House GOP Pledges Investigation Of DoJ With November Win After FBI Raids Trump's Mar-A-Lago

[powerboatr]

I have heard from a friend that the top secret document thing is not going be the charge as the President does not have to abide by those laws. He will be charged under a World War 1 espionage law set up to arrest spies.

The news was so infuriating, they were breathlessly asking the question- “Has the nation been endangered by the actions of this Former President”. As if Russian and Chinese spy’s have had complete access to Mar a Lago and to Melania’s underwater drawers.

i think thats thin using espionage act. becasue the discovery portion by trumps legal team would most certainly drag comey, clinton, fbi personnel that were found to be harboring classified documents and that comey even leaked them to the press. use their NON CASES as precedent. which should force garland to charge or arrest those people if he plans on trumps charge sticking
IMO
the true RAID was mot\re about jan 6th evidence. the warrant was pretty broad .
if archives or intel folks on the premises had issue with some classified documents, they appeared to have already fixed that by him declassifying them and the double locked storage. not to mention the months long file review etc that has been going on to ensure everything was in its place .

The problem with the Espionage Act as it pertains to Trump is that it requires the possession to be unauthorized or with the intent to harm the US or benefit a foreign country. Since Trump was the man in legal control of who was authorized, including authorizing himself, he could not possibly be in unauthorized possession. After the blowup of Hillary's aiding Russia case, there is no way anyone could prove Trump was doing something to harm the US or benefit a foreign country. The interesting loophole on all this is that if he was doing it to benefit himself by using it in his business, it is not a crime.

As I pointed out above, he also had no classified documents because he had declassified them. And he was the final arbiter of what was classified until Biden was sworn in.

As for the claim of violation of the Presidential Records Act, that is a possibility. But that is not a crime. There is nothing in the law that I can find that defines any penalty for the president violating it. It is in Title 44, while federal crimes are generally in Title 18 (with military crimes in Title 10).

This means there was no real legal justification for the search warrant. So, I think it was done more for political reasons and I doubt those reasons had to do with January 6th. Both this whole warrant show and the on-going January 6th circus are more, IMO, to do with discrediting Trump in case he runs again. They are deathly afraid of him getting in office again and wanted to scare him off and convince voters he is a criminal to stop them for voting for him. Ironically, I think their ploy backfired on them and convinced him to run again when he was going to not run and instead play kingmaker and support Desantis.

As I type that, a Machiavellian thought came to mind. Maybe that is what they wanted after all. They know they could not beat Desantis but they think they can beat him by convincing independents he is crooked. That is a weird thought, but possible. Either way, I believe it had more to do with the next presidential election (with a little benefit to the mid-terms thrown in) than any real crime.

And this politicization of the DOJ makes me agree that we need to remove almost all federal law enforcement and turn that power back over to the states.

i think sir you are hitting the nail on the head..

[Paladin]

I have heard from a friend that the top secret document thing is not going be the charge as the President does not have to abide by those laws. He will be charged under a World War 1 espionage law set up to arrest spies.

The news was so infuriating, they were breathlessly asking the question- “Has the nation been endangered by the actions of this Former President”. As if Russian and Chinese spy’s have had complete access to Mar a Lago and to Melania’s underwater drawers.

i think thats thin using espionage act. becasue the discovery portion by trumps legal team would most certainly drag comey, clinton, fbi personnel that were found to be harboring classified documents and that comey even leaked them to the press. use their NON CASES as precedent. which should force garland to charge or arrest those people if he plans on trumps charge sticking
IMO
the true RAID was mot\re about jan 6th evidence. the warrant was pretty broad .
if archives or intel folks on the premises had issue with some classified documents, they appeared to have already fixed that by him declassifying them and the double locked storage. not to mention the months long file review etc that has been going on to ensure everything was in its place .

The problem with the Espionage Act as it pertains to Trump is that it requires the possession to be unauthorized or with the intent to harm the US or benefit a foreign country. Since Trump was the man in legal control of who was authorized, including authorizing himself, he could not possibly be in unauthorized possession. After the blowup of Hillary's aiding Russia case, there is no way anyone could prove Trump was doing something to harm the US or benefit a foreign country. The interesting loophole on all this is that if he was doing it to benefit himself by using it in his business, it is not a crime.

As I pointed out above, he also had no classified documents because he had declassified them. And he was the final arbiter of what was classified until Biden was sworn in.

As for the claim of violation of the Presidential Records Act, that is a possibility. But that is not a crime. There is nothing in the law that I can find that defines any penalty for the president violating it. It is in Title 44, while federal crimes are generally in Title 18 (with military crimes in Title 10).

This means there was no real legal justification for the search warrant. So, I think it was done more for political reasons and I doubt those reasons had to do with January 6th. Both this whole warrant show and the on-going January 6th circus are more, IMO, to do with discrediting Trump in case he runs again. They are deathly afraid of him getting in office again and wanted to scare him off and convince voters he is a criminal to stop them for voting for him. Ironically, I think their ploy backfired on them and convinced him to run again when he was going to not run and instead play kingmaker and support Desantis.

As I type that, a Machiavellian thought came to mind. Maybe that is what they wanted after all. They know they could not beat Desantis but they think they can beat him by convincing independents he is crooked. That is a weird thought, but possible. Either way, I believe it had more to do with the next presidential election (with a little benefit to the mid-terms thrown in) than any real crime.

And this politicization of the DOJ makes me agree that we need to remove almost all federal law enforcement and turn that power back over to the states.

i think sir you are hitting the nail on the head..

[Paladin]

With "friends" like these...Asa Hutchinson: FBI ‘Simply Carrying Out Their Responsibilities’ with Mar-a-Lago Raid

He must need some awfully thick glasses to not be able to see what the FBI has been doing for many years now.

[Paladin]

This is looking more like a Watergate 2022 every day:

Trump Raid: DOJ Allegedly Seized Privileged Attorney-Client Materials

The claim, reported by Fox News, raises new questions about the DOJ’s tactics, as well as doubts about whether the DOJ would be able to use any of the seized materials in a hypothetical prosecution of the former president.

The DOJ is apparently opposing the appointment of a “special master,” a judicial official who would conduct an independent review and decide which materials could be handed over to the government and which materials would have to be returned to Trump and his attorneys.

[Rafe]

This means there was no real legal justification for the search warrant. So, I think it was done more for political reasons and I doubt those reasons had to do with January 6th. Both this whole warrant show and the on-going January 6th circus are more, IMO, to do with discrediting Trump in case he runs again. They are deathly afraid of him getting in office again and wanted to scare him off and convince voters he is a criminal to stop them for voting for him. Ironically, I think their ploy backfired on them and convinced him to run again when he was going to not run and instead play kingmaker and support Desantis.

As I type that, a Machiavellian thought came to mind. Maybe that is what they wanted after all. They know they could not beat Desantis but they think they can beat him by convincing independents he is crooked. That is a weird thought, but possible. Either way, I believe it had more to do with the next presidential election (with a little benefit to the mid-terms thrown in) than any real crime.

I wholeheartedly agree. But I don't know if I can ascribe enough strategic depth to the dem machinery to believe them thinking four moves ahead of the game. Maybe that's naïve. But so, so much of what come out of the current administration seems to be committee-driven (e.g., inconsistent and slow to materialize) and almost purely reactionary. For just about every major factor I think of since January 2021, nothing has really been proactive and when lip-service was given to decisions as if they were proactive, they've always proven to be wrong, from Afghanistan to energy to inflation.

Occam's razor, the simplest explanation I can think of is deflection. I fully believe history will eventually judge 2021 and 2022 to be the worst first years' performance of any presidential administration since Warren G. Harding, maybe since Andrew Johnson. And right now, it's all about the midterms. I think the dem strategists are grasping at anything and everything they can use to deflect news cycles away from Biden and the dem Congress and onto Republicans. We had the short-lived but passionately orated "Ultra-MAGA" spiel; the blame for America's inflation and lack of energy planning set squarely on Vladimir Putin; the failed attempt to make the Jan 6 showboat hearings into a prime-time network TV event (and that failure is likely to get RINO Liz Cheney out of office: independent, in-state Wyoming polls show the Republican challenger leading Cheney by a whopping 52% to 30%); the dem rallying cry for pro-life demonstrations and the stalking of justices after the SCOTUS ruling on Roe v. Wade; the immediate capitalization of the Uvalde tragedy by ramping anti-gun rhetoric and a rushing a ridiculous, unconstitutional bill through the House; and on and on. The Biden administration has not one single time stepped up and admitted a mistake, much less done anything credible and proactive to help the American people...help them right now. Sorry, Mr. President, even your own economists say that the continued overspending in the "Inflation Reduction Act" (aka "Build Back Better v2.0") is likely to reduce inflation by only 0.3% and that only starting in 2024.

We're only 85 days to the midterm elections. Twelve short weeks. The dem strategic machine milked the Jan 6 hearings, but those have gone stale, big time. They're seeing atrocious poll numbers for Biden. Most of their reliable core are already saying they definitely don't want Biden to run again. Candidates in the midterms are mostly avoiding his endorsement and are going out of their way not to appear with him. The administration is letting as many undocumented aliens through the southern border as they can get away with, but that won't help in the immediate midterms. In fact, gasp!, polling of Hispanic voters is showing many are as critical as Republicans of how the dems are handling things.

What to do? Whatever to do? Well, there's always their favorite punching bag. "Let's do something radical to get Trump back in the spotlight, stir-up and foment that hate that helped us put the WD-40 on the 2020 election. I know! Let's raid Mar-a-Lago! That'll capture the news bigtime! And maybe Trump will get noisy again and make more woke enemies!"

I may be wrong, but other than political blowback on the DOJ if the dems get shellacked in the midterms (and the White House can still protect them to a degree there) I don't think there is any legal liability on Garland or the DOJ for getting and prosecuting the warrant. So long as the affidavit provided something that looked like reasonable cause to the very biased judge who signed it, it's all on the up and up...even if it's the first time in history that it's ever been done against a FPOTUS. Big-time news splash that will stay in the news for weeks--and only 12 weeks until the midterms--to shift focus onto Donald "Democrat Punching Bag" Trump and away from the incompetent, incapable, ineffectual, and inept democrat leadership of the last 19 months.

[Paladin]

FBI Director Calls Legit Criticism Of Corrupt FBI ‘Violence,’ But We Weren’t Born Yesterday

This is part of the classic pattern of abuse:

*Creates a situation that will cause a blowup (i.e. raiding only political opposition)

*Labels the victim with generally insulting terms (i.e. erode respect for the rule of law)

*Blames the victim for all the abuser’s troubles and failures (i.e. Unfounded attacks on the integrity of the FBI)

*Yells at the victim

*Threatens physical violence and retaliation against the victim, children or other family members

*Accuses the victim of being violent if victim acts in any way to protect themself

*Questions victim's sense of reality (Unfounded attacks on the integrity of the FBI...are dangerous and should be deeply concerning to all Americans)

*Forces economic dependency

*Puts down or denies the victim’s history, heritage, faith, values

*Breaks personal items that have sentimental value to victim as a message that abuser can break victim too

[Paladin]

Lengthy, but outstanding legal breakdown of how the warrant is illegal and should have never been issued in the first place:



As I'm understanding this... there is not much investigation is needed. All those associated with approving the warrant should be unemployed at this point.