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If I was at gunpoint, and thought that they were not going to just take my wallet and let me go, I think I would pull the wallet out and either throw it off to the side, or throw it at the bad guys feet. Then when he goes for it, IF he goes for it, run like the dickens! I think it's harder to hit a moving target, and less likely to be seen as a threat to the BG as you are running away from him, and he has what he wants. To stand and try to draw on him I think would be a mistake. He already mentally has you pictured where you are standing, and the gun already pointing at you, and all he has to do is squeeze the trigger. I'd rather be viewed by BG as a non-threat that just wants to get away, than a threat that is standing in front of him trying to draw a weapon.

My plan: 1. Run. 2. Seek Cover 3. Prepare to defend myself should BG come after me. 4. Pray.

I was wondering how long the Collateral reference would take to be brought up.


http://www.texaschlforum.com/viewtopic. ... collateral" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[/quote] I have my 1911, 4:00, iwb, under a untucked shirt. Ghoul is 5-8ft. away with pistol drawn demanding my wallet or they'll shoot. No immediate cover or good route of escape.[/quote]
My two cents:
In this situation, if you decide to fight, you are likely better off trying to disarm the ghoul using open handed technique. Action is faster than reaction, but the process of reaching back, drawing, and raising the gun to fire would take too long and you would likely get shot. I would suggest stepping in and at least pushing aside his weapon as you draw yours. This is, of course, assuming that you believe that resistance is the best solution.

This is a case where a good pocket pistol in the front jacket would save the day. If you could reach into your jacket pocket and fire, you would be in a much better position than trying to draw from a holster.

Even with extra information on the hypothetical situation, there's a huge variable. Us.

You could have the exact same scenario and run 10 people through it and get 10 different best answers, depending on the person. Height/reach. Age. Weight. Training. Overall fitness. Weapons carried or available in the environment. Access to same. Mindset. Moral code. The list goes on.

Kawabuggy wrote:If I was at gunpoint, and thought that they were not going to just take my wallet and let me go, I think I would pull the wallet out and either throw it off to the side, or throw it at the bad guys feet. Then when he goes for it, IF he goes for it, run like the dickens! I think it's harder to hit a moving target, and less likely to be seen as a threat to the BG as you are running away from him, and he has what he wants. To stand and try to draw on him I think would be a mistake. He already mentally has you pictured where you are standing, and the gun already pointing at you, and all he has to do is squeeze the trigger. I'd rather be viewed by BG as a non-threat that just wants to get away, than a threat that is standing in front of him trying to draw a weapon.

My plan: 1. Run. 2. Seek Cover 3. Prepare to defend myself should BG come after me. 4. Pray.

Move #4 to #1.

From watching many real life videos of robberies on tape,
many times it seems like the robbers initially come in with
their gun drawn, cow the clerk into opening the drawer, and
then the BG starts focusing on the money in the cash drawer,
and having less situational awareness of the people in the store.

If you are a customer or the clerk present during such a robbery,
and you have decided to engage the BG with your gun, this would
be the time to draw. No warnings should be given to the BG at
this point - just open up on him with multiple rounds. IMHO.

SIA

joe817 wrote:

chabouk wrote:Video has a single not-safe-for-kids word, but this is a classic demonstration of drawing against gunpoint. Tom Cruise in Collateral:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jmKR6evZRQQ" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Excellent training video. But it takes practice to do it. Thanks for posting chabouk.

surprise_i'm_armed wrote:From watching many real life videos of robberies on tape,
many times it seems like the robbers initially come in with
their gun drawn, cow the clerk into opening the drawer, and
then the BG starts focusing on the money in the cash drawer,
and having less situational awareness of the people in the store.

If you are a customer or the clerk present during such a robbery,
and you have decided to engage the BG with your gun, this would
be the time to draw. No warnings should be given to the BG at
this point - just open up on him with multiple rounds. IMHO.

SIA

This reminds me of a scene out of the movie Taxi driver. I couldn't find a clip but this picture will ring a bell to anyone who has watched this movie.

Hoosier Daddy wrote:Even with extra information on the hypothetical situation, there's a huge variable. Us.

You could have the exact same scenario and run 10 people through it and get 10 different best answers, depending on the person. Height/reach. Age. Weight. Training. Overall fitness. Weapons carried or available in the environment. Access to same. Mindset. Moral code. The list goes on.

My way of thinking is that if the BG already has decided to kill me regardless of if I give in, then I'll probably get rounds my way either way. But if he has just drawn the gun to scare the victim into giving him the wallet, then they will not be expecting them to draw and will hesitate. But then again, I HOPE I'm never in this situation and have to decide... Though thinking about it now has helped me come up with several solutions and hopefully one will automatically take over if the situation ever happened.

samobius wrote:Personally, I would not.

However, in our Tae Kwon Do training, we were always taught that if we were being mugged, to take our wallet/purse and throw it behind the mugger. Then when they turn around, you run. It might be a chicken move, but armed vs unarmed you use that to save your life. Now, armed vs armed? I can see using that as a distraction move to draw.

Reality check

A man at arm’s length with an open knife in his hand, behind his leg, can cut your throat before you can pull your gun.
A man can still stab or shoot you even after being shot.

I am not saying it will happen, only it can happen.

Do what you have to but expect the unexpected.

I guess theses scenarios are for when one is alone. The issues get trickier when your with a loved one or friend. Unless I had some serious tactical advantage present itself, I would be hesitant to try to draw and fire on someone already pointing a gun at me. I just flat out don't have ninja training.

If you're within reach and the situation looks hopeless, go for his gun instead of yours. During a training exercise with local police a few years ago I actually managed that during a practice traffic stop when the driver pulled a gun on me... and I wasn't even thinking about it. As soon as that hand made a sharp movement my arm was already on top of her gun twisting it away. Pure reflex on my part. And it gave me time to draw my own weapon and start issuing commands.

It's obviously different with someone standing in front of you, but if it's your last resort you'll do anything to survive. Knocking the gun away for an instant can potentially give you enough time to draw and fire, which is why I'm a big proponent of carrying OWB when possible for one-handed draws.

YMMV.

If you're NOT within arm's length of his weapon and the situation again looks hopeless or severely dangerous, lateral movement can save your life. Have an escape route planned and move as quickly as possible while drawing. In a life or death situation I'd take a bullet in the arm over death.

You just have to get it implanted into your mind that you WON'T be a victim.

I reckon it's time to point out the fact that the cemetaries are full of folk who had the right of way. Similarly, the graveyards are full of folk who drew on a drawn gun.

That said, have at it me buckaroos, give 'em . This may be your lucky day.

VoiceofReason wrote:Reality check

If he already plans to execute you, I don't think fighting back will make it any worse.

boomerang wrote:If he already plans to execute you, I don't think fighting back will make it any worse.

Excellent point, excellent question!

We're re-watching Herman Wouk's 1980's TV miniseries "Winds of War" and "War and Remembrance". I can not, for the live of me, understand why the chosen ones did not resist. The end result could not have been any worse.

Same may be true for the scenario posted here.