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tfrazier wrote:I've never seen 30.06 or gun buster signs in the parking lots, but I'll drive through on the way home from work tonight and see...will report back here this evening or in the morning.

I can save you a trip since I patrol around there on Saturday nights...there are no signs in the parking lots.

As a Grapevine officer? If so, can you shed any light on the situation at hand (incorrect signage and Grapevine PD policy)?

hi-power wrote:

tfrazier wrote:I've never seen 30.06 or gun buster signs in the parking lots, but I'll drive through on the way home from work tonight and see...will report back here this evening or in the morning.

I can save you a trip since I patrol around there on Saturday nights...there are no signs in the parking lots.

Hi-Power is in the Citizens on Patrol auxiliary for Grapevine PD. I didn't see his post before I left work yesterday so I ended up making the trip anyway (not far from other errands anyway, such as my daily disappointing check-in at Bass Pro to see there's still no primers or WSF powder on the shelves).

He's correct, no gun buster or 30.06 signs in the parking lots.

There are, however, signs posted at every street entrance stating that the parking lots are private property for the use of mall patrons and overnight parking is subject to towing, etc. etc. etc.

The place was fairly barren, even for 6PM on a Thursday.

The law clearly states the exact language that must be used on the sign. It doesn't say anything about, close... or intention... or they tried to post it correctly.....

(3) "Written communication" means:

(A) a card or other document on which is written language identical to the following: "Pursuant to Section 30.06, Penal Code (trespass by holder of license to carry a concealed handgun), a person licensed under Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code (concealed handgun law), may not enter this property with a concealed handgun"; or

(B) a sign posted on the property that:

(i) includes the language described by Paragraph (A) in both English and Spanish;

(ii) appears in contrasting colors with block letters at least one inch in height; and

(iii) is displayed in a conspicuous manner clearly visible to the public.

I fully agree that you would take the ride. I'm also confident you would beat the rap. "Contrast", "conspicuous", "clearly visible"... all open to interpretation. "Identical" is not.

Of course, everyone needs to make their own decision about the risk/reward involved with exercising their rights in an unfriendly environment.

Personally, if they don't want my business, I'll go spend my cash elsewhere. If for some reason I need to go there anyway... I will obey the law.

As Forest Gump said... "That's all I've got to say about that."

Amen brother.

Sorry - I've been away from this forum for a few days.

I'm trying to get an answer to the question of the incorrect mall signs and Grapevine PD's stance on the issue, but haven't heard back from them yet.

I did hear from an officer that Grapevine PD has told one local church that they could not arrest a CHL-holder because their 30.06 signs were not correct. Hopefully I'll find out more about that also.

I believe sangloves to be 100% correct. The law is very clear, the specific verbage from 30.06 must be posted, in English and Spanish, for the sign to be valid. I don't believe this to be a legal restriction of a CHL holder. All it tells me is, no ugly handguns allowed here.

For the record, I've packed there before, late last year, and those signs were not there at that time. If they really feel that strongly about it, then I can take my business elsewhere. I would rather support somebody who has a brain in any case.

BTW - Disney owns Rainforest Cafe. That might explain alot........Disney is very much anti gun.

FWIW, I can't stand malls anyway. I avoid 'em like the plague. But the Grapevine Mills mall hasn't seen me since just after I moved here, and that was before I ever got my CHL. I can't stand the place. That being said, I wouldn't go in there anyway. In my book, even a half-hearted attempt at posting a 30.06 sign is reason for me to not want to give any of my money to the place. If my gun ain't welcome, then I ain't welcome, and they can go hang themselves.

Last week I went in through the ice rink, no 30.06. Then when moved through the ice rink into the mall, no 30.06 anywhere to be seen. When standing inside the mall looking out the mall entrance doors by the ice rink, you can see the 30.06 posted on a side wall, not on the glass doors, so I couldn't read it from being inside the mall...Why would they not post the entry from the ice rink into the mall?

Why not have them posted at all entrances? Why not have them LEGALLY BINDING? There are a lot of questions. But the final answer is "they're not legal, carry there if you want and aren't afraid of the potential ride."

hi-power - just checking, thought about this the other day, any news/updates on this?

hi-power wrote:Sorry - I've been away from this forum for a few days.

I'm trying to get an answer to the question of the incorrect mall signs and Grapevine PD's stance on the issue, but haven't heard back from them yet.

I did hear from an officer that Grapevine PD has told one local church that they could not arrest a CHL-holder because their 30.06 signs were not correct. Hopefully I'll find out more about that also.

The question could be posed via email to the Grapevine PD public relations officer, Sgt. Kim Smith kbsmith@grapevinetexas.gov

I don't care enough to ask, because the Mills Mall ownership has made it clear that their intent is to ban concealed carry holders, thus they will never get my business or endorsement for others to do business with them.

If they had a simple gun buster sign up I would be able to make a reasonable assumption that they weren't trying to ban CHL holders, just criminals who they think would be willing to break the law but not willing to disobey a sign.

Idiots.

PUCKER wrote:hi-power - just checking, thought about this the other day, any news/updates on this?

Nothing from the Sgt. I asked about this, but I'll email him again. I'll let you know.

I agree entirely with Tim's email above, but there's one slight change that I found out about last night in case anyone else is going to email Grapevine PD...Sgt. Kim Smith is going back to patrol starting this Sunday. Lt. Todd Dearing has already started taking over the public info duties again. tdearing@grapevinetexas.gov

The Annoyed Man wrote:FWIW, I can't stand malls anyway. I avoid 'em like the plague. But the Grapevine Mills mall hasn't seen me since just after I moved here, and that was before I ever got my CHL. I can't stand the place. That being said, I wouldn't go in there anyway. In my book, even a half-hearted attempt at posting a 30.06 sign is reason for me to not want to give any of my money to the place. If my gun ain't welcome, then I ain't welcome, and they can go hang themselves.

Pretty much how I feel about Grapevine Mills. We do like to shop at NE Mall and never had an issue. But Grapevine Mill's signage is like they are SCREAMING at CHL holders to go away. I mean the signs are ugly. So no, they lost my business a LONG time ago.

The AMC theatre was posted last time I was there with improper 30.06 signs. The signs were tiny and posted in the bottom corner of one of the doors. I was carrying and ignored it since it was not a legal sign.

Thank you hi-power.

Good to know that Lt. Dearing is still at GV, he's a good guy.