17y/o Killed By Neighborhood Watch/CHL

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tallmike
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17y/o Killed By Neighborhood Watch/CHL

#1

Post by tallmike » Mon Mar 12, 2012 1:12 pm

Sad story I just saw on the news this morning, even though it happened nearly 2 weeks ago. I did a quick search of the forum and I could not find the story being discussed already, I apologize if I missed it.
Family members said 17-year-old Trayvon Martin, of Miami, was visiting his father and soon-to-be stepmother last month at their home in a gated community in the Orlando suburb of Sanford. He had gone to a convenience store to buy some Skittles candy and was returning home when he was confronted by an armed man who was head of the local neighborhood watch, family member said.

The man hasn't been charged. His name was redacted along with Martin's name in an initial police report but he was identified as 28-year-old George Zimmerman in a police report released Thursday.

The report said Zimmerman initially called police to report a suspicious person in the neighborhood and minutes later 911 dispatchers received several calls of shots being fired in the neighborhood. Zimmerman told police officers that he had shot Martin and officers found a semiautomatic handgun on him. The report said that Zimmerman's back was wet and he was covered in grass as if he had been on the ground. He was bleeding from his nose and the back of the head, the report said.

Read more here: http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/03/08/2 ... k=misearch" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;#storylink=cpy
http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/03/08/2 ... k=misearch" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

There are still lots of details missing, I am surprised that the cops are calling it self defense since he is the one that initiated the contact. We shall see how it all pans out.

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Re: 17y/o Killed By Neighborhood Watch/CHL

#2

Post by gigag04 » Mon Mar 12, 2012 1:22 pm

I dont see any glaring problems at first glance.
Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work. - Thomas Edison


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Re: 17y/o Killed By Neighborhood Watch/CHL

#3

Post by RPB » Mon Mar 12, 2012 1:30 pm

I saw/ran across that incident yesterday or so.
All details aren't known, but it appears "Skittles guy" shouldn't have put Armed guy/CHL neighborhood watch captain on ground and beat on him to make his nose and back of his head bleed. And Neighborhood watch guy learned that yelling help real loudly over and over.... doesn't bring any help sometimes.

At this point, it's a "he said" deal, but with some physical evidence to corroborate neighborhood watch guy's story.
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Re: 17y/o Killed By Neighborhood Watch/CHL

#4

Post by philip964 » Mon Mar 12, 2012 1:35 pm

Bleeding from the nose and back of the head, certainly could be consistent with self defense.

However, being head of neighborhood watch does not mean you are a police officer.

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Re: 17y/o Killed By Neighborhood Watch/CHL

#5

Post by i8godzilla » Mon Mar 12, 2012 1:45 pm

RPB wrote:I saw/ran across that incident yesterday or so.
All details aren't known, but it appears "Skittles guy" shouldn't have put Armed guy/CHL neighborhood watch captain on ground and beat on him to make his nose and back of his head bleed. And Neighborhood watch guy learned that yelling help real loudly over and over.... doesn't bring any help sometimes.

At this point, it's a "he said" deal, but with some physical evidence to corroborate neighborhood watch guy's story.
So, someone that was coming home from the store gets confronted. How does he know that Watch Captain is a good guy? Who knows the Batman Watch Captain may have even had his gun out already. Maybe the kid thought he was not a good guy and tried to defend himself. Sounds to me that the Watch Captain was the one that escalated the situation. In order for the Watch Captain, to end up on the ground and get his nose bloodied, HE had to get close the now dead 17 year old. Unarmed person, in a place he was legally allowed to be, gets confronted by someone unknown to him and ends up dead. To me, it sounds like Watch Captain is the sole person responsible for the final outcome.

Zimmerman has been interviewed three times and is cooperating. He is claiming self-defense, even though he was following Martin, said Sanford Police Chief Bill Lee
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Re: 17y/o Killed By Neighborhood Watch/CHL

#6

Post by flechero » Mon Mar 12, 2012 1:47 pm

Maybe I missed something but there is no account of what happened in the link. For all I saw, the shooter could have illegally detained and or roughed up skittles guy first and skittles guy could have fought back in self defense.

No matter what happened, it is sad and at least two families will be forever changed.


philip964 wrote:Bleeding from the nose and back of the head, certainly could be consistent with self defense.

However, being head of neighborhood watch does not mean you are a police officer.
True- but it also could be consistent with him being the original aggressor and was getting whooped when he pulled the gun.


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Re: 17y/o Killed By Neighborhood Watch/CHL

#7

Post by Jusster » Mon Mar 12, 2012 2:13 pm

Hmmm, wonder what this kid was doing that made him so suspicious in the first place? Definitely need more details surrounding this incident before drawing any conclusions. Sad story indeed.

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Re: 17y/o Killed By Neighborhood Watch/CHL

#8

Post by RoyGBiv » Mon Mar 12, 2012 2:19 pm

It's pretty easy to fill in the blanks and make the situation out to be either parties fault. Way too much missing information....

However... It seems likely the whole tragic mess could have been avoided if the neighborhood watch guy took his title seriously and "watched" instead of confronted the young man.

From: http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162- ... on-martin/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
According to WKMG, a 911 dispatcher told Zimmerman that officers were on the way and not to interfere.
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Re: 17y/o Killed By Neighborhood Watch/CHL

#9

Post by gigag04 » Mon Mar 12, 2012 3:49 pm

"just buying skittles..."

I love the innocent things people are doing when they get shot in self defense.

There was a guy who killed a cop, and was subsequently killed by responding officers. His family was on tv saying he was a nice buy that liked chocolate....
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Re: 17y/o Killed By Neighborhood Watch/CHL

#10

Post by Dave2 » Mon Mar 12, 2012 6:38 pm

gigag04 wrote:"just buying skittles..."

I love the innocent things people are doing when they get shot in self defense.

There was a guy who killed a cop, and was subsequently killed by responding officers. His family was on tv saying he was a nice buy that liked chocolate....
Wow. This really reaffirms my decision not to be a journalist... I have a very strong "pick at" reflex that kinda kicks in when people say stuff like that, and I'd end being kicked out of all the press conferences and probably getting beat up in the parking lot by the subjects of said press conferences.

That isn't to say that I can't normally keep a lid on it, but if it was my job to spout off any random question so that they "discuss" things on air later that night, I'd have a real hard time being professional about it.
I am not a lawyer, nor have I played one on TV, nor did I stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night, nor should anything I say be taken as legal advice. If it is important that any information be accurate, do not use me as the only source.

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Re: 17y/o Killed By Neighborhood Watch/CHL

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Post by WildBill » Mon Mar 12, 2012 6:48 pm

RPB wrote:I saw/ran across that incident yesterday or so.
All details aren't known, but it appears "Skittles guy" shouldn't have put Armed guy/CHL neighborhood watch captain on ground and beat on him to make his nose and back of his head bleed. And Neighborhood watch guy learned that yelling help real loudly over and over.... doesn't bring any help sometimes.

At this point, it's a "he said" deal, but with some physical evidence to corroborate neighborhood watch guy's story.
Put yourself in the "skittle guy's" shoes. You are a 17 year old black male walking home eating skittles and minding your own business and some suspicious looking old white guy starts to follow you. You tell him to leave you alone and continue to walk home. He continues to follow you. You tell him to get lost and mind his own business. He continues to stalk you. You turn around and you see the old man pointing a gun at you. You fear for your life and punch him the nose. The old guy he falls to the ground. You try to disarm him by hitting him in the face and head. Then he shoots you.

Update: WFTV found out Zimmerman was arrested in 2005 for battery on a law enforcement officer.

http://www.wftv.com/news/news/local/man ... as-/nLPgL/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Last edited by WildBill on Mon Mar 12, 2012 7:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 17y/o Killed By Neighborhood Watch/CHL

#12

Post by RPB » Mon Mar 12, 2012 7:14 pm

WildBill wrote:
RPB wrote:I saw/ran across that incident yesterday or so.
All details aren't known, but it appears "Skittles guy" shouldn't have put Armed guy/CHL neighborhood watch captain on ground and beat on him to make his nose and back of his head bleed. And Neighborhood watch guy learned that yelling help real loudly over and over.... doesn't bring any help sometimes.

At this point, it's a "he said" deal, but with some physical evidence to corroborate neighborhood watch guy's story.
Put yourself in the "skittle guy's" shoes. You are walking home eating skittles and minding your own business and some suspicious looking old man guy starts to follow you. You tell him to leave you alone and continue to walk home. He continues to follow you. You tell him to get lost and mind his own business. He continues to stalk you. You turn around and you see the old man pointing a gun at you. You fear for your life and punch him the nose. The old guy he falls to the ground. You try to disarm him by hitting him in the face and head. Then he shoots you.
Or:
Neighborhood watch guy sees guy walking who fits description of person who has been flattening tires and spraypainting peoples' cars at night walking along with a paper bag which appears to be spray paint and a huffing bag.
Watchman keeps his distance following skittles and calls 911.
While talking to 911 watchman loses sight of skittles dude so he runs up the block to see if he turned a corner so he can direct the Police.
Skittles dude was hiding in bushes and coldcocks the watchman in the back of the head with a rock then jumps on top of him in the wet grass and starts punching his nose ... Watchman pulls gun and stops the attack.... Police arrive.


Not enough info ...
Last edited by RPB on Mon Mar 12, 2012 7:16 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: 17y/o Killed By Neighborhood Watch/CHL

#13

Post by WildBill » Mon Mar 12, 2012 7:16 pm

RPB wrote:Not enough info ...
:iagree: , but I can speculate. ;-)
Hopefully, the police will sort it out.
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Re: 17y/o Killed By Neighborhood Watch/CHL

#14

Post by RPB » Mon Mar 12, 2012 7:21 pm

WildBill wrote:
RPB wrote:Not enough info ...
:iagree: , but I can speculate. ;-)
Hopefully, the police will sort it out.
:iagree: Too many unknowns ... I usually only post or tweet things where more details are known or easily figured out or there's a video. On "iffy" situations ... I can't judge by news reporters articles... because they are always soooo accurate :mrgreen:
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Re: 17y/o Killed By Neighborhood Watch/CHL

#15

Post by WildBill » Mon Mar 12, 2012 7:27 pm

Here's some more information about Mr. Zimmerman. :bigear:

WFTV found out Zimmerman was arrested in 2005 for battery on a law enforcement officer.

Martin's family only learned about Zimmerman's criminal past when WFTV told them. The news came as quite a shock for Martin's mother.

The family's attorney believes this is more reason the neighborhood watch leader should have been arrested when he shot and killed the teenager.

Zimmerman was arrested in 2005 on charges of battery on a law enforcement officer and resisting arrest with violence.

The case was dismissed, but Martin's mother said it should've been considered 11 days ago when Zimmerman shot and killed her son.

"You had a person with a prepotencytoward violence, or at least the appearance," family attorney Natalie Jackson said.

Sanford police knew about the arrest, but said again Friday that 28-year-old Zimmerman has been cooperative.

Zimmerman is a student at Seminole State College, where he is scheduled to start a criminal justice class on Monday.
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