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terryg wrote:I kinda thought PSC was rifle oriented shooting club. I didn't realize they had a pistol area.

PSC has about 8 different pistol ranges, along with a few rifle, bow, air soft and shotgun/clay target areas.
A very nice facility, but yes, as it is outdoor, it can be very very hot!

the offer stands to go shoot, just let me know (and you buy the ammo you want to shoot of course)

I actually have a Glock 19, 2 springfield XD9's and the Taurus PT111, so any of the above you can feel free to shoot.

You do not have to want to buy my PT111 in order to go shoot, I like to go shoot, so this would give me a reason to head out there as well!
Just PM me and we can work out the timing.

terryg wrote:I have adjusted my initial list based upon the feedback and some hands-on time with some of the models: Here is what I am considering (in no particular order):

Taurus Millennium
Springfield XD Subcompact
CZ 2075 Rami
Ruger SR9c
Bersa Thunder 9UC

terryg wrote:Adding the S&W M&P Compact to the list ...

Of that list, I'd take the XD in a heartbeat. The M&P would be a somewhat close second.
One thing interesting about the SR9 is that it's very thin for a double-stack. That makes it easier to conceal and makes it a little easier to handle for those of us who don't have large hands. I frequently suggested it to women and also to anyone looking for a hi-cap handgun that wasn't too bulky to conceal under light clothing.
We had that CZ in the store where I worked. Everyone loved it except me. I just couldn't warm up to it. Personal preference, as I'm sure it's a fine weapon. (I own a CZ rifle, which I love, so it's not a prejudice against the brand.)
No opinion on the Bersa Thunder. I'm not sure I've ever handled one.

terryg wrote:4. I think I like DA/SA. . . .

5. I like the 1911 style safety lever - I don't know what else to call it. A full sweep of the thumb near the first joint - it feels solid and natural.

When I was shopping for my first pistol, I thought the DA/SA was ideal. Many experienced shooters seemed to think the transition between the first shot feeling one way and the subsequent shots feeling different made trigger control difficult during rapid fire. I loved the pistol and had no trouble with the trigger, but eventually I decided that Jeff Cooper was right when he said that was a solution to a nonexistent problem.

I think that having the DA first shot and a manual safety which must be disengaged is unnecessary redundancy. Give me one or the other. There are multiple safeties built into modern pistols which make it virtually impossible for them to fire unless the trigger is actually pulled. I see the need for a thumb safety on something with a light trigger pull like a 1911.

I say XD also have 2 and they go boom no matter what I feed through them or how dirty they are. Reliability is crucial in a CCW as you know. I have a 40 and 45 luv them both. 45 is compact 4 inch and 40 is sub compact 3 inch.

M&P any caliber or any size. Shoots great and runs.

chartreuse wrote:I suspect that many of us will recommend one of our our regular carry weapons. In that vein, I'll throw my weight behind the Bersa 9mm UC.

It's DA/SA, has a manual safety (which is also a de-cocker), is fully ambidextrous and holds 13+1 in a surprisingly compact package. It's pretty accurate, for a small gun, too.

Do give some thought to your holster, as well. I keep mine in a Crossbreed Supertuck IWB, which works well for me, but something different may work best for you - sometimes you need to try a few out.

You forgot to mention reliable and inexpensive. You just can't beat the feel and performance of this handgun (especially the trigger). The only flaw/trade-off is that the finish is ugly. I keep mine hidden in my waistband, so I don't care about looks.

Embalmo

chartreuse wrote:I suspect that many of us will recommend one of our our regular carry weapons. In that vein, I'll throw my weight behind the Bersa 9mm UC.

It's DA/SA, has a manual safety (which is also a de-cocker), is fully ambidextrous and holds 13+1 in a surprisingly compact package. It's pretty accurate, for a small gun, too.

Do give some thought to your holster, as well. I keep mine in a Crossbreed Supertuck IWB, which works well for me, but something different may work best for you - sometimes you need to try a few out.

Bersa 9 UC (Ultra Compact) - 13 rounds in mag plus 1 in pipe - about $300-350 new. Not a cheap gun but an inexpensive one that is made in Argentina and used extensively in South America by police and military. I'm so impressed with Bersa value. See bersachat.com for a great community of Bersa owners with excellent information.

Remember that you get what you pay for, inexpensive guns are inexpensive for a reason. It is worth saving a bit longer and getting a quality handgun. The XD's and M&P are both very good. You can also get the Sig P250 for around the same price, that might be worth a look as well.

Embalmo wrote:You forgot to mention reliable and inexpensive. You just can't beat the feel and performance of this handgun (especially the trigger). The only flaw/trade-off is that the finish is ugly. I keep mine hidden in my waistband, so I don't care about looks.

I did, indeed, forget to mention that. It's superb value for money.

Salty1 wrote:Remember that you get what you pay for, inexpensive guns are inexpensive for a reason. It is worth saving a bit longer and getting a quality handgun. The XD's and M&P are both very good. You can also get the Sig P250 for around the same price, that might be worth a look as well.

But sometimes what you're paying for is a brand name, like with sunglasses or sneakers. I certainly don't think that less expensive necessarily means inferior.

my brother bought a ruger sr9c and its been really reliable and really accurate got it for like 350 at the gun show in pasadena, so im sure you can find it for about the same price at any of the gun shows round houston

I want to thank you all for the suggestions and guidance you have given me. I had a great time at the Hi-Caliber show at the GRB. It was a pleasure meeting SecedeTX and SRVA and chatting with them for a while.

It was a little harder to compare models than I anticipated. Even though I have been to several shows before, I have never been on a focused mission to compare various specific models. They are, of course, not located right by each other and with the security cable and tie wraps, it gets really hard to compare. Plus, all of the sub compacts are too small for my hands w/o the magazines. So its hard to get a good feel how they would shoot sans the mags.

But overall we didn't do too bad.

This was my hit list:

Taurus Millennium
Springfield XD Subcompact
CZ 2075 Rami
Ruger SR9c
Bersa Thunder 9UC
S&W M&P Compact

Functionally, I probably liked the XD the best. But the XD, the Millennium, and the M&P all seem really wide at the slide. I wasn't hating them - but I didn't love them either. I have large hands, but somehow they just seem wider than I'd like. I didn't care for the CZ Rami - although I can't quite put my finger on why. The Bersa was very hard to find in a 9 and when I did, it seemed a bit heavy. The one I liked best as far as feel in my hands is the SR9c.

Turns out my FIL had bought a full size SR9 at a show several months ago - but he had never fired it. (I knew he bought a Ruger, but I didn't know what model.) So we went and put 70+ rounds through it and it felt pretty good. His mag button is *really* tight though. I need to research that for him a little bit - it was way tighter than it should be. We also shot his Judge for the first time with 45LC and 410 shells - that was a total blast!!!!

He also picked up a Fobus Paddle holster for it at the show which is great because I was considering a Blade-Tech paddle. Once we got home and cleaned the weapons, I tried the holster a bit and got a little discouraged. I know his SR9 was full size, but the only position I that didn't print horribly was about 5:00. Anything from 2:30 - 4:30 stuck out like zit on prom night. I don't mind 5:00 when walking around - but there is no way I could sit with it there.

Also, the gun was also not very stable on my hip - it wobbled quite a bit as I walked. I wasn't wearing a 'gun belt' but it is a new leather belt. It's pretty wide (1.5 inches) and stout belt - I don't really see how a gun belt could be any different. So my concern is that I am just not built - or don't yet dress - in a way that can support anything largish in an OWB carry. And I am pretty sure that I don't want to IWB carry.

So anyway, I think my list is now :

Ruger SR9c
Springfield XD Subcompact
S&W M&P Compact
(With the Taurus Millennium in 4th runner up position if the others don't pan out.)

I will work on trying to shoot each of these to get a better feel. I also continue to investigate other carry options as I suspect that OWB paddle will not work well for me.

Oh yeah - while at the range, a constable let me fire his .40 Glock (I think it was a G22??).

I gotta say to all you Glock fan boys out there - it was pretty nice. It was nice, confident, solid shooting, the rounds went right where I was aiming. In fact, my group was in the red and a bit tighter than the LEO's. I felt a little guilty - but he just said "good eye" or something like that.

Out of the updated list you have provided I pick the M&P. Why? I really like the full size M&P my dad has, shoots great and feels comfortable. The only reason I don't have the subcompact now is because of my needs at the time of purchase: cheap car gun.

(The M&P also looks way better than the XD )

If you go with the M&P, pay attention to the variations - unless you go with the version that has Crimson Trace lasergrips, the one you want is SKU #: 209304, described at the S&W website as having "no magazine disconnect, internal lock, or thumb safety." (You don't need any of that stuff as long as you keep your pistol in a good holster. It won't go off until you squeeze the trigger.)

terryg wrote: He also picked up a Fobus Paddle holster for it at the show which is great because I was considering a Blade-Tech paddle. Once we got home and cleaned the weapons, I tried the holster a bit and got a little discouraged. I know his SR9 was full size, but the only position I that didn't print horribly was about 5:00. Anything from 2:30 - 4:30 stuck out like zit on prom night. I don't mind 5:00 when walking around - but there is no way I could sit with it there.

Also, the gun was also not very stable on my hip - it wobbled quite a bit as I walked. I wasn't wearing a 'gun belt' but it is a new leather belt. It's pretty wide (1.5 inches) and stout belt - I don't really see how a gun belt could be any different. So my concern is that I am just not built - or don't yet dress - in a way that can support anything largish in an OWB carry. And I am pretty sure that I don't want to IWB carry.

A good holster is as important as a good belt. I use a fobus Paddle for Idpa but carry daily with this
http://www.shado.com/Leather-Holsters/S ... lster.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
I carry a full sized S&W 9mm.

As far as the firearm you choose. get what feels the best for you. Those are all good solid choices.

I like the XD

So I stopped today at Bass Pro in Pearland to try my canidates again. This was my first time there and so I don't know what store policy is. I had to wait about 10 mins because 2 or 3 workers were working on some kinda store transfer - but it was well worth it. When I was finally helped, he was very friendly AND he let me compare two guns at the same time. I don't want to get anybody in trouble if it wasn't supposed to happen but no other store I've been in has let me do that! It was awesome!

So I was able to compare grip and weight two at a time. The SR9c, M&Pc and Mil Pro all felt about the same weight - the Mil may have been a smidge lighter. But the XDsc was noticeably heavyer than all. Although there is a lot I like about the XDsc - and it certainly comes highly recommended here and elsewhere - I think the extra weight is enough to strike it from the list for the time being.

That pretty much leaves it between the SR9c and the M&Pc with the Mil as the third place backup. The M&P seems to be more recommended here - but there is a lot of good press out there on the Ruger.

--edited out a random smiley that appeared somehow