TexasCHLforum.com

mamabearCali wrote:

gdanaher wrote:There are those amongst us whose health is so poor that they, until recently, did not qualify for any kind of health insurance, at any price. I know this to be true because for a long time, one of my children who inherited a bad set of genes from his birth parents, could not find any company to cover him, at any price. Yes, his medical problems are quite expensive. He lucked into a job offering a group policy that accepted preexisting conditions. Not everyone is so lucky. As you critique the health care system, keep in mind that it could be any one of you with similar issues and thank G-d that it isn't you.

There are solutions to hard situations like this. We as a people should find those soutions. However this law will likely not help him in the end. Rationing of care is in this bill, it will be people like him that will be affected most. So is law will deprive me and mine of freedom of choice and will likely not give your son the help he needs.

There are and have been solutions for this. In my late teens and early twenties I opted not to pay for healthcare. I tore an ACL in my knee and had to find a doctor who would operate on an uninsured patient and made payments to him.
Two other people I know who had no insurance due to job losses received very good care at county hospitals.

AEA wrote:

psijac wrote:I think we get to have all of today to kick ourselves around but tomorrow, we pick ourselves up and continue the fight. No cause is ever truly lost because no cause is ever truly won

One was in 1775-1783!

Just think, the Boston Tea Party was about taxes. Taxes that were MUCH LOWER than they are today.

And here I though the people on the site were smart. I cannot believe so many "smart" people are still buying into the lies of the right wing media machine.

I can't believe what I am seeing go on in our country. Sad day for our country.

snatchel wrote:

BillT wrote:Yipeeeeeeee I'm beginning to think there is hope for this country!!! What a great day for America. So many children with very serious, life threatening diseases, and who don't know a thing about politics where just granted the opportunity of life. Maybe this country is beginning to find it's moral compass! For those of you that are upset by this I suggest you consider that we are not Human Beings having a Spiritual experience but that we are Spiritual beings having a Human experience...

You apparently don't know a thing about politics. We would all love to see everyone insured, but I for one will NOT support universal healthcare insurance at the espense of liberty.

Nor does he know a thing about the original CS Lewis quote (IIRC, which was ripped off by Dr. Wayne W. Dyer) which said that "we are created eternal beings having a temporary human experience." And when God, in the form of Jesus, in the Bible commands us to take care of "the least of these," he is telling us that each one of us, as individuals, should be living charitably toward the less fortunate. God loves a cheerful giver, the operative word being "giver," not "taxpayer." One is done from the heart. The other is done by government mandate without involving the heart. You're distorting what the Bible says, and I can tell you without even having to think about it for one minute which one God values more. But if you're going to frame it in religious terms, are you then arguing that Congress CAN establish religion and ban the free choice to NOT exercise it? Your statement is full of holes and entirely illogical sir. And if charity is your aim, then increase the amount you give. Nobody is stopping you. Give at least 10% of your pretax income, if not more. There is no law against it. But to insist that someone who doesn't share your spiritual inclinations must also be required to tithe for spiritual reasons is on its face and in its core unconstitutional AND immoral.

And by the way, just what "opportunity of life" are you talking about that children were lacking that they now receive? You won't be able to provide a single factual example of a child left high and dry by the healthcare system. That's just feel good nonsense.

The Mad Moderate wrote:And here I though the people on the site were smart. I cannot believe so many "smart" people are still buying into the lies of the right wing media machine.

And I can't believe you're calling us stupid to our faces. Nice.

The Annoyed Man wrote:

The Mad Moderate wrote:And here I though the people on the site were smart. I cannot believe so many "smart" people are still buying into the lies of the right wing media machine.

And I can't believe you're calling us stupid to our faces. Nice.

You called me the enemy of America.

The Mad Moderate wrote:And here I though the people on the site were smart. I cannot believe so many "smart" people are still buying into the lies of the right wing media machine.

This may be a useless exercise, and please don't see this as an attack, but could you enumerate and explain what right wing media lies that the other posters have bought in to? You could even just do the top three.


Such as:

#1> Do you believe this is NOT a tax?

You can choose the rest...


PS...In the future when you choose to call a group stupid, I would double check grammar and spelling before hitting the old submit button.

I can't believe some people think being a proud gun owner and a liberal somehow go together and make sense. But Hitler was a vegetarian. He couldn't stand to see animals killed. Jews were OK.

The Mad Moderate wrote:And here I though the people on the site were smart. I cannot believe so many "smart" people are still buying into the lies of the right wing media machine.

I'm not listening to the media. I'm listening to my friends who own or work for companies that are going to start dropping their coverage. I'm watching the diminishing opportunities for my wife in the medical field. I'm seeing the suppressing effect this massive bill has had on the economy.

But you go ahead and believe what you'd like.

steveincowtown wrote:

The Mad Moderate wrote:And here I though the people on the site were smart. I cannot believe so many "smart" people are still buying into the lies of the right wing media machine.

This may be a useless exercise, and please don't see this as an attack, but could you enumerate and explain what right wing media lies that the other posters have bought in to? You could even just do the top three.


Such as:

#1> Do you believe this is NOT a tax?

You can choose the rest...


PS...In the future when you choose to call a group stupid, I would double check grammar and spelling before hitting the old submit button.

1. Yes it is a Tax I cannot dispute that.
2. There is no rationing of care http://www.politifact.com/ohio/statemen ... -can-rati/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
3.It is NOT a government takeover of healthcare http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter ... nment-tak/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
4. You will not go to jail for not buying health insurance http://www.politifact.com/virginia/stat ... lth-care-/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
5. There are and never will be "Death panels" http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter ... ath-panel/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

A few observations:

1. This law will end up making health care less available rather than more available since it takes away much of a physician's professional discretion. Also, I predict that med school enrollments will decrease because of that fact, reducing the supply of physicians.

2. Because of #1, above, healthcare will be rationed based on age.

3. People should expect to have a 5 to 10 year shorter life expectency.

4. I will "Remember in November".

5. With health records now available to the feds, the anti-gun crowd will be better able to use them to declare people unfit to own a gun.

6. People who value their liberty should "Remember in November".

7. The House and Senate elections become much more important. If opponents to this legislation can get veto-proof majorities in the House and Senate, then we can still put this mess in the garbage can where it belongs.

What Obama wants is for liberals to have free healthcare and for conservatives to pay for it. It's called buying votes with free stuff. Mad liberal moderates have been doing it for years.

This whole issue is not about health care and never has been. It's about politics and control. The more a political party doles out in benefits, by whatever means justify the end, the more votes it will get until it reaches a point of absolute control in the Nanny State. The cradle to grave care is turning the safety net into the backyard hammock. Once there it's too late to turn back, and individual freedom is lost. End of story.

psijac wrote:Any expanse of power comes with an abuse of that power. Can gun owners now be taxed at 100% their income for owning a gun?

Theoretically.....but not likely....after all, the SC and Congress are not unreasonable, so I doubt they'd impose a tax for that reason that would exceed 50% of income, 75% at most.