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AndyC wrote:I really start to worry when police officers start casually viewing tasers as a mere compliance tool - and not the less-than-lethal (usually) weapon that it actually is.

maybe it "usually" is a less-than-lethal weapon...all too often I see stories of people dying....so I don't know about that (let's leave that part aside for the moment)

the problem is the "weapon" part...so many of the officers aren't respecting it as a "weapon" I think they are treating it as....I don't know a "tool"?

I see a story on the news about a kid who is dead because he's been tazed a multiple times including after he was on the ground....I think, ok would the cop have hit him over the head with his "night stick or flash-light" that many times? I'm guessing the answer would be "NO! It would kill him"

a taser is electricity, it is interfering with the natural flow of the heart....can we have a brain???? please????

I think major training and retraining is needed...it's like they are given these things and some of these guys just think "oooo, cool non-lethal toy!"

I am not cop bashing...notice I said SOME! tasers however are a thing with me, I think they are used way too quickly, and cops have forgotten some of the skills they had before they had the tasers, 'cause I know they wouldn't have shot this guy down from his roof.

+1 sewtexas. You took the words out of my mouth.

VMI77 wrote:I liked this country a lot better when everything wasn't so "safe." The fact is, you can't be both "safe" AND free. In freedom there is risk.

http://pinellaspark.wtsp.com/news/news/ ... -it-brutal

Daniel Jensen wasn't running from the law, he was trying to protect his home from burning up. Yet, Pinellas Park Police tasered him in the process.

Government Professor I had used to illustrate:
A "governor" on a go-cart motor at a go-cart track restricts how fast the motor can run, so it isn't as free as it could be to run as fast as it could want to (if a motor could 'want') ... without Governors we'd be freer, but there needs to be a balance or a desirable/acceptable imbalance between how free and how governed, that's the dilemma all nations/societies face.

RPB wrote:

VMI77 wrote:I liked this country a lot better when everything wasn't so "safe." The fact is, you can't be both "safe" AND free. In freedom there is risk.

http://pinellaspark.wtsp.com/news/news/ ... -it-brutal

Daniel Jensen wasn't running from the law, he was trying to protect his home from burning up. Yet, Pinellas Park Police tasered him in the process.

Government Professor I had used to illustrate:
A "governor" on a go-cart motor at a go-cart track restricts how fast the motor can run, so it isn't as free as it could be to run as fast as it could want to (if a motor could 'want') ... without Governors we'd be freer, but there needs to be a balance or a desirable/acceptable imbalance between how free and how governed, that's the dilemma all nations/societies face.

The problem with that analogy is that I've lived here for a long time and I still remember the differences. Things are drastically different since I was in high school, still more since I was a child, and that argument depends on the judgement that the balance now is better now that it was then; and it isn't.

How the world turns...

Back in 1989 I lived outside the North gate of Camp Pendleton (Oceanside, CA) in a neighborhood full of Marines. A neighbors house caught on fire and the word was rapidly spread through the neighborhood.
As Marines tend to be proactive a number of things happened:
- the house was cleared of occupants
- garden hoses from the neighboring houses were trained on the source of fire
- the Oceanside PD arrived and initiated crowd-control, leaving those of us spraying the house and anything else liable to burn to do our business
- the Oceanside FD arrived, briefly watched as the smoke and fire subsided and entered
- we (the Marines all standing outside the house with high-and-tights) were thanked by the PD and FD and told that we had done 'a good job'.
At that time the Oceanside PD had a reputation for being harsh on Marines - which actually was understandable in many cirucmstances.

The story of how this homeowner was treated is horrible. I really hope that he can attract a good lawyer that smells a payoff/settlement with the city and can have some impact on the Officers involved.

Purplehood wrote:How the world turns...

Back in 1989 I lived outside the North gate of Camp Pendleton (Oceanside, CA) in a neighborhood full of Marines. A neighbors house caught on fire and the word was rapidly spread through the neighborhood.
As Marines tend to be proactive a number of things happened:
- the house was cleared of occupants
- garden hoses from the neighboring houses were trained on the source of fire
- the Oceanside PD arrived and initiated crowd-control, leaving those of us spraying the house and anything else liable to burn to do our business
- the Oceanside FD arrived, briefly watched as the smoke and fire subsided and entered
- we (the Marines all standing outside the house with high-and-tights) were thanked by the PD and FD and told that we had done 'a good job'.
At that time the Oceanside PD had a reputation for being harsh on Marines - which actually was understandable in many cirucmstances.

The story of how this homeowner was treated is horrible. I really hope that he can attract a good lawyer that smells a payoff/settlement with the city and can have some impact on the Officers involved.

Back in the mid 50s, in California no less, my older brother was attacked by and beat the stuffing out of the school bully. He was thanked by the school principal who drove him home and congratulated my parents on having a fine son who stood up for himself and put a bully in his place. He said he drove my brother home so the bullies friends couldn't ambush him outside the school. Try to imagine that happening today.

VMI77 wrote:

Purplehood wrote:How the world turns...

Back in 1989 I lived outside the North gate of Camp Pendleton (Oceanside, CA) in a neighborhood full of Marines. A neighbors house caught on fire and the word was rapidly spread through the neighborhood.
As Marines tend to be proactive a number of things happened:
- the house was cleared of occupants
- garden hoses from the neighboring houses were trained on the source of fire
- the Oceanside PD arrived and initiated crowd-control, leaving those of us spraying the house and anything else liable to burn to do our business
- the Oceanside FD arrived, briefly watched as the smoke and fire subsided and entered
- we (the Marines all standing outside the house with high-and-tights) were thanked by the PD and FD and told that we had done 'a good job'.
At that time the Oceanside PD had a reputation for being harsh on Marines - which actually was understandable in many cirucmstances.

The story of how this homeowner was treated is horrible. I really hope that he can attract a good lawyer that smells a payoff/settlement with the city and can have some impact on the Officers involved.

Back in the mid 50s, in California no less, my older brother was attacked by and beat the stuffing out of the school bully. He was thanked by the school principal who drove him home and congratulated my parents on having a fine son who stood up for himself and put a bully in his place. He said he drove my brother home so the bullies friends couldn't ambush him outside the school. Try to imagine that happening today.

In the late 60's, while I was in high school, I had the direct permission of the superintendent, the principal and both of the coaches(small school and only one in the district) to knock the "dogsh**"(The coaches' word) out of any other student, any where, any time I deemed it to be appropriate. I exercised that directive twice in three years. Today I would have been expelled for defending myself.

I wonder what will happen when, or if, one day a LEO goes to draw a taser on someone(justly or unjustly) and they pull pull first and put a little lead in the officer...maybe they were in fear of their life not realizing it was a taser. I think that would be very very bad for everyone. Maybe that isn't a reality, and I sincerely hope not but even the most responsible people are capable of strange things when fear and adrenaline take over.