TexasCHLforum.com

Just in case anyone thinks a 3" gun can't be accurate. This target is from the first time out with this little rascal.

Cheap WWB @ 10 yds. off the hood of my truck with a folded up towel for a rest.

3/4" group outside to outside. Five rounds from each mag. (10 shot group not 5). Honest to goodness!

flintknapper wrote:Just in case anyone thinks a 3" gun can't be accurate. This target is from the first time out with this little rascal.
Cheap WWB @ 10 yds. off the hood of my truck with a folded up towel for a rest.
3/4" group outside to outside. Five rounds from each mag. (10 shot group not 5). Honest to goodness!

Yeah, i was shocked how accurate the little Kimber was. I wont group tight but at 25yds i can hit a 8" circle freehand everytime. I am sure a better shooter could group it a lot tighter.

rx9790 wrote:I dont carry one in the chamber 99% of the time anyway. If i know I am going into a possibly bad place or situation then i cock and lock it. I also switch to a Commander model with full hammer. As long as it is pointed in a safe direction why would lowering the hammer be unsafe?

Cocked and locked is "Condition One-and-Only." I'm with Col. Cooper, Clint Smith, John Farnam, and others on this.

Condition Three is chamber empty, hammer down. It's advocated in the Israeli Instinctive Shooting method. You have to cycle the slide to chamber a round, and that takes two hands and a split-second more time. In urban conflict you may need your offhand to fend off an attack while you present your handgun. If you're left hand is blocking a knife attack, your gun becomes nothing more than a club.

Condition Two is chamber loaded, hammer down. On a 1911, this requires you to cock the hammer with your thumb before firing. Not a good defensive tactic because it takes extra time and it necessitates you employ a significant degree of fine-motor dexterity under stress.

Condition Two also requires you to carefully pull the trigger as you use your offhand thumb to lower the hammer over a loaded chamber before returning the gun to its holster. Manually manipulating the hammer over a loaded chamber is, by definition, very dangerous. It is an invitation to a negligent discharge. Trying to manually lower the hammer over a loaded chamber bypasses all the mechanical safeties of the firearm.

Skiprr wrote:

rx9790 wrote:I dont carry one in the chamber 99% of the time anyway. If i know I am going into a possibly bad place or situation then i cock and lock it. I also switch to a Commander model with full hammer. As long as it is pointed in a safe direction why would lowering the hammer be unsafe?

Condition Two is chamber loaded, hammer down. On a 1911, this requires you to cock the hammer with your thumb before firing. Not a good defensive tactic because it takes extra time and it necessitates you employ a significant degree of fine-motor dexterity under stress.
all the mechanical safeties of the firearm.

I train with it both drawing C&L (IDPA is always C&L) and thumbing the trigger so hopefully if needed training will kick in. I know others may disagree but I still prefer hammer down on a live round. I just feel safer and thumbing the trigger or safety, in my case, is about the same time. I have lowered hammers thousands of times probably over the years and had 1 ND. It was on a DE .50 no less, slippery little hammer and sweaty hand. But years of pointing in a safe direction made a big hole in the ground 5 feet away.
i know it may seem silly to some but I have heard the most frightnening sound is a shotgun racking. Well to me, close behind is a hammer clicking back. BG's watch too much tv and that sound in a bad situation might change their mind and prevent me from having to take a life. I try to stay aware of my surroundings, especially where i work and shouldnt need to get into a 1 arm defensive situation. But it could happen and hopefully fate and 1000's spent on ammo & training will help me.

If one wishes to carry with the hammer down, there are a number of fine DA pistols on the market.

cbr600 wrote:If one wishes to carry with the hammer down, there are a number of fine DA pistols on the market.

He doesn't even have to go DA, he can install Cylinder & Slide's "SFS" kit on his 1911 and be done.

Alternately, the pistol I posted earlier in this thread is an LDA (Light Double Action)...BUT it is not actually a true double action pistol. It is better thought of as: A 1911 that allows hammer down carry.

As previously stated, when you rack the slide on an LDA it is "Cocked and Locked" internally. Pulling the trigger moves the hammer rearward in preparation of striking the firing pin....but the sear is not tripped until the trigger reaches the last bit of it's stroke.

Its like shooting a single action with a long take-up.

My personal feeling about carrying a traditional 1911 is that it should always be carried in Condition 1. If you are uncomfortable (for any reason) doing this, then you need a different style pistol.

I believe this issue was well discussed here recently.

Good input from everyone.

rx9790 wrote:I dont carry one in the chamber 99% of the time anyway. If i know I am going into a possibly bad place or situation then i cock and lock it. I also switch to a Commander model with full hammer. As long as it is pointed in a safe direction why would lowering the hammer be unsafe?

Because it's always possible to make a mistake while doing this and light off a round.

FWIW, I carry my Commander model cocked & locked. But I also take pains to AVOID bad places or situations if at all possible (and it almost always is).

flintknapper, thanks for the pictures of the books, going to read the concealed handgun manual.

striker55 wrote:flintknapper, thanks for the pictures of the books, going to read the concealed handgun manual.

It was easily the best of the bunch in terms of being all inclusive.

Although my daughter is a voracious reader, I doubt she read every word of every book. I quizzed her about the content of each... and she was ready with an answer for each of my questions. So, I guess she actually did her "homework".

Well, I've got to get ready for my trip to Houston now....see you guys later (God willing).