TexasCHLforum.com

Well, figure out how to accomplish that in the legislature.

- Jim

We can definitely argue the philosophy behind the concept of licensing; relegating a right to an effective privilege. Right now, it is what it is. The state has trained thousands of instructors and created an industry of sorts. I enjoy what I do and it makes a few bucks. In the process, I feel like I'm passing on valuable information that would be difficult, if not impossible, to glean from an online video.

I don't really mind the fact that Oakridge is doing this, but as with anything else pertaining to government, I'm suspicious of the motives. Government seldom does anything solely for the public good. Somebody somewhere is usually getting paid.

Crossfire wrote:

joe817 wrote:

DoubleActionCHL wrote: The City of Southlake, north of Fort Worth, east of Dallas, south of Denton, offered a FREE CHL course available only to the residents of Southlake. It was a bare bones course. It did NOT offer: fingerprint services, passport photo services, range fees, lunch, ammo, handguns, etc, etc, etc. The only thing they offered was the course instruction itself; completed TR-100, affidivits, and notary. IMO that is a course woefully inadequate to fill the needs of anyone desiring to get a CHL.

That was actually Trophy Club, which shares a zip code with Roanoke, which is where I teach. Southlake is another 2 or 3 miles east. The Trophy Club PD where the class was taught is less than 5 miles from the Roanoke Recreation Center, where our classes are held. And Trophy Club is one of the wealthiest cities in Texas. I don't think they are doing it to "fill a need".

You're right...it's Trophy Club. I remembered that after I hopped into bed last night, after the computer was turned off.

If they are not trying to fill a need, then why are doing this? Trying to deliberately try to run CHL schools out of business?

If the people of Oak Ridge North apply for CHLs at the usual rate of about 0.5% annually, that means about 15 people a year. That's not going to put anyone out of business.

I've heard that CHL instructors have been expanding classes or turning away applicants for the last year. Is that still a trend?

- Jim

Although I agree that the Texas CHL licensing process needs to be improved, I don't think an online course/video can even come close to teaching as well as a knowledgeable instructor. I really don't like how everything is becoming so impersonal these days. I'd rather spend a little more time to make sure things are done right (or at least there is an effort to do things right) than make things quick and easy. I had 2 people in my class that didn't know the first thing about firearm safety or shooting that was trying for their CHL. The instructor was frustrated at their inability to follow basic instructions. Needless to say, they both failed the course. I'm afraid that if the state implements an online/video program, people that don't know the first thing about firearm safety or firearm use will be able to bypass the system and get their CHL. These types will do more harm than good. I believe that everyone should be able to defend themselves but there are those that just should not be allowed to carry UNTIL they become knowledgeable with firearms and safety. I know that it's not my call to make but if you saw how unsafe these people were, I think you'd understand.

I just think a living, breathing knowledgeable instructor will trump a video or online program any day. Without my instructor, I don't think I would have been as knowledgeable as I am now. He shared with the class his experiences and stories that helped reinforce what he had taught which helped with the learning process. This forum just helps enforce everything that I learned and continue to learn.

If the people of Oak Ridge North apply for CHLs at the usual rate of about 0.5% annually, that means about 15 people a year. That's not going to put anyone out of business.

If this isolated incident becomes widespread, and then generally accepted by PD's across the State to offer CHL classes, then you bet it will put CHL schools out of business. That's a mighty big if, and it's my contention that it won't.

I think an in-person course is the only way to assure that the person whose name and face are on the license is the person who took the course and passed the test. I also think the legislature is not going to accept anything less in the foreseeable future.

It was bad enough that they caught an instructor selling signed TR-100 forms a couple of years ago.

What they have in Vermont, New Hampshire, and Alaska is great. I just don't see it happening, with all the anti-RKBA forces in this state.

- Jim

joe817 wrote:If this isolated incident becomes widespread, and then generally accepted by PD's across the State to offer CHL classes, then you bet it will put CHL schools out of business. That's a mighty big if, and it's my contention that it won't.

In the case of these small towns, the course was probably taught by a volunteer on one day. I'm just guessing.* There's nothing about CHLs on their web site: http://www.oakridgenorth.com/index.aspx?NID=79" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

BTW, a CHL course can be taught only by a licensed instructor, who had to go to quite a bit of trouble and expense to become licensed. Instructors have to get paid either by students or an employer, aside from an occasional freebie.

A bigger city would have to spend a lot of money to provide CHL classes. There are enough anti-RKBA city council members to keep that from happening.

*Oops. The story that I originally linked to says

Four residents attended the September class, and 10 completed the October class. The next class runs Nov. 12-14 and costs $10.

It also says that nearby CHL instructors have been running full classes.

- Jim

Crossfire wrote:

joe817 wrote:

DoubleActionCHL wrote: The City of Southlake, north of Fort Worth, east of Dallas, south of Denton, offered a FREE CHL course available only to the residents of Southlake. It was a bare bones course. It did NOT offer: fingerprint services, passport photo services, range fees, lunch, ammo, handguns, etc, etc, etc. The only thing they offered was the course instruction itself; completed TR-100, affidivits, and notary. IMO that is a course woefully inadequate to fill the needs of anyone desiring to get a CHL.

That was actually Trophy Club, which shares a zip code with Roanoke, which is where I teach. Southlake is another 2 or 3 miles east. The Trophy Club PD where the class was taught is less than 5 miles from the Roanoke Recreation Center, where our classes are held. And Trophy Club is one of the wealthiest cities in Texas. I don't think they are doing it to "fill a need".

Shoot. You're right up the road. As an aside, does anyone know what the thinking is behind requiring prints every time? I've been printed for the Army, again when I got my clearance, as a commissioned security guard, as a fireman, homeland security clearance and police records clearance and once for a temporary access to FBI facilities. With all that I have been printed a half dozen times or so (lost count) for CHL.

Not that I am upset, but it just seems terribly redundant. Any insight?

I called Oak Ridge on a tangentially related matter, and the detective who handles the CHL classes asked me if I was an Oak Ridge resident before I had a chance to explain I wasn't trying to sign up for the $10 class. IMO, that was a hint that they're not looking to offer this discount class to anyone outside of their jurisdiction.

I would not take a CHL course online. I much prefer a person for that kind of instruction.

HCC had a $50 CHL class back in the day. Half the price of the commercial ranges. Ten years later the commercial ranges are still in business. And still teaching CHL classes.