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mrvmax wrote: Mon Sep 07, 2020 7:55 pm I disagree, I don’t think the police need reform. I think the things we’ve seen are the minority and without 24/7 media trying to get the highest ratings we wouldn’t even know about those. If the police where you live need reformed I suggest you move. I agree with most of the first part of what you say here, but disagree somewhat with the last sentence. In some cases, reform may not be possible, but in some cases it it might be. If it is possible, shouldn’t you stay and make things better where you are?

Civil war will not fix the problems, it will only cause more unnecessary death. You may be willing to give up your life in an attempt to “fix” things but I don’t think that’s your best option. I agree that civil war isn’t a great option, and that it will kill a lot of people who have done nothing wrong other than to be either too weak or unprepared to fight. But as undesirable as it is, it may be forced on you anyway. So while I don’t advocate for it, I do say that one ought to be (literally) prepared for its possibility.

Am I going to stand by if they went through my neighborhood looting and burning? Probably not but I’m pretty confident my local police are not going to let it get to that point. I’m pretty sure if they got overwhelmed by numbers there would be plenty of my neighbors stepping in to back them up. i would certainly hope that to be the case in large parts of Texas....but I have trouble believing it would be the case in the larger metropolitan areas.

We’ve got a country that can come together when things like 911 happen. What we really need are leaders who are more concerned about getting us united again than they are getting re-elected or increasing their bank accounts. I agree, but I’m not convinced that very many such politicians exist.

srothstein wrote: Mon Sep 07, 2020 8:50 pm

mrvmax wrote: Mon Sep 07, 2020 7:55 pmI disagree, I don’t think the police need reform. I think the things we’ve seen are the minority and without 24/7 media trying to get the highest ratings we wouldn’t even know about those. If the police where you live need reformed I suggest you move.

I agree that the events making the news are a definite minority and are amplified by a ratings driven mass media with an agenda to help a specific political cause. But even with that, I think the police do need some reform. There are things I saw as a police officer that should never be allowed. One reason the police have lost some faith with the public is that they can be their own worst enemy. They do things like run patrol cars with no markings or with markings that are the same color as the patrol car's paint. Police go to mental health calls without help from trained mental health specialists. They use the SWAT team and No-Knock warrants way more than is justified IMO. Citizens have lost their lives because of a lot of this this and it could have been avoided.

The police need to have some reform, though not nearly as much as the protesters are saying. They need more money, not less, so that we can get better officers (quality always costs money) and more people to handle the various situations. They need to get out of their patrol cars more and walk in the neighborhoods and meet and talk with the people, they need to be part of the community.

And of course, even more than the police, the laws need to be reformed and a lot of them repealed.

make no mistake, we are in fact in civil war.

srothstein wrote: Mon Sep 07, 2020 8:50 pm

mrvmax wrote: Mon Sep 07, 2020 7:55 pmI disagree, I don’t think the police need reform. I think the things we’ve seen are the minority and without 24/7 media trying to get the highest ratings we wouldn’t even know about those. If the police where you live need reformed I suggest you move.

I agree that the events making the news are a definite minority and are amplified by a ratings driven mass media with an agenda to help a specific political cause. But even with that, I think the police do need some reform. There are things I saw as a police officer that should never be allowed. One reason the police have lost some faith with the public is that they can be their own worst enemy. They do things like run patrol cars with no markings or with markings that are the same color as the patrol car's paint. Police go to mental health calls without help from trained mental health specialists. They use the SWAT team and No-Knock warrants way more than is justified IMO. Citizens have lost their lives because of a lot of this this and it could have been avoided.

The police need to have some reform, though not nearly as much as the protesters are saying. They need more money, not less, so that we can get better officers (quality always costs money) and more people to handle the various situations. They need to get out of their patrol cars more and walk in the neighborhoods and meet and talk with the people, they need to be part of the community.

And of course, even more than the police, the laws need to be reformed and a lot of them repealed.

parabelum wrote: Mon Sep 07, 2020 9:24 pm One thing, we are in civil war already. If this Country was the size of Bosnia, you’d feel it no doubt about it. Due to geography though it may be a bit until it comes to the backyard near you. But make no mistake, we are in fact in civil war.

chamberc wrote: Tue Sep 08, 2020 9:00 am

parabelum wrote: Mon Sep 07, 2020 9:24 pm One thing, we are in civil war already. If this Country was the size of Bosnia, you’d feel it no doubt about it. Due to geography though it may be a bit until it comes to the backyard near you. But make no mistake, we are in fact in civil war.

Nope, not even close. You're living in a country with the highest quality of life in the history of mankind. You're no where close to a civil war. The ONLY things that could set one off is nationwide door-to-door firearm confiscation or cessation of entitlement payments. Short of those, you're not remotely close to a hot civil war...

parabelum wrote: Tue Sep 08, 2020 9:42 am

chamberc wrote: Tue Sep 08, 2020 9:00 am

parabelum wrote: Mon Sep 07, 2020 9:24 pm One thing, we are in civil war already. If this Country was the size of Bosnia, you’d feel it no doubt about it. Due to geography though it may be a bit until it comes to the backyard near you. But make no mistake, we are in fact in civil war.

Nope, not even close. You're living in a country with the highest quality of life in the history of mankind. You're no where close to a civil war. The ONLY things that could set one off is nationwide door-to-door firearm confiscation or cessation of entitlement payments. Short of those, you're not remotely close to a hot civil war...

Trust me when I tell you that you are in it.

Middle Age Russ wrote: Tue Sep 08, 2020 8:15 am

make no mistake, we are in fact in civil war.

Agreed. It hasn't become a shooting war yet, but we've been involved in a cold civil war for a while now.

C-dub wrote: Thu Sep 10, 2020 7:02 pm

Middle Age Russ wrote: Tue Sep 08, 2020 8:15 am

make no mistake, we are in fact in civil war.

Agreed. It hasn't become a shooting war yet, but we've been involved in a cold civil war for a while now.

Oh, but it has. In those terms, so far it's been limited to minor skirmishes testing each other's strengths and weaknesses. A young, relatively untrained 17 year old was tested and emerged victorious so far. Hopefully, he will be completely exonerated also legally. The next test was a murder that also ultimately ended in failure for the murderer. I hope that will be the end, but doubt it will be.

STR8-SHOT wrote: Fri Sep 11, 2020 11:57 am The left is claiming they’ve already started a new civil war:

https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/t ... un-n917703