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Would I?...In a heartbeat.

I guess it's unanimous so far.
.......draw, aim and fire......

yep, without hesitation.

DoubleJ wrote:thing is, with a kid that young, they may have NO idea the consequences of their actions! they may be just going through the motions they've seen their friends, "mentors" do. Or more likely, the actions of some GrandTheftAuto mentality...

I have to disagree here…Strike that. I should say that this mindset does not always apply. Without trying to explain the different mindsets one might encounter, I submit the following: You don't get to know the background of the person threatening to kill you. You don't get to know his/her mindset. All you have to influence your judgment are his/her immediate actions.

Furthermore, the problem assumed by the OP is that your life or the life of a third person is in immediate danger. If immediate action is needed to prevent serious bodily injury or death, the question of the actor’s mindset and/or its origin is irrelevant. You don't have time to decide whether or not this is just a "kid" who thinks the world is one big GTA game or if the monster before you is a full-blown, narcissistic, sociopath who has decided he will take what he wants from this world, when he wants it, how he wants it and does not care who has to die to get it. If you can honestly look into a “child’s� eyes to see the difference before that child makes a canoe of your skull with the gun in his hand, then you are a better man than me.

Someone threating your life has no age. Did anyone see the little league world series this year with the kids that were 11-12 that were 6 foot and taller???

When the minor makes an adult decision he shall suffer adult consequences.

G.C.Montgomery wrote:

DoubleJ wrote:thing is, with a kid that young, they may have NO idea the consequences of their actions! they may be just going through the motions they've seen their friends, "mentors" do. Or more likely, the actions of some GrandTheftAuto mentality...

I have to disagree here…Strike that. I should say that this mindset does not always apply. Without trying to explain the different mindsets one might encounter, I submit the following: You don't get to know the background of the person threatening to kill you. You don't get to know his/her mindset. All you have to influence your judgment are his/her immediate actions.

Furthermore, the problem assumed by the OP is that your life or the life of a third person is in immediate danger. If immediate action is needed to prevent serious bodily injury or death, the question of the actor’s mindset and/or its origin is irrelevant. You don't have time to decide whether or not this is just a "kid" who thinks the world is one big GTA game or if the monster before you is a full-blown, narcissistic, sociopath who has decided he will take what he wants from this world, when he wants it, how he wants it and does not care who has to die to get it. If you can honestly look into a “child’s� eyes to see the difference before that child makes a canoe of your skull with the gun in his hand, then you are a better man than me.

Well said!

G.C.Montgomery wrote:You don't have time to decide whether or not this is just a "kid" who thinks the world is one big GTA game or if the monster before you is a full-blown, narcissistic, sociopath who has decided he will take what he wants from this world, when he wants it, how he wants it and does not care who has to die to get it.

I was intending to mean that those two examples are one and the same.
of course, I agree that you do not have time to consider anything save for what is directly in front of you at that moment.

I was saying, or at least intending to say that I would almost consider a punk kid more dangerous, because they have no idea how much bull hits the fan because of these types of incidents.
He may not have any clue how shooting someone will affect him psychologically, whereas most of us have considered that.

I believe we are on the same side of the argument, however I fear my message is not making it from my brain to my fingers

wouldn't be the first time....

DoubleJ wrote:

G.C.Montgomery wrote:You don't have time to decide whether or not this is just a "kid" who thinks the world is one big GTA game or if the monster before you is a full-blown, narcissistic, sociopath who has decided he will take what he wants from this world, when he wants it, how he wants it and does not care who has to die to get it.

I was intending to mean that those two examples are one and the same.
of course, I agree that you do not have time to consider anything save for what is directly in front of you at that moment.

I was saying, or at least intending to say that I would almost consider a punk kid more dangerous, because they have no idea how much bull hits the fan because of these types of incidents.
He may not have any clue how shooting someone will affect him psychologically, whereas most of us have considered that.

I believe we are on the same side of the argument, however I fear my message is not making it from my brain to my fingers

wouldn't be the first time....

Basically a younger person is not going to think twice before pulling the trigger casue in his mind he will be able to hit the reset button and do it all over again.

Something like that right.

DoubleJ wrote:...I believe we are on the same side of the argument, however I fear my message is not making it from my brain to my fingers ...

Agreed, we are on the same side...And your point was made. However, for the purposes of this discussion I felt it necessary to emphasize to all that the moment of truth is not the time to dither on what might be motivating your threat. I recognize there are "kids" making adult decisions without a full understanding of the consequences. The child who set off the fire-suppression system in a helicopter hanger yesterday is a prime example. Like you, I think there are kids who are so immersed in a world that's supposed to "entertain" them that they don't get the consequences of what they are doing. So, on this we agree...This type of "child," the GTA child, is very dangerous indeed. What makes them truly dangerous is they may look like YOUR kid and you may not act appropriately as a result.

Still, the second "child" I described, I think is a totally different personality. Going well beyond the GTA mindset, these "kids" are fully aware of the consequences of their decisions, and for a variety of reasons, just don't care. I grew up with a number of kids with this mindset. Many processed into juvenile detention at some point. However, the result was that they left the system as bigger, meaner felons and their only growth was in physical strength and criminal skill sets. These are goal oriented, violent criminal actors that I think make the most dangerous adversaries one can face. These are the "kids" who grow up to become professional predators.

No, absolutely not!!!

I only shoot to stop those who put my life or my loved ones' lives in danger.

I think I get where you are coming from, Stupid. I can't argue against it. But let me ask you this...If your loved ones were in a store without you and a scenario such as that described by the OP presented itself, how would you want a CHL holder to react? Lets get specific and say this "child" is threatening your spouse and/or child with a firearm. Do you want any CHL holder present to stand quietly by and let things take their natural course? Or would you prefer the CHL holder stop the threat?

If h's old enough to use a firearm to commit a crime he's old enough to pay the consequences,when you make a decision to draw don't let their age make you hesitate or you may be the oe getting shot

"Feral youth" can be a problem - if a person poses a real, credible and immediate threat of death or serious bodily harm, he IS a legitimate target, regardless of age, gender, or any other status.

A former member of the IDF told me a story about how his covoy was traveling somewhere in the Middle East, and a group of Arab kids waved to them; they waved back. After the first vehicle or two passed, the eldest bent down, picked up an RPG, and used it on one of the APCs.

Several troops died . . . the "kids" didn't survive the return fire from the rest of the convoy.

The eldest - the shooter - was about 12.

Richard Cuellar was a San Antonio police officer who was killed in the line of duty. A 12 year old boy had tried to run from another officer when they got him out of the car behind the police station. Somehow he got a gun (I do not know the whole story since it was before I was on the department) and killed Officer Cuellar when he tried to help stop the escape.

Yes, I would shoot a 12 year old with a gun.