District of Columbia CCL

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ScottDLS
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District of Columbia CCL

#1

Post by ScottDLS » Thu Jun 07, 2018 12:24 pm

All right, I'm going to give this a shot. I travel frequently for business to Washington, DC and the suburbs. Due to a recent Federal court decision, DC is now a "shall issue" jurisdiction for concealed carry licenses for both residents and non-residents. I have a Texas LTC (of course) and a VA Non-Resident. I am going to be in the area for work and vacation in July, so I signed up to take the required 16 hour course and 2 hour range time on a weekend.

Because the company I work for has a no carry policy and the majority of my project locations are Federal and Military buildings, there really aren't very many places where I can carry in DC and VA while working and MD no chance. But I just think it will be cool to get a DC carry license. Then I will carry once or twice on my days off. Freedom (even when restricted) is cool. :coolgleamA:
4/13/1996 Completed CHL Class, 4/16/1996 Fingerprints, Affidavits, and Application Mailed, 10/4/1996 Received CHL, renewed 1998, 2002, 2006, 2011, 2016...). "ATF... Uhhh...heh...heh....Alcohol, tobacco, and GUNS!! Cool!!!!"

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Re: District of Columbia CCL

#2

Post by Charles L. Cotton » Thu Jun 07, 2018 1:47 pm

ScottDLS wrote:
Thu Jun 07, 2018 12:24 pm
All right, I'm going to give this a shot. I travel frequently for business to Washington, DC and the suburbs. Due to a recent Federal court decision, DC is now a "shall issue" jurisdiction for concealed carry licenses for both residents and non-residents. I have a Texas LTC (of course) and a VA Non-Resident. I am going to be in the area for work and vacation in July, so I signed up to take the required 16 hour course and 2 hour range time on a weekend.

Because the company I work for has a no carry policy and the majority of my project locations are Federal and Military buildings, there really aren't very many places where I can carry in DC and VA while working and MD no chance. But I just think it will be cool to get a DC carry license. Then I will carry once or twice on my days off. Freedom (even when restricted) is cool. :coolgleamA:
Do you know what range will be used? I didn't think there were any ranges in DC, other than government agency ranges.

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Re: District of Columbia CCL

#3

Post by ScottDLS » Thu Jun 07, 2018 2:00 pm

Charles L. Cotton wrote:
Thu Jun 07, 2018 1:47 pm
ScottDLS wrote:
Thu Jun 07, 2018 12:24 pm
All right, I'm going to give this a shot. I travel frequently for business to Washington, DC and the suburbs. Due to a recent Federal court decision, DC is now a "shall issue" jurisdiction for concealed carry licenses for both residents and non-residents. I have a Texas LTC (of course) and a VA Non-Resident. I am going to be in the area for work and vacation in July, so I signed up to take the required 16 hour course and 2 hour range time on a weekend.

Because the company I work for has a no carry policy and the majority of my project locations are Federal and Military buildings, there really aren't very many places where I can carry in DC and VA while working and MD no chance. But I just think it will be cool to get a DC carry license. Then I will carry once or twice on my days off. Freedom (even when restricted) is cool. :coolgleamA:
Do you know what range will be used? I didn't think there were any ranges in DC, other than government agency ranges.

Chas.
Yes. The range that will be used is in Maryland though the class is taught in Washington, I will PM you the name of the outfit that I am using and the range address. I looked very hard for qualifying courses taught in Virginia, because I have a Virginia Non-Res License and because I don't think I can bring a handgun to Maryland. But couldn't find any.
4/13/1996 Completed CHL Class, 4/16/1996 Fingerprints, Affidavits, and Application Mailed, 10/4/1996 Received CHL, renewed 1998, 2002, 2006, 2011, 2016...). "ATF... Uhhh...heh...heh....Alcohol, tobacco, and GUNS!! Cool!!!!"

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Re: District of Columbia CCL

#4

Post by RoyGBiv » Thu Jun 07, 2018 2:29 pm

I'll be rooting for you Scott! :patriot:
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Re: District of Columbia CCL

#5

Post by O.F.Fascist » Mon Jun 11, 2018 1:03 am

Thanks for posting this and letting us know how it goes.

I have a buddy currently living in DC and I've been thinking of applying for one just to add to the collection next time I visit.

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Re: District of Columbia CCL

#6

Post by ScottDLS » Fri Jun 29, 2018 8:41 pm

Bump. Heading to class tomorrow in DC. Instructor emailed to say he will loan me a Glock for range portion, or I can rent a gun at range in MD.
4/13/1996 Completed CHL Class, 4/16/1996 Fingerprints, Affidavits, and Application Mailed, 10/4/1996 Received CHL, renewed 1998, 2002, 2006, 2011, 2016...). "ATF... Uhhh...heh...heh....Alcohol, tobacco, and GUNS!! Cool!!!!"


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Re: District of Columbia CCL

#7

Post by OneGun » Fri Jun 29, 2018 9:12 pm

How long after you receive the license before you have to renew??
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Re: District of Columbia CCL

#8

Post by ScottDLS » Fri Jun 29, 2018 9:34 pm

OneGun wrote:
Fri Jun 29, 2018 9:12 pm
How long after you receive the license before you have to renew??
I’m not sure. I’ll ask tomorrow. I downloaded the application today...was pretty easy 2pages. I have to go to DC MPD permit unit in person after the class to submit and they take photos and prints.
4/13/1996 Completed CHL Class, 4/16/1996 Fingerprints, Affidavits, and Application Mailed, 10/4/1996 Received CHL, renewed 1998, 2002, 2006, 2011, 2016...). "ATF... Uhhh...heh...heh....Alcohol, tobacco, and GUNS!! Cool!!!!"

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Re: District of Columbia CCL

#9

Post by ELB » Fri Jun 29, 2018 10:29 pm

Excellent. Good luck with the bureaucracy.
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Re: District of Columbia CCL

#10

Post by skeathley » Sat Jun 30, 2018 8:26 am

Having a license from DC is like owning a unicorn!

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Re: District of Columbia CCL

#11

Post by ScottDLS » Sat Jun 30, 2018 3:06 pm

Just finished first day of the DC CCW class. I’ll do a detailed report when all done. But the basic requirements are 16 hours including 2 hours at a range. The instructor was a Washington DC special police officer with his own firm. These officers are commissioned by DC but only act as LEO when they are on duty with their private firms. From what can tell it’s kind of cross between Reserve LEO and a Private Security in Texas.

Anyway the material is not dictated by DC Metro PD. The instructor submits a syllabus and they review and approve. My instructor had 6 of us at an office building conference room in the District. He brought one blue rubber training gun, and two replica M&P 9mm w laser pointer barrels. He is also a USCCA and NRA concealed carry trainer. in addition to legal aspects we also covered grip, carry, presentation from a holster and aiming.

One guy there renewing did only first 4 hours. The rest of us were new. 3 DC residents and 2 non including me. The license is good for two years from date of issue. All handguns to be carried must first be registered with DC MPD. You can only have ammunition in the District that fits your registered gun. No mags over 10 rd and if you carry with one in the pipe you can only have 9 in the mag. Only one full mag reload worth of ammo carried on you for a total max of 20 rd. If you have a revolver max 12 rd. 6 in the gun, 6 for reload. I guess for a 1911 you could carry 7+1 and a 7rd mag. Or 8 if you get one of those extended mags. There are a lot of off limits areas even not counting federally prohibited areas. There is a specific sign for private businesses, but it’s not clear if you commit a crime by passing one if you aren’t also asked to leave.

Interestingly professional sporting events are NOT off limits unless they specifically tell you to leave (which they all do, because they wand you. But if you somehow missed the screening and they did not tell you to leave you could carry.

These are my brief impressions so far. One thing the instructor mentioned that will act as my disclaimer is...DC did not want to allow CCW. They lost Heller, then a suit about carry outside the home/business. First they went may issue (I.e. NO ISSUE) then they lost ANOTHER suit and an appeal, and an en banc rehearing... They didn’t want to risk going to SCOTUS again, so they passed the minimum CC they could get away with. HOWEVER, the main weapons laws that are gross misdemeanors and felonies under the DC Criminal Code are for unregistered firearm and ammo possession. It’s not exactly clear what violations of private property rules and unloaded transport of registered guns ammo might get you.

In fact this is one of the reasons I am getting my DC permit. I work here a lot and stay in VA and DC. I would like to be able to have my CCW in my hotel and in my rental car. I have to be careful not to carry into Maryland, but if I keep in my trunk while driving from DC-MD-DCorVA I should be covered...
4/13/1996 Completed CHL Class, 4/16/1996 Fingerprints, Affidavits, and Application Mailed, 10/4/1996 Received CHL, renewed 1998, 2002, 2006, 2011, 2016...). "ATF... Uhhh...heh...heh....Alcohol, tobacco, and GUNS!! Cool!!!!"

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Re: District of Columbia CCL

#12

Post by bigtek » Sat Jun 30, 2018 3:15 pm

It sounds like they're making applicants jump through hoops to deter people from applying, rather than because it has any public safety purpose. I guess that's true about carry licenses in general though.

If you're licensed, is it legal to carry on the metro?
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Re: District of Columbia CCL

#13

Post by ScottDLS » Sat Jun 30, 2018 3:29 pm

bigtek wrote:
Sat Jun 30, 2018 3:15 pm
It sounds like they're making applicants jump through hoops to deter people from applying, rather than because it has any public safety purpose. I guess that's true about carry licenses in general though.

If you're licensed, is it legal to carry on the metro?
It is NOT allowed to carry, in DC, on the METRO or Metro Buses...however it IS legal in VA with a permit or reciprocal permit. I think unloaded transport from one VA to DC for a resident may be a gray area. I’m not sure what the criminal charge might be if you were say, taking your registered pistol home from a VA range to DC on the metro....? :???:
4/13/1996 Completed CHL Class, 4/16/1996 Fingerprints, Affidavits, and Application Mailed, 10/4/1996 Received CHL, renewed 1998, 2002, 2006, 2011, 2016...). "ATF... Uhhh...heh...heh....Alcohol, tobacco, and GUNS!! Cool!!!!"

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District of Columbia CCL

#14

Post by ScottDLS » Wed Jul 04, 2018 12:15 pm

Update:

I finished the class including the shooting portion on Sunday, July 1 at a range in Upper Marlboro, MD since DC has no ranges. I shot a box of 9mm out of the instructor's Glock 17. We did a number of ranges 3 yds, 7yds, 15yds, and 25yds. I got them all on the target though the 25yd shots were low and spread wide. Everything else was COM except for 4 head shots that were part of drill. They were center and in a vertical line...

-There is no DC MPD course of fire. The instructor designed his own. He was a DC Special Police Officer (like Tom Morris on LivePD :lol: ). Since his firm provides private security throughout DC, he focused on defensive shooting and justification.
-The weapons part of the DC criminal code is not that long (I read all of it). It seems to be very generic with a lot dating from the 1970's and some to 1932. It seems there would be a lot of gray areas and "discretion".
-I get the impression the DC CCW program is pretty ad hoc. It only dates to 2014 and shall issue to last year. I don't think that many people have one and press reports suggest most are non-residents. I read one statistic that 124 had been issued in 2017. The court decision making DC shall issue wasn't till later in the year.
-I suspect most DC and Federal LEO won't be familiar with DC CCW, so carriers beware...
-All Federal restrictions apply, so no carry in Federal office buildings, courts, Capitol, etc. This could be seen as a problem, but in my opinion, the parts of DC where you really would want to carry are not where the well guarded Federal facilities are.
-If you choose to carry you may find yourself having to return home or hotel to put away your weapon because there are so many restricted places. Below is a list of restricted areas from DC CCW site.
1.Shall not carry a pistol while consuming alcohol or while impaired.
2.A building or office occupied by the District of Columbia or its agencies.
3.The building and grounds, including any adjacent parking lot of a childcare facility, preschool, elementary or secondary school, or a public or private college or university.
4.A hospital or an office where medical or mental health services are the primary services provided.
5.A penal institution, secure juvenile residential facility, or halfway house.
6.A polling place while voting is occurring.
7.A public transportation vehicle, including the Metrorail transit system and its stations.
8.Any premises where alcohol is served, sold and consumed on the premises (pursuant to license issued under Title 25 of D.C. Code)
9.Stadium or Arena
10.Public Gathering or special event open to the public when the organizer has provided notice and posted signage prohibiting the carrying of pistols in advance of the gathering or special event.
11.The public memorials on the National Mall and along the Tidal Basin, and any area where firearms are prohibited under federal law or by a federal agency, including the U.S. Capitol buildings and grounds.
12.The area around the White House ( between Constitution Ave. and H St. and between 15th St. and 17th St. NW)
13.The U.S. Naval Observatory and its grounds (from the perimeter of its fence to the curb of Massachusetts Ave. NW from 34th St. south on Massachusetts Ave to Observatory Circle NW)
14.When a dignitary or high-ranking official of the United States or a state, local, or foreign government is moving under the protection of the MPD, the U.S Secret Service, the U.S Capitol Police, or other law enforcement agency that does not include a distance greater than 1,000 feet from the moving dignitary. ( provided notice has been given by signs or an officer’s order)
15.A Demonstration in a public place (within a perimeter of 1,000 feet designated by a law enforcement agency, and notice has been given by signs or an officer’s order)
16.On private residential property unless authorized by the property owner.
17.A place of religious worship unless authorized by the owner or authorized agent.
18.Non-residential property that is posted with conspicuous signage prohibiting the carrying of a concealed pistol.
Monday I am going to DC MPD to drop off my application and certificate and get photo/fingerprints. When I get back to DC July 16 I will bring the forms to register my two pistols that I want to carry (Beretta 92SF and Walther PPK/s. They supposedly have 90 days to issue or deny. Reports are 75 days is typical.

-Scott
4/13/1996 Completed CHL Class, 4/16/1996 Fingerprints, Affidavits, and Application Mailed, 10/4/1996 Received CHL, renewed 1998, 2002, 2006, 2011, 2016...). "ATF... Uhhh...heh...heh....Alcohol, tobacco, and GUNS!! Cool!!!!"

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Re: District of Columbia CCL

#15

Post by ScottDLS » Tue Jul 10, 2018 7:09 pm

Update.

Monday I went to DC Metro PD Headquarters and went to the CCW/Gun Registration Unit and turned in my application with my completed training certificate. There was a small office with a door to the hallway and a "half door" countertop for handing the documents and signing in.

There were 4 chairs in the hallway and one person ahead of me (from MD I heard him say) waiting. After I signed in and handed over the paperwork I waited for about 10 min while the 2 officers in the office were working with the first guy.

They called me up, said everything looked great and had entered my name into the computer. They handed me two disclosure authorizations to sign and gave me a voucher to take to the cashier down the hall.

They asked me if I had any (gun) registration forms to submit, which I didn't (more on that later). I went down to the cashier, paid $110 by Amex and got a receipt ($75 license fee, $35 fingerprint fee).

I went and waited about 15 minutes at an office where they were doing prints. Lots of DC residents coming in for DC Public School job background checks and prints, and to get federal print cards filled out for federal jobs. They took me to a scanner and took my prints electronically, presumably to be filed away with the about 500 other copies of my prints that governments at various levels have collected from me since I joined the Navy at 17. The Fed cards were done with ink and handed back to the applicants.

I went from the fingerprint section to a photo section where they took a head shot and had me sign a electronic pad.

Then back to the gun registration unit with my receipts. The guy behind the counter asked if I had any gun registration forms for any guns that I would carry/have in the District. I said no because I needed to copy the serial numbers from my two pistols and they are back in Texas. He said, well you get one registration free with the CCW application and after that they are $13.00 a gun and last for 3 years.

You absolutely can not legally POSSESS or carry an unregistered firearm or ammunition in DC. This is a felony in their criminal code. If you possess any ammunition it must be of a caliber for one of your registered firearms. The guy gave me a blank form and said to bring back with my receipt next week (when I come back to DC for work) and I would get the first registration free. I'm not sure, but I think they print the registration card out for you right there.

On the form it has an area for the gun store that you purchase the gun from to fill out if you are a DC resident. Since there are NO stocking gun stores in DC, you go to Maryland or Virginia, pick your gun, pay, and have them ship to the ONE FFL in all of the District that does transfers. When you take it back to the DC MPD, they give you the card and you take it to the FFL and he transfers the gun to you on the 4473 after you show him the registration card.

For me since I already own the gun and am not a DC resident, I only fill out the Manufacturer, Model, Caliber, Barrel length and Serial #. They officer told me be sure you only carry 10 round or less magazines if your gun accepts bigger ones. SInce I'm registering a Beretta 92SF that I bought in 1998, it came with 2-10rd standard. Of course, I've bought about new 15 rd factory mags since 2004 when the federal AWB expired. But anyway I thought it was positive that they reminded me.

He also said you have to fill out the section that says where you will store the gun. Even if you have a CCW, they want you to say it will be locked up when you are not present. I had already thought of this while reviewing the form and I told him I would either keep it in a quick access safe at home in Texas, in the room safe in my hotel in DC, or on my person when legal with my CCW. He said that's what they want on the form. Again the guy was forthcoming in telling me how to fill out the form. Since I've never registered any non-NFA gun that I've ever owned, this is new to me.

At the end the guy said, its at least a 90 day process (i.e. even if you pass the background they basically hold it to the 90th day...he shook my hand and said..."Good luck, see you next week for the free registration."

So I'm now in the (DC) waiting room....should we start a thread? :biggrinjester:

I guarantee once I get the permit, I am going to walk across the Key Bridge from Rosslyn, VA to Georgetown, then along the Potomac to 14th street then up 14th to Pennsylvania Ave., maybe find a Walgreens and do a Wal-gree walk and then back to VA. Note I'll be staying South of Constitution Ave along the Potomac until I get East of 15th street because of the following:
Prohibited Areas
...
12.The area around the White House ( between Constitution Ave. and H St. and between 15th St. and 17th St. NW)
...
4/13/1996 Completed CHL Class, 4/16/1996 Fingerprints, Affidavits, and Application Mailed, 10/4/1996 Received CHL, renewed 1998, 2002, 2006, 2011, 2016...). "ATF... Uhhh...heh...heh....Alcohol, tobacco, and GUNS!! Cool!!!!"

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