location: DFW Area
Re: Shoulder Holster?
And that's where question it. For more clarification, that holster is AlienGear's shape shift so is designed to be used in multiple configurations. I'm just trying to work out how I want to carry whilst out on my rucks. Currently I am just carrying appendix in a sticky holster which works fine but I don't trust it not to slip down into my skivies if I decide to jog a little. Maybe just need to invest in an actual appendix rig.
ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
Nevermind...
All lost in a tragic kayaking incident.
Bring back BitterClinger
Nevermind...
All lost in a tragic kayaking incident.
Bring back BitterClinger
-
- Senior Member
- Posts in topic: 2
- Posts: 5350
- Joined: Sat Jun 14, 2014 1:21 pm
- Location: Elgin, Texas
- Contact:
Re: Shoulder Holster?
We must each decide for ourselves which risks we are willing to manage and which benefits matter most to us. Except for those for whom I am responsible, I do not care what or how anyone carries.
I carry my S&W M&P9 M2.0 5" openly in a Safariland 7TS ALS, with Guard, at 3 on my Nexbelt Titan. This works best for me. My plan is to stay well within the boundaries of the law so that my attorney can easily defend my actions. Having decided to manage the risks of carrying, I put in place controls to mitigate the risks to an acceptable level. As attorney Andrew Branca says, "You carry a gun so you’re hard to kill. Know the law so you’re hard to convict."
In my opinion, the OP's picture shows a holster supported by straps on a person's shoulders; a shoulder holster. Texas Penal Code Chapter 46 does not define "shoulder or belt holster." That is a good thing. The legislative definition would likely be unintelligible. https://statutes.capitol.texas.gov/Docs ... /PE.46.htm
I could attach my 7TS ALS to shoulder straps, as in the OP's picture, and my pistol would not fall out. I think my attorney could easily defend my carrying in such a manner. However, carrying in such a manner would not work best for me, so I don't.
It is not my opinion that matters. The law means what the judge says it means and what the jury decides it means. I am not aware of any applicable court decisions or jury instructions in this matter. If it ever bothers me enough, I will call TX-Law Shield and ask a Texas criminal defense attorney. 1-877-448-6839
I feel it is also important to understand that we carry openly as "an exception to the application" of the law (TPC 46.035). TPC 2.02 defines this exception. https://statutes.capitol.texas.gov/Docs/PE/htm/PE.2.htm
"Sec. 2.02. EXCEPTION. (a) An exception to an offense in this code is so labeled by the phrase: "It is an exception to the application of . . . ."
(b) The prosecuting attorney must negate the existence of an exception in the accusation charging commission of the offense and prove beyond a reasonable doubt that the defendant or defendant's conduct does not fall within the exception.
(c) This section does not affect exceptions applicable to offenses enacted prior to the effective date of this code."
Note TPC 2.02. (b). The prosecuting attorney has to "negate" and "prove." I would prefer to not be in a situation in which the prosecuting attorney has the opportunity to negate or prove anything about my actions.
Be safe and carry.
I carry my S&W M&P9 M2.0 5" openly in a Safariland 7TS ALS, with Guard, at 3 on my Nexbelt Titan. This works best for me. My plan is to stay well within the boundaries of the law so that my attorney can easily defend my actions. Having decided to manage the risks of carrying, I put in place controls to mitigate the risks to an acceptable level. As attorney Andrew Branca says, "You carry a gun so you’re hard to kill. Know the law so you’re hard to convict."
In my opinion, the OP's picture shows a holster supported by straps on a person's shoulders; a shoulder holster. Texas Penal Code Chapter 46 does not define "shoulder or belt holster." That is a good thing. The legislative definition would likely be unintelligible. https://statutes.capitol.texas.gov/Docs ... /PE.46.htm
I could attach my 7TS ALS to shoulder straps, as in the OP's picture, and my pistol would not fall out. I think my attorney could easily defend my carrying in such a manner. However, carrying in such a manner would not work best for me, so I don't.
It is not my opinion that matters. The law means what the judge says it means and what the jury decides it means. I am not aware of any applicable court decisions or jury instructions in this matter. If it ever bothers me enough, I will call TX-Law Shield and ask a Texas criminal defense attorney. 1-877-448-6839
I feel it is also important to understand that we carry openly as "an exception to the application" of the law (TPC 46.035). TPC 2.02 defines this exception. https://statutes.capitol.texas.gov/Docs/PE/htm/PE.2.htm
"Sec. 2.02. EXCEPTION. (a) An exception to an offense in this code is so labeled by the phrase: "It is an exception to the application of . . . ."
(b) The prosecuting attorney must negate the existence of an exception in the accusation charging commission of the offense and prove beyond a reasonable doubt that the defendant or defendant's conduct does not fall within the exception.
(c) This section does not affect exceptions applicable to offenses enacted prior to the effective date of this code."
Note TPC 2.02. (b). The prosecuting attorney has to "negate" and "prove." I would prefer to not be in a situation in which the prosecuting attorney has the opportunity to negate or prove anything about my actions.
Be safe and carry.
O. Lee James, III Captain, US Army (Retired 2012), Honorable Order of St. Barbara
2/19FA, 1st Cavalry Division 73-78; 56FA BDE (Pershing) 78-81
NRA, NRA Basic Pistol Shooting Instructor, Rangemaster Certified, GOA, TSRA, NAR L1
2/19FA, 1st Cavalry Division 73-78; 56FA BDE (Pershing) 78-81
NRA, NRA Basic Pistol Shooting Instructor, Rangemaster Certified, GOA, TSRA, NAR L1
-
- Senior Member
- Posts in topic: 2
- Posts: 5350
- Joined: Tue Jan 19, 2016 4:23 pm
- Location: Johnson County, Texas
Re: Shoulder Holster?
Have you looked at gunfighter gear? They make a Kenai chest holster specifically for carrying with a backpack but it stays on body after you take off your packkayt00 wrote: ↑Fri Jun 19, 2020 10:10 amAnd that's where question it. For more clarification, that holster is AlienGear's shape shift so is designed to be used in multiple configurations. I'm just trying to work out how I want to carry whilst out on my rucks. Currently I am just carrying appendix in a sticky holster which works fine but I don't trust it not to slip down into my skivies if I decide to jog a little. Maybe just need to invest in an actual appendix rig.
https://gunfightersinc.com/kenai-chest-holster/
Take away the Second first, and the First is gone in a second
-
- Senior Member
- Posts in topic: 2
- Posts: 5350
- Joined: Sat Jun 14, 2014 1:21 pm
- Location: Elgin, Texas
- Contact:
Re: Shoulder Holster?
Except for those for whom I am responsible, I generally do not care what or how anyone carries. However, for SERPA and Alien Gear I diverge from my usual practice. Do not buy these as there are so many much better options.kayt00 wrote: ↑Fri Jun 19, 2020 10:10 amAnd that's where question it. For more clarification, that holster is AlienGear's shape shift so is designed to be used in multiple configurations. I'm just trying to work out how I want to carry whilst out on my rucks. Currently I am just carrying appendix in a sticky holster which works fine but I don't trust it not to slip down into my skivies if I decide to jog a little. Maybe just need to invest in an actual appendix rig.
SERPA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a9xIFdCVNOI
Alien Gear https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yw2yY0N78u4
In this article from February 11, 2020, Pew Pew Tactical picks the 6 best chest holsters. Alien Gear does not make the cut. https://www.pewpewtactical.com/best-chest-holsters/
O. Lee James, III Captain, US Army (Retired 2012), Honorable Order of St. Barbara
2/19FA, 1st Cavalry Division 73-78; 56FA BDE (Pershing) 78-81
NRA, NRA Basic Pistol Shooting Instructor, Rangemaster Certified, GOA, TSRA, NAR L1
2/19FA, 1st Cavalry Division 73-78; 56FA BDE (Pershing) 78-81
NRA, NRA Basic Pistol Shooting Instructor, Rangemaster Certified, GOA, TSRA, NAR L1
-
Topic author - Senior Member
- Posts in topic: 3
- Posts: 406
- Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2018 7:15 pm
- Location: DFW Area
Re: Shoulder Holster?
All good stuff and definitely things to take into consideration. Thanks for the input fellas.
ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
Nevermind...
All lost in a tragic kayaking incident.
Bring back BitterClinger
Nevermind...
All lost in a tragic kayaking incident.
Bring back BitterClinger
-
- Senior Member
- Posts in topic: 1
- Posts: 12329
- Joined: Sun Jun 12, 2005 3:31 pm
- Location: Angelina County
Re: Shoulder Holster?
I am not a lawyer or a LEO. I am a retired instructor. I would call it legal. Gives all appearance to me that it is a belt holster. The law says belt holster or shoulder holster. Law does not say the belt holster has to be worn on a belt around your waste. It does say you can openly display it in your vehicle as long as it is in a belt holster.
I have a very home made Chesty Puller rig that I used a Belt holster to make it with. I wear it when I am working around the place on & off my tractor. I am too tight to spend $200.00 for a shop made one.
I have a very home made Chesty Puller rig that I used a Belt holster to make it with. I wear it when I am working around the place on & off my tractor. I am too tight to spend $200.00 for a shop made one.
Carry 24-7 or guess right.
CHL Instructor. http://www.pdtraining.us" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
NRA/TSRA Life Member - TFC Member #11
-
- Senior Member
- Posts in topic: 1
- Posts: 26796
- Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2008 12:59 pm
- Location: North Richland Hills, Texas
- Contact:
Re: Shoulder Holster?
That’s a nice rig, and I wouldn't mind owning one, but the fact that the manufacturer calls it "The Kenai Chest Holster" probably disqualifies it from consideration as a "shoulder" holster for legal purposes.Jusme wrote: ↑Fri Jun 19, 2020 11:04 amHave you looked at gunfighter gear? They make a Kenai chest holster specifically for carrying with a backpack but it stays on body after you take off your packkayt00 wrote: ↑Fri Jun 19, 2020 10:10 amAnd that's where question it. For more clarification, that holster is AlienGear's shape shift so is designed to be used in multiple configurations. I'm just trying to work out how I want to carry whilst out on my rucks. Currently I am just carrying appendix in a sticky holster which works fine but I don't trust it not to slip down into my skivies if I decide to jog a little. Maybe just need to invest in an actual appendix rig.
https://gunfightersinc.com/kenai-chest-holster/
“Hard times create strong men. Strong men create good times. Good times create weak men. And, weak men create hard times.”
― G. Michael Hopf, "Those Who Remain"
#TINVOWOOT
― G. Michael Hopf, "Those Who Remain"
#TINVOWOOT
Re: Shoulder Holster?
I have one on order for the Glock 40.Jusme wrote: ↑Fri Jun 19, 2020 11:04 amHave you looked at gunfighter gear? They make a Kenai chest holster specifically for carrying with a backpack but it stays on body after you take off your packkayt00 wrote: ↑Fri Jun 19, 2020 10:10 amAnd that's where question it. For more clarification, that holster is AlienGear's shape shift so is designed to be used in multiple configurations. I'm just trying to work out how I want to carry whilst out on my rucks. Currently I am just carrying appendix in a sticky holster which works fine but I don't trust it not to slip down into my skivies if I decide to jog a little. Maybe just need to invest in an actual appendix rig.
https://gunfightersinc.com/kenai-chest-holster/