North Texas motorists stoped by Feds to take DNA and blood

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Re: North Texas motorists stoped by Feds to take DNA and blo

#121

Post by suthdj » Fri Nov 22, 2013 9:31 pm

Well if we can just hire off duty LEO's to redirect traffic to our whim then lets hire some to prevent any cars from leaving the police station/jail/court house. That would be ok, right?
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Re: North Texas motorists stoped by Feds to take DNA and blo

#122

Post by texanjoker » Sat Nov 23, 2013 9:16 am

Oldgringo wrote:Where is the ACLU when you need 'em? Where is the free press? Where are the attorneys looking for somebody to sue? Where are the people running for public office? When is it going to stop raining and warm up?

That is a good point. The ACLU comes out where there is a civil rights violation. Maybe their lack of action says something. I would hope that the ACLU looks into an incident vs. jumping on the bandwagon based on one news story to see if there is any actual violation vs media hype. :thumbs2: .


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Re: North Texas motorists stoped by Feds to take DNA and blo

#123

Post by chasfm11 » Sat Nov 23, 2013 10:07 am

texanjoker wrote:
Oldgringo wrote:Where is the ACLU when you need 'em? Where is the free press? Where are the attorneys looking for somebody to sue? Where are the people running for public office? When is it going to stop raining and warm up?

That is a good point. The ACLU comes out where there is a civil rights violation. Maybe their lack of action says something. I would hope that the ACLU looks into an incident vs. jumping on the bandwagon based on one news story to see if there is any actual violation vs media hype. :thumbs2: .
The current study is 60 locations, 7,500 "volunteers" at something like 125 per event. Hardly a singular media hyped event. Here was a similar event in Alabama with a similar reaction - and another news source.
http://www.cnn.com/2013/06/19/us/drug-s ... index.html

For me the ACLU has a political agenda, not a mission to protect peoples rights. Sometimes those two coincide but not always. I agree with the causes that they take up less than 50% of the time. I don't expect them to take up this one.

I really have no issue if people want to participate in a Federal survey. More power to them Put up a sign and ask for volunteers. But to insure that the study is random, that won't work. People who might volunteer also might fall into a particular group, invalidating the survey sampling. So targets are selected based on the numbers and the power of the police is used to help "persuade" them.

I am a conspiracy theorist. I admit it. Then again, this year's information releases suggests that there is substance behind at least some of the concerns. I belong to one of the groups that was targeted by the IRS - that is real to me. I felt vindicated when the news was leaked that the nudie scanners COULD record results after vehement denials by the TSA. I won't belabor Fast and Furious. In short, there are very few of the Federal agencies that haven't been found to be cooking the books, manipulating data or outright violating the Constitution. Pick one and I'll send the information about . An people are willing to give up their DNA "anonymously" to a Federal agency? Again, more power to them but I'm not doing it and I'm not going to stand for a process that could use at least implied police force to try to make me. The time to fight over it is now, not when I'm along side the ride, surrounded officers who believe that I'm not complying with their commands fast enough. I've seen how that can turn out.

The job of the police is to deal with people who are exhibiting criminal behavior. The more that the police are called to act upon law abiding citizens, the more likely it is for a regrettable incident to occur.
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Re: North Texas motorists stoped by Feds to take DNA and blo

#124

Post by mojo84 » Sat Nov 23, 2013 11:13 am

chasfm11 wrote:
texanjoker wrote:
Oldgringo wrote:Where is the ACLU when you need 'em? Where is the free press? Where are the attorneys looking for somebody to sue? Where are the people running for public office? When is it going to stop raining and warm up?

That is a good point. The ACLU comes out where there is a civil rights violation. Maybe their lack of action says something. I would hope that the ACLU looks into an incident vs. jumping on the bandwagon based on one news story to see if there is any actual violation vs media hype. :thumbs2: .
The current study is 60 locations, 7,500 "volunteers" at something like 125 per event. Hardly a singular media hyped event. Here was a similar event in Alabama with a similar reaction - and another news source.
http://www.cnn.com/2013/06/19/us/drug-s ... index.html

For me the ACLU has a political agenda, not a mission to protect peoples rights. Sometimes those two coincide but not always. I agree with the causes that they take up less than 50% of the time. I don't expect them to take up this one.

I really have no issue if people want to participate in a Federal survey. More power to them Put up a sign and ask for volunteers. But to insure that the study is random, that won't work. People who might volunteer also might fall into a particular group, invalidating the survey sampling. So targets are selected based on the numbers and the power of the police is used to help "persuade" them.

I am a conspiracy theorist. I admit it. Then again, this year's information releases suggests that there is substance behind at least some of the concerns. I belong to one of the groups that was targeted by the IRS - that is real to me. I felt vindicated when the news was leaked that the nudie scanners COULD record results after vehement denials by the TSA. I won't belabor Fast and Furious. In short, there are very few of the Federal agencies that haven't been found to be cooking the books, manipulating data or outright violating the Constitution. Pick one and I'll send the information about . An people are willing to give up their DNA "anonymously" to a Federal agency? Again, more power to them but I'm not doing it and I'm not going to stand for a process that could use at least implied police force to try to make me. The time to fight over it is now, not when I'm along side the ride, surrounded officers who believe that I'm not complying with their commands fast enough. I've seen how that can turn out.

The job of the police is to deal with people who are exhibiting criminal behavior. The more that the police are called to act upon law abiding citizens, the more likely it is for a regrettable incident to occur.

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Re: North Texas motorists stoped by Feds to take DNA and blo

#125

Post by jmra » Sat Nov 23, 2013 11:17 am

"The job of the police is to deal with people who are exhibiting criminal behavior. The more that the police are called to act upon law abiding citizens, the more likely it is for a regrettable incident to occur."

:iagree:
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Re: North Texas motorists stoped by Feds to take DNA and blo

#126

Post by Jason K » Sun Nov 24, 2013 3:09 pm

And what would happen if a driver refused to detour & drove through the barricade?.....

....we may find out soon....

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Re: North Texas motorists stoped by Feds to take DNA and blo

#127

Post by jmra » Sun Nov 24, 2013 3:16 pm

Jason K wrote:And what would happen if a driver refused to detour & drove through the barricade?.....

....we may find out soon....
I'm sure they would charge the driver with something completely unrelated to the unethical (possibly illegal) behavior of the off duty "public servants" in question.
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Re: North Texas motorists stoped by Feds to take DNA and blo

#128

Post by Right2Carry » Sun Nov 24, 2013 4:14 pm

Let me see if I understand this correctly. The LEO's did nothing wrong yet they FORCED innocent civilians who were doing no wrong off the roadway into a parking lot to participate in a voluntary survey? I am unclear how FORCING motorists into a parking lot by LEO without probable cause or reasonable suspicion isn't some sort civil rights violation. These individuals were DIRECTED by LEO off the roadway into a parking lot to be SOLICITED by some type of government entity. However you cut this it appears to be an abuse of power by the LEO's involved and a full investigation should be initiated into those individuals who authorized this illegal activity under the pretense of a survey.
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Re: North Texas motorists stoped by Feds to take DNA and blo

#129

Post by jmra » Sun Nov 24, 2013 5:22 pm

Right2Carry wrote:Let me see if I understand this correctly. The LEO's did nothing wrong yet they FORCED innocent civilians who were doing no wrong off the roadway into a parking lot to participate in a voluntary survey? I am unclear how FORCING motorists into a parking lot by LEO without probable cause or reasonable suspicion isn't some sort civil rights violation. These individuals were DIRECTED by LEO off the roadway into a parking lot to be SOLICITED by some type of government entity. However you cut this it appears to be an abuse of power by the LEO's involved and a full investigation should be initiated into those individuals who authorized this illegal activity under the pretense of a survey.
:iagree: pretty much black and white. But I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for an investigation.
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Re: North Texas motorists stoped by Feds to take DNA and blo

#130

Post by talltex » Sun Nov 24, 2013 9:08 pm

Right2Carry wrote:Let me see if I understand this correctly. The LEO's did nothing wrong yet they FORCED innocent civilians who were doing no wrong off the roadway into a parking lot to participate in a voluntary survey? I am unclear how FORCING motorists into a parking lot by LEO without probable cause or reasonable suspicion isn't some sort civil rights violation. These individuals were DIRECTED by LEO off the roadway into a parking lot to be SOLICITED by some type of government entity. However you cut this it appears to be an abuse of power by the LEO's involved and a full investigation should be initiated into those individuals who authorized this illegal activity under the pretense of a survey.
I don't think they actually FORCED anyone off the road against their will...but I think it is definitely a form of COERCION, just because they are Police Officers standing there...by Patrol vehicles, with flashing lights, motioning certain drivers to divert from the traffic flow. In most cases, no one is going to stop in the road and start questioning if they have the authority to do so...because the public has been told for years that they should "never argue with a Police Officer, just do what they tell you". That's the whole point of the Contractor hiring the off duty Officers to divert traffic...they know people will comply, just as they know most people would ignore them and drive on by if THEY stood on the side of the road with a sign ASKING for volunteers.
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Re: North Texas motorists stoped by Feds to take DNA and blo

#131

Post by jmra » Sun Nov 24, 2013 9:16 pm

talltex wrote:
Right2Carry wrote:Let me see if I understand this correctly. The LEO's did nothing wrong yet they FORCED innocent civilians who were doing no wrong off the roadway into a parking lot to participate in a voluntary survey? I am unclear how FORCING motorists into a parking lot by LEO without probable cause or reasonable suspicion isn't some sort civil rights violation. These individuals were DIRECTED by LEO off the roadway into a parking lot to be SOLICITED by some type of government entity. However you cut this it appears to be an abuse of power by the LEO's involved and a full investigation should be initiated into those individuals who authorized this illegal activity under the pretense of a survey.
I don't think they actually FORCED anyone off the road against their will...but I think it is definitely a form of COERCION, just because they are Police Officers standing there...by Patrol vehicles, with flashing lights, motioning certain drivers to divert from the traffic flow. In most cases, no one is going to stop in the road and start questioning if they have the authority to do so...because the public has been told for years that they should "never argue with a Police Officer, just do what they tell you". That's the whole point of the Contractor hiring the off duty Officers to divert traffic...they know people will comply, just as they know most people would ignore them and drive on by if THEY stood on the side of the road with a sign ASKING for volunteers.
According to one of the victims she told the officer she wanted to go straight and was told she couldn't. So yes they did force people off the road.
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Re: North Texas motorists stoped by Feds to take DNA and blo

#132

Post by MasterOfNone » Mon Nov 25, 2013 12:03 am

I wonder if a Burger King owner could hire off-duty officers to direct motorists into his drive-thru. They wouldn't be forced to buy anything; they could just say they're not interested and move on.
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Re: North Texas motorists stoped by Feds to take DNA and blo

#133

Post by Cedar Park Dad » Mon Nov 25, 2013 8:06 am

jmra wrote:
Right2Carry wrote:Let me see if I understand this correctly. The LEO's did nothing wrong yet they FORCED innocent civilians who were doing no wrong off the roadway into a parking lot to participate in a voluntary survey? I am unclear how FORCING motorists into a parking lot by LEO without probable cause or reasonable suspicion isn't some sort civil rights violation. These individuals were DIRECTED by LEO off the roadway into a parking lot to be SOLICITED by some type of government entity. However you cut this it appears to be an abuse of power by the LEO's involved and a full investigation should be initiated into those individuals who authorized this illegal activity under the pretense of a survey.
:iagree: pretty much black and white. But I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for an investigation.
:iagree: agreed on both points made above.


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Re: North Texas motorists stoped by Feds to take DNA and blo

#134

Post by Cedar Park Dad » Mon Nov 25, 2013 8:11 am

MasterOfNone wrote:I wonder if a Burger King owner could hire off-duty officers to direct motorists into his drive-thru. They wouldn't be forced to buy anything; they could just say they're not interested and move on.

Well, I think I just discovered a new way to get more foot traffic into our church. Just close off 620 and Steiner Ranch and move all traffic through the parking lot. You can leave if you show a pew sheet and can summarize the sermon... :thumbs2:

They say God works in mysterious ways...

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Re: North Texas motorists stoped by Feds to take DNA and blo

#135

Post by jmra » Mon Nov 25, 2013 9:07 am

Cedar Park Dad wrote:
MasterOfNone wrote:I wonder if a Burger King owner could hire off-duty officers to direct motorists into his drive-thru. They wouldn't be forced to buy anything; they could just say they're not interested and move on.

Well, I think I just discovered a new way to get more foot traffic into our church. Just close off 620 and Steiner Ranch and move all traffic through the parking lot. You can leave if you show a pew sheet and can summarize the sermon... :thumbs2:

They say God works in mysterious ways...
Of course right before they leave the parking lot you could have a few more officers holding offering buckets.
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