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Re: Rifle POA vs POI at Close Quarters

Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2009 11:05 am
by sneedb82
The Annoyed Man wrote:
sneedb82 wrote:So going through the scenarios, what do you think we should do with our ARs in terms of sighting in.... 25 yards is pretty much the standard, just work at practicing closer quarters shooting and muscle-memory (brain and otherwise) that we need to aim 1" higher closer than 25 yards?

This is great information... You don't find this info everyday.
I think that in most situations, 1" higher or lower (or left or right) isn't going to make a bit of difference if you are shooting to center of mass with an AR15. Rifle rounds are simply devastating - even smaller lower power rounds like the 5.56/.223 - when compared to pistol rounds. I would MUCH rather be shot by a pistol than a rifle... ...if I am to be shot at all. Your bigger problem when shooting an AR, most particularly inside the home, is over-penetration if you are shooting FMJ ammo. If you are going to use an AR for inside the home defense, then some kind of soft tip/hollowpoint/frangible ammo would be the preferable load.

Think COM in HD situations. Now, can I hit a human head sized target with my AR at any distance inside of my home? Absolutely, and easily - with precision, slow, aimed fire to an immobile target. But in a HD shooting situation, you're not likely to have that luxury, and even with an accurate weapon like an AR15, you're going to be hard pressed to hit a moving target the size of a human head. It is a lot harder than you think it is. And when you factor in other things like poor light, your own physiological reactions to the adrenaline dump, the presence of other family members (and their mental/physical conditions at the moment), and anything else which is likely to contribute to the chaos of the moment, shooting to the largest, and therefore easiest to hit, target is the only thing that makes any kind of sense. That would be the center of mass.

At least that's my 2ยข.
Exactly my point... CM is the best and operable point of Aim/Impact. I use 55gr Vmax in my .223 bolt action, but plan on using the same in the AR. I've seen the damage a 40gr will do to raccoons and rabbits, and I'd hate to see what it would do to a human being. Pigs as well. It's crazy the type of damage done inside without over penetration. 55gr the same thing. Nosler and Barnes do pretty well as well, from what I've heard.

Like you said, i'd rather (if the situation comes to it) be shot with a pistol. A shield situation would be a difficult predicament nonetheless. I guess practicing in make shift scenarios would serve as a good thing to do from time to time to keep proficient with CQ shooting... even for animals (game)... so if the situation arises that you must shoot in a shield position with a family member serving as the BG's shield, the shot should be a little easier...

Like some SEAL told me one time... you train and train and train, and pray to go you don't have to use it. Some never do, but when they do, they better be able to commit! Words so true.

Re: Rifle POA vs POI at Close Quarters

Posted: Sun Sep 20, 2009 5:49 pm
by wford
In reference to taking the shot or not, I struggled with that question. Given that the loved one is in immediate danger do you take a shot that might go wrong.
Then someone gave me some great advice. Ask them. So I did, and without hesitation they said yes take the shot.

Re: Rifle POA vs POI at Close Quarters

Posted: Sun Sep 20, 2009 6:45 pm
by MoJo
austinrealtor wrote:
flb_78 wrote:I find amazing that someone thinks an AR15 should be their go-to gun in the event of a home invasion. That's pistol or shotgun territory to me.

With a rifle you obviously have very real fears of over penetration (of the BG or a wall) - hollow points, soft points, or best yet tactical plastic tips seem a must in HD situation.

A 55 gr FMJ out of an AR is going to penetrate LESS than a 115 gr FMJ bullet out of a 9mm and a lot less than a 1 oz slug out of a 12 ga. My HD ammo for my AR is 55 gr soft points the brand is less important than the bullet style followed by M193 Ball. None of my handguns have FMJ loaded in them for SD/HD. I have no heartburn using FMJ in the 5.56 for the same job. :thumbs2:

Re: Rifle POA vs POI at Close Quarters

Posted: Sun Sep 20, 2009 7:39 pm
by asleepatthereel
flb_78 wrote:I find amazing that someone thinks an AR15 should be their go-to gun in the event of a home invasion. That's pistol or shotgun territory to me.
:iagree: