Leaving the car to confront troublemakers isn't smart

[rp_photo]

When I was about 6yrs old, I thought it would be cool to toss a handful of pebbles a passing car. And it was the first couple of times. Something about the angle that the pebbles deflected back onto the street after hitting the cars fascinated me. When the third car passed & I tossed my handful it wasn't so much fun anymore. The driver stopped, backed up, got out, and confronted me. That confrontation included a pretty good belt-whipping, followed by the same from my step-dad, and then another from my mom. I didn't find tossing pebbles at cars nearly so appealing after that. This was about 1978 or so.

In 35-some odd years we've come a long way..... backwards.

I had similar experiences, minus the belt-whippings, throwing snowballs at cars and school buses in the Syracuse, NY area in the early 1970's.

God help anyone who does that to a child today, especially one they aren't related to.

[CoffeeNut]

I thought originally that they were throwing glass bottles at the car but the video says it was a pop bottle so I'm assuming it was plastic? In that case I'd just drive on and use my Bluetooth to dial 911.

Glass bottles would certainly change things for me.

if it were glass what would you do CF? (the 911 idea looks good to me)

I'd want to put myself in a position far enough away to get a description of the suspects who likely just damaged my car and even snap pictures of the people who did it before leaving the area all together or moving to a location where police can meet up with me.

With that said I often ride with my windows down and a glass bottle coming through my window can be a deadly weapon and if a savage beating is what they were intent on giving then I feel I'd already be justified in doing what I need to do to stay alive (if a bottle hit me and I was unable to get to a location to call for help).

[Cedar Park Dad]

When I was about 6yrs old, I thought it would be cool to toss a handful of pebbles a passing car. And it was the first couple of times. Something about the angle that the pebbles deflected back onto the street after hitting the cars fascinated me. When the third car passed & I tossed my handful it wasn't so much fun anymore. The driver stopped, backed up, got out, and confronted me. That confrontation included a pretty good belt-whipping, followed by the same from my step-dad, and then another from my mom. I didn't find tossing pebbles at cars nearly so appealing after that. This was about 1978 or so.

In 35-some odd years we've come a long way..... backwards.

So you're advocating battery of a child? Strangely if their parent saw that they could righteously blow you away under our laws.

I'd want to put myself in a position far enough away to get a description of the suspects who likely just damaged my car and even snap pictures of the people who did it before leaving the area all together or moving to a location where police can meet up with me.

Thsi sounds like good advice as well, although I'd probably start the police call immediately (if thats not what you were thinking already).

[CoffeeNut]

I'd want to put myself in a position far enough away to get a description of the suspects who likely just damaged my car and even snap pictures of the people who did it before leaving the area all together or moving to a location where police can meet up with me.

Thsi sounds like good advice as well, although I'd probably start the police call immediately (if thats not what you were thinking already).

I'd have 911 on the phone the minute the bottle impacted my car. The nice thing about Bluetooth is I can talk on the phone while taking pictures or video.

[Cedar Park Dad]

That is pretty cool. PLus Google glas is just the beginning - you could record everything with ease (thats kind of a scary thought actually).

[rp_photo]

The bottom line is that we are facing a determined enemy (antis and baiters) who feel emboldened, and they are daring us to stand up for ourselves.

[rotor]

Why not
1. Pull up a couple hundred feet from the perpetrators.
2. Call the cops.
3. Keep a vigilant eye on the perps. If they start approaching be prepared to drive away.
4. take pix if possible.
5. As a last resort if you can't get away be prepared to use force, even deadly force. Teens can kill you just as easily as adults can.
6. Driving away though seems to be a better response to at worst a dent in your car from a soda bottle. Still call the cops though.
7. If unarmed than just drive away as one old man confronting 4 teens is not a fair fight. They would wip my butt.

[Cedar Park Dad]

Why not
1. Pull up a couple hundred feet from the perpetrators.
2. Call the cops.
3. Keep a vigilant eye on the perps. If they start approaching be prepared to drive away.
4. take pix if possible.
5. As a last resort if you can't get away be prepared to use force, even deadly force. Teens can kill you just as easily as adults can.
6. Driving away though seems to be a better response to at worst a dent in your car from a soda bottle. Still call the cops though.
7. If unarmed than just drive away as one old man confronting 4 teens is not a fair fight. They would wip my butt.

Rotor has the way of it.

[TexasCajun]

When I was about 6yrs old, I thought it would be cool to toss a handful of pebbles a passing car. And it was the first couple of times. Something about the angle that the pebbles deflected back onto the street after hitting the cars fascinated me. When the third car passed & I tossed my handful it wasn't so much fun anymore. The driver stopped, backed up, got out, and confronted me. That confrontation included a pretty good belt-whipping, followed by the same from my step-dad, and then another from my mom. I didn't find tossing pebbles at cars nearly so appealing after that. This was about 1978 or so.

In 35-some odd years we've come a long way..... backwards.

So you're advocating battery of a child? Strangely if their parent saw that they could righteously blow you away under our laws.

That's not what I'm saying. In 35 or so years, we've gone from an adult being able to (rightly) correct a misbehaving child to having to debate the ramifications of defending yourself or your property. Our world has turned upside down.

[Cedar Park Dad]

When I was about 6yrs old, I thought it would be cool to toss a handful of pebbles a passing car. And it was the first couple of times. Something about the angle that the pebbles deflected back onto the street after hitting the cars fascinated me. When the third car passed & I tossed my handful it wasn't so much fun anymore. The driver stopped, backed up, got out, and confronted me. That confrontation included a pretty good belt-whipping, followed by the same from my step-dad, and then another from my mom. I didn't find tossing pebbles at cars nearly so appealing after that. This was about 1978 or so.

In 35-some odd years we've come a long way..... backwards.

So you're advocating battery of a child? Strangely if their parent saw that they could righteously blow you away under our laws.

That's not what I'm saying. In 35 or so years, we've gone from an adult being able to (rightly) correct a misbehaving child to having to debate the ramifications of defending yourself or your property. Our world has turned upside down.

Well had you stepped out in the Houston wards back in 1978 and survived, we'd still be having the conversation.
I'm not discussing the ramifications of defending yourself. I'm asking what exactly you would do, if you were one voting for getting out of the vehicle.

Isn't everyone taught in CHL class conflict avoidance and let the police do their job? I'm not seeing what activity post "get out of the car'" leads to a good ending. Can someone informe of what that good ending is?

[rp_photo]

Isn't everyone taught in CHL class conflict avoidance and let the police do their job? I'm not seeing what activity post "get out of the car'" leads to a good ending. Can someone informe of what that good ending is?

My thoughts exactly.

[Charles L. Cotton]

I hate to blame the victim, but she exhibited very poor judgement getting out of the car to confront them. And had she been carrying and shot any of them, I could see a lot of parallels to the Zimmerman case:

http://www.wpxi.com/news/news/woman-bru ... ys-/nZfFy/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Wow. So our society has now fallen so low that decent people are now obligated to tolerate not only rude behavior, but outright assaults?

There was a time when if kids were throwing bottles at someone's car, everyone within a block would have descended on the hooligans and corrected that behavior immediately. And harshly.

But now I suppose that good and decent folks are just supposed to bow their heads and meekly accept assaults on not only their dignity, but their very safety.

Disgusting.

I hate that you blame the victim, too.

What is your recommended course of action? I am not seeing where getting out of the vehicle (in the bottle throwing scenario) leads to a legal outcome. What is the intent of getting out of the vehicle?

I'm not sure what you mean. Getting out of a car to verbally confront someone who committed vandalism is a legal action and it does not rise to the level of provocation. (I renew my call to repeal TPC §9.31(b)(4) just to make sure.) Defending oneself against an assault by multiple attackers, even by the use of deadly force, is also a legal action.

The bottom line is this. The more we as a society tell honest, law-abiding people that they must sit back "and take it," the happier thugs and criminals will be to dish it out. Resistance may well have its price, but so does capitulation.

Chas.

It is legal to get out of your vehicle-agreed.
Then what? Again, what is the exact purpose of getting out of the vehicle?

To confront the vandals verbally -- again, a perfectly legal act. The less resistance thugs confront, the bolder they will become. Your proposed non-response will actually make society more dangerous over time.

Chas.

[Charles L. Cotton]

Isn't everyone taught in CHL class conflict avoidance and let the police do their job?

You paint with far too broad of a brush. I certainly don't teach my students never to open their mouths or to cower in fear regardless of the circumstances. This incident began with 4 teenage girls throwing a bottle at this woman's car. That's a far cry from the Firsco incident where a CHL injected himself into a domestic matter. It's also far different from stopping to verbally engage a group of MS-13 gang members.

I'm not seeing what activity post "get out of the car'" leads to a good ending. Can someone inform of what that good ending is?

The best outcome is the girls are afraid they will get in trouble with their parents and they decide to quit throwing things at cars. The least desireable yet still "good ending" is that a gang of thugs who launch a felonious assault get shot.

Chas.

[Charles L. Cotton]

When I was about 6yrs old, I thought it would be cool to toss a handful of pebbles a passing car. And it was the first couple of times. Something about the angle that the pebbles deflected back onto the street after hitting the cars fascinated me. When the third car passed & I tossed my handful it wasn't so much fun anymore. The driver stopped, backed up, got out, and confronted me. That confrontation included a pretty good belt-whipping, followed by the same from my step-dad, and then another from my mom. I didn't find tossing pebbles at cars nearly so appealing after that. This was about 1978 or so.

In 35-some odd years we've come a long way..... backwards.

So you're advocating battery of a child? Strangely if their parent saw that they could righteously blow you away under our laws.

Do you really believe that!!?

Chas.

[Abraham]

As soon as I read Chas. earlier post, I quickly realized what he was pointing out and how right he is.

"The less resistance thugs confront, the bolder they will become."

Yes, conflict avoidance is a good thing, but to be assaulted while lawfully going about your business and then cowed by thugs only encourages them.

We do have to stand up for ourselves when assaulted and not act like one of the three so-called wise monkeys...