Galveston to ban guns?

[seamusTX]

It is worth noting though, how local authorities seem to be in the dark when it comes to laws concerning concealed carry.

These ordinances are irritating, as I said earlier. They are pointless and contrary to state law. However, who is going to fight them, and how?

There is no mechanism for the state to say that a local ordinance is invalid. A district court judge would have to do it. That usually involves someone being prosecuted.

These ordinances, which practically every city and town has in one form or another, are never enforced. Probably most sheriff deputies and police officers don't even think of them. I don't know of a CHL holder getting into any trouble in Galveston County that he didn't create for himself.

- Jim

[PUCKER]

Maybe a local (Galveston area) resident could email these folks a link to the Texas preemption clause and possibly cc the Texas Attorney General on it?

[seamusTX]

They don't care. Every elected official gets loads of spam and kooky e-mails. They just ignore it.

I could probably walk into the county judge's office. (I have met him many times.) I am capable in technical terms of going to the meeting with a presentation on the details of PC 30.06, 46.03, and 46.035. I could even make color graphics. They would refer it to their attorney and that would be the end of it.

The Texas AG has no role in this kind of thing. No elected official can give orders to another elected official, except for judges.

- Jim

[PUCKER]

Jim - I would think (and maybe that's my problem, thinking? ) that a friendly note from the Texas AG offering his legal opinion on this would carry some weight, but I've been wrong before. But hey, it's your backyard.

[seamusTX]

Only government officials can get opinions from the AG.

If someone were prosecuted under this ordinance (which already exists) for carrying on county property, and all other issues such as carrying in a courthouse were out of the picture, the case would go to a local judge, probably a justice of the peace*. Any competent lawyer could get the case dismissed, and that would be the end of it.

*I don't know how these things work, because I'm not in the habit of getting arrested.

- Jim

[PUCKER]

Jim - maybe send a letter then?

Regarding being arrested - it builds character!

I say that tongue-in-cheek, but it makes you *not* want to be arrested again. But you also know what the process is and all that "fun" stuff (not fun, of course).

[bauerdj]

This looks like someone took the 2003 meeting minutes and slipped a future date and the current commissioners into it.

Bottom line, courts and jails are off limits whether posted or not; and 30.06 signs on county-owned or leased buildings are otherwise unenforceable. Any limitation on licensed concealed carry on beaches or in parks is unenforceable.

And did I mention that concealed means concealed?

- Jim

The limitation on beaches or parks applies only to employees only, as such I believe it is legal.

[seamusTX]

The county can legally have a policy that prohibits its employees from carrying weapons while on the clock. Whether the employee could be prosecuted under any penal statute is another question.

This kind of question has been the subject of endless debate on this forum. It is almost never prosecuted. On the rare occasions when it is, we don't hear of the resolution.



- Jim

[PUCKER]

Jim - can you point me to a cite for that (for my own edification), I have never heard that before.

The Texas AG has no role in this kind of thing. No elected official can give orders to another elected official, except for judges.

- Jim

[seamusTX]

I cannot tell you where to find that information in black and white. Every elected official is autonomous or sovereign within his office until ordered otherwise by a judge or removed by impeachment.

It's a principle of law, like the separation of powers or presumption of innocence.

Edited to add: The principle here is really defined powers. Officials have only those powers that are defined by law.

The enormously complicated Texas Constitution and the Government Code define the powers of elected officials. With rare exceptions, elected officials have separate areas of power and responsibility. For example, the governor cannot tell a mayor what to do, even though we tend to think of the governor as being in a superior position. The President of the United States cannot give orders to a county clerk or treasurer.

- Jim

[ddurkof]

Call the Commissioner's Court and tell them that you will not spend money in Galveston County if they pass this law. It will be on any county property, including county parks (read many of the public access beaches). I grew up in Galveston County and I have many relatives that still live there and I will not be spending my $ there if they pass this.

[danpaw]

If there is one place in this state that I would not go unarmed, its Galveston.

[seamusTX]

This issue blew up into a major big deal.

The County Judge told the newspaper that the agenda item refers only to adding the Justice Center, which was built in 2006, to the existing list of off-limits places.

As I pointed out earlier, most of those are courthouses and correctional facilities. One interesting footnote seems to be that the county commissioners court can ban judges from carrying in courthouses.

http://www.galvnews.com/story/169802" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This article states that churches are off-limits. Pleases don't tell anyone that churches are not off-limits unless posted with valid 30.06 signs. Let's just keep it "our little secret.""

- Jim

[Oldgringo]

Good job, Jim!

I'm glad you got 'em straightened out of this issue. Given the rampant crime in Galveston county, we sure wouldn't want to visit there without our 'heaters'...this fall.

[seamusTX]

I want to repeat, it is perfectly legal to go to any public place that is not off-limits by state statue (bars being the main one that tourists would be interested in). Neither the city or the county can legally restrict license concealed carry. They don't even really try. I have never heard of a case of police harassment of CHL holders here.

The only gray area here is the UTMB hospital, as has been discussed many times.

Furthermore, the crime rate for tourists is quite low. The crime that occurs here, aside from robberies of retail stores, tends to be between drug dealers and users and violent domestic partners.

- Jim