Privacy and Academy

[pbwalker]

I had to open another topic as my other one has been steered into experience with Academy

Went to Academy today trying to buy a firearm. I casually asked the clerk if they store all my information including Form 4473 in their computer system. He said "absolutely. Every bit of it gets input into the computer system."

That statement promptly scared me away. I have been Academy's customer but I am not comfortable that a big store keeps my personal information such as home address, birthday, etc. etc.

I'd rather not buy the gun or pay a little extra.

I happened to stop by Academy at lunch today. They do indeed put the 4473 information in their computer system as someone was purchasing a gun while I was looking and I personally witnessed the salesclerk entering information off the form into the computer before they walked the guy out with his gun.

And you are 100% sure this was an Academy database he was entering the information in to? e.g., you saw what was on the computer screen. Any possibility that he was entering it in to NICS to check on a purchase?

[VMI77]

I had to open another topic as my other one has been steered into experience with Academy

Went to Academy today trying to buy a firearm. I casually asked the clerk if they store all my information including Form 4473 in their computer system. He said "absolutely. Every bit of it gets input into the computer system."

That statement promptly scared me away. I have been Academy's customer but I am not comfortable that a big store keeps my personal information such as home address, birthday, etc. etc.

I'd rather not buy the gun or pay a little extra.

I happened to stop by Academy at lunch today. They do indeed put the 4473 information in their computer system as someone was purchasing a gun while I was looking and I personally witnessed the salesclerk entering information off the form into the computer before they walked the guy out with his gun.

And you are 100% sure this was an Academy database he was entering the information in to? e.g., you saw what was on the computer screen. Any possibility that he was entering it in to NICS to check on a purchase?

No, I'm not sure. I'd say there are actually two other possibilities than entry into an Academy database --all the checks made on my purchases have been by phone (none at all since getting a CHL), but if a place like Academy does it on the computer, then yes, that's a possibility. Since I couldn't see what he was entering, just that he was transcribing information from the form, it may also be possible he was entering inventory information from the sale (I haven't paid much attention to the dealer portion of the form and don't remember what's on it). So, the only thing I'm sure of is that he was entering information from the form into the computer. However, I will make it a point to ask on my next visit.

[rm9792]

The Arms Room in League City enters info into the computer as well. I dont know what they are entering though.

[Mike1951]

There is a computer based 4473 system in lieu of a 'bound book'.

http://www.atf.gov/applications/e4473/faq.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Purplehood]

There is a computer based 4473 system in lieu of a 'bound book'.

http://www.atf.gov/applications/e4473/faq.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I could be wrong, but in my mind that would be useless unless they scanned signature pages into the database. So now there is a paper-trail and a computer trail for the Feds to follow? Yuck.

[zero4o3]

I had to open another topic as my other one has been steered into experience with Academy

Went to Academy today trying to buy a firearm. I casually asked the clerk if they store all my information including Form 4473 in their computer system. He said "absolutely. Every bit of it gets input into the computer system."

That statement promptly scared me away. I have been Academy's customer but I am not comfortable that a big store keeps my personal information such as home address, birthday, etc. etc.

I'd rather not buy the gun or pay a little extra.

I happened to stop by Academy at lunch today. They do indeed put the 4473 information in their computer system as someone was purchasing a gun while I was looking and I personally witnessed the salesclerk entering information off the form into the computer before they walked the guy out with his gun.

I would imagine what you saw was the sales person keying in the name and type of gun to be pulled up at the front register.

[hirundo82]

There is a computer based 4473 system in lieu of a 'bound book'.

http://www.atf.gov/applications/e4473/faq.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Oh, I bet ATF just loves that. They've been itching to computerize all the 4473's they recieve (from dealers going out of business, etc.) as a way to start a federal firearms database, but the NRA keeps getting it prohibited. A computerized system just makes the ATF's job easier:

1) Introduce a voluntary electronic 4473 (to reduce errors of course), that the ATF so helpfully provides
2) Make electronic 4473 mandatory
3) Require all FFLs to back up their e4473's with the ATF server regularly

[tacticool]

I could be wrong, but in my mind that would be useless unless they scanned signature pages into the database. So now there is a paper-trail and a computer trail for the Feds to follow? Yuck.

The bound book is a record of the disposition and is different from the 4473. (More accurately, acquisition and disposition information for each firearm.) There's buyer information, but no buyer signatures, in the bound book. Paper or electronic should make no difference.

[mrvmax]

There is an electronic 4473, all data is entered and the form is printed out and then signed. A possibility is that there were two or more handguns sold in a 5 day period. The ATF form for reporting that can be filled out online and then faxed in top the ATF.