Do the "rights" of the very very few outweigh the many?

[BigGuy]

GENDER:

Male________ Female_________ It's complicated_________

[ScooterSissy]

...
Frankly, I find the so-called transgendered a failure to recognize mental illness and treat it as such.

If someone were to claim that since birth, they just knew they were actually a giraffe would surgeons be clamoring to make that a person as close an approximation to a giraffe as they could?

Not likely.

They would counsel that person to seek mental health treatment.

So-called "Pre-op transgendered" need the same counseling and mental health help, not butchery and all the rest of the Frankenstein treatment.

You underestimate the greed of some.

Get a billing code approved to provide trans-specie surgery, and an insurance company or a government agency to pay for it, and you'll find a specialist for it.

Until then, presuming to have been an "accidental human, but truly a giraffe by birth" will remain a mental illness.

Though it likely pays less, there is a billing code for that - and that my friend is the root of the issue.

[cb1000rider]

Not a lot of empathy here for a life choice that will certainly result in a much harder life than most of us will ever experience. I wouldn't look down my nose too much... It's not even accepted very well in lots of sub-cultures.

In terms of it being a mental disorder, that may be true. There are also indications of biological causes: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Causes_of_transsexualism" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

And I wouldn't rule out actual genetic causes where actual sex is in-determinant (Intersex) genetically and factually.

I get it that it's a lifestyle choice for some people. Personally, I'm happy to live in a country where we afford such choices, even if we don't do it in a truly neutral and non-discriminatory fashion. ISIS is busy throwing alternative-lifestyle people off roofs, so I suppose that's one alternative.

I am also pointing out that it's most likely not a choice for a subset of that population - any more than you or I have a choice in terms of being left or right handed.

Regardless, it's a tough row to hoe on many fronts... A small win in regard to bathroom use notwithstanding.

I don't believe for a second that medical billing (insurance/government) is the root cause. The market is simply too small... There are much easier ways to be successful as a physician.

[ScooterSissy]

...
I don't believe for a second that medical billing (insurance/government) is the root cause. The market is simply too small... There are much easier ways to be successful as a physician.

My response was in no way offered as a "root cause", but was in response to the "not likely" comment.

Yes, there are likely easier ways to be a physician, yet we still manage to find physicians that are making money doing odd (and even sometimes underhanded) procedures.

I see plenty of qualified physicians doing charity work. I don't see many doing free abortions or free trans-gendered surgery. Those folks want to get paid, by someone.

Google "odd plastic surgery", you'll get some real eye-openers.

[anygunanywhere]

As societal progressives drag the common man further and further down the rabbit hole, it is easy to forget how far we have actually fallen until we look back and see our tracks fading off into the horizon. Personally I am not going along with the whole "transgender" game. It doesn't matter what you cut off, or sew on, or how you dress or speak, or how many chemicals you inject into your system, you can't change your gender. A transgender man will always be just a man in a wig. Everyone else can call him whatever they feel like, but I am not playing along. I won't abuse him, or be cruel or hateful, but I won't lie to him either and call him "she".

Just because you put a rock in the oven doesnt make it a biscuit.

[cb1000rider]

As societal progressives drag the common man further and further down the rabbit hole, it is easy to forget how far we have actually fallen until we look back and see our tracks fading off into the horizon. Personally I am not going along with the whole "transgender" game. It doesn't matter what you cut off, or sew on, or how you dress or speak, or how many chemicals you inject into your system, you can't change your gender. A transgender man will always be just a man in a wig. Everyone else can call him whatever they feel like, but I am not playing along. I won't abuse him, or be cruel or hateful, but I won't lie to him either and call him "she".

Sure, there are certainly "men" in wigs. I'd wager very good money that you've met some transgendered people that you never knew were transgendered... Especially if you've done any amount of overseas travel. The ones that don't fit the role certainly garner the most attention.

And look at it this way, a transgendered individual probably has a much larger need for personal protection than you or I do....

[The Annoyed Man]

I am also pointing out that it's most likely not a choice for a subset of that population - any more than you or I have a choice in terms of being left or right handed.

Regardless, it's a tough row to hoe on many fronts... A small win in regard to bathroom use notwithstanding.

I have been left-handed my entire life. In the 1st grade, they tried to force me to write right-handed, but it just wasn't in me. When I was allowed to BE left-handed, I prospered in school.

Now, move forward 55+ years. ALL of my life I have had to adapt myself to a right-handed world. I pay more for left-handed products if I want them (there's almost always a premium for instance on left-handed bolt-action rifles......IF that company actually makes a left-handed one). I have had to learn to adapt myself to doors that were hung to accommodate right-handers. People even want to shake my non-dominant hand. If I eat communally in an Asian or Muslim country, I don't DARE reach for the food with my left hand. ALL of my pistols are set up for right-handed use out of the box, with some throwing a sop to ambidexterity. You think that custom 1911s are expensive? Try finding a left-handed 1911 (they do exist.....if you have enough money). Even my language reads from left to right, so that when I use a pen on paper with my left hand, I am apt to smear the ink.........and that has cost me as a child in the classroom, whenever neatness was graded. I had to work harder to keep my grades up in the classroom than the right-handed students did, who took writing from left to right for granted. Whenever I have had to swear an oath for civic reasons, I have been asked to raise my right hand, even though my left hand is the one with real meaning to me. Raising my right hand is like crossing my fingers behind my back. And my left hand is referred to by the handedness-bigoted as the "sinister" hand..... which is basically the "N-word" for the left handed. Etc., etc., etc.

And yet, left-handed people comprise approximately 10% of the population. It has been estimated at slightly higher than that, with the number being reduced a bit by the number of people who were forced by their teachers to be right-handed against their congenital preferences. (See what I did there?)

Anybody beginning to see the parallels here? If society can be forced to make adjustments—at society's expense no less—to accommodate A) the same-sex-attracted population (only 3% of all Americans self-identify as LGB according to the CDC, even in this most libertine of ages when you're not hip if you're not at least Bi/Curious: LINKEY), and B) an even tinier subset of the "not traditional hetero" population who self-identify as transgender, then CERTAINLY society can be forced at its own expense to accommodate the 10% of us who are left-handed so that our "condition" isn't either physically or financially discriminated against. After all, we are more than 3 times the numbers of the entire LGBT population. How is it that we left-handers wield so much less power than LGBTs? An even better question is, how can 3% of the population wield so MUCH power? And yet, we are discriminated against institutionally, not just culturally.

Personally, I think I'm being hosed and my rights are being violated. I demand my right to have a left-handed door hung at the entrance of every public-use building. I demand that manufacturers who sell products in this country which are ergonomically designed for right-handers ALSO dedicate 10% of their production to ergonomically left-handed designs, AT THE SAME PRICE as the right-handed models........... and not just on a few models, but for EVERY model of anything manufactured for right-handed use.

If that drives up the prices on everything for the rest of you right-supremacists, that's too bad. What's fair is fair, and I know my rights.

OR, some people could just get over the fact that nobody cares about their personal neuroses or what they do with their nether regions, and just get on with their lives and learn to DEAL WITH IT........and the rest of us......ALL 97% OF US......need to grow enough backbone to tell that 3% to go sell crazy down the street, we're all full up here.

[mojo84]

I am also pointing out that it's most likely not a choice for a subset of that population - any more than you or I have a choice in terms of being left or right handed.

Regardless, it's a tough row to hoe on many fronts... A small win in regard to bathroom use notwithstanding.

I have been left-handed my entire life. In the 1st grade, they tried to force me to write right-handed, but it just wasn't in me. When I was allowed to BE left-handed, I prospered in school.

Now, move forward 55+ years. ALL of my life I have had to adapt myself to a right-handed world. I pay more for left-handed products if I want them (there's almost always a premium for instance on left-handed bolt-action rifles......IF that company actually makes a left-handed one). I have had to learn to adapt myself to doors that were hung to accommodate right-handers. People even want to shake my non-dominant hand. If I eat communally in an Asian or Muslim country, I don't DARE reach for the food with my left hand. ALL of my pistols are set up for right-handed use out of the box, with some throwing a sop to ambidexterity. You think that custom 1911s are expensive? Try finding a left-handed 1911 (they do exist.....if you have enough money). Even my language reads from left to right, so that when I use a pen on paper with my left hand, I am apt to smear the ink.........and that has cost me as a child in the classroom, whenever neatness was graded. I had to work harder to keep my grades up in the classroom than the right-handed students did, who took writing from left to right for granted. Whenever I have had to swear an oath for civic reasons, I have been asked to raise my right hand, even though my left hand is the one with real meaning to me. Raising my right hand is like crossing my fingers behind my back. And my left hand is referred to by the handedness-bigoted as the "sinister" hand..... which is basically the "N-word" for the left handed. Etc., etc., etc.

And yet, left-handed people comprise approximately 10% of the population. It has been estimated at slightly higher than that, with the number being reduced a bit by the number of people who were forced by their teachers to be right-handed against their congenital preferences. (See what I did there?)

Anybody beginning to see the parallels here? If society can be forced to make adjustments—at society's expense no less—to accommodate A) the same-sex-attracted population (only 3% of all Americans self-identify as LGB according to the CDC, even in this most libertine of ages when you're not hip if you're not at least Bi/Curious: LINKEY), and B) an even tinier subset of the "not traditional hetero" population who self-identify as transgender, then CERTAINLY society can be forced at its own expense to accommodate the 10% of us who are left-handed so that our "condition" isn't either physically or financially discriminated against. After all, we are more than 3 times the numbers of the entire LGBT population. How is it that we left-handers wield so much less power than LGBTs? An even better question is, how can 3% of the population wield so MUCH power? And yet, we are discriminated against institutionally, not just culturally.

Personally, I think I'm being hosed and my rights are being violated. I demand my right to have a left-handed door hung at the entrance of every public-use building. I demand that manufacturers who sell products in this country which are ergonomically designed for right-handers ALSO dedicate 10% of their production to ergonomically left-handed designs, AT THE SAME PRICE as the right-handed models........... and not just on a few models, but for EVERY model of anything manufactured for right-handed use.

If that drives up the prices on everything for the rest of you right-supremacists, that's too bad. What's fair is fair, and I know my rights.

OR, some people could just get over the fact that nobody cares about their personal neuroses or what they do with their nether regions, and just get on with their lives and learn to DEAL WITH IT........and the rest of us......ALL 97% OF US......need to grow enough backbone to tell that 3% to go sell crazy down the street, we're all full up here.

Us lefties need to unite and demand that our right to be lefties is respected and that everyone must be handedness neutral and all products that are available for righties should be available for us at the same cost.

It's time we get the respect we deserve. Not only that, the reparations we are owed for all of societies prior transgressions against us. I demand we be considered part of a protected class. This bias must end. It's the way God made me so I must be accommodated, recognized and catered to.

Now I feel better about being a lefty.

[joe817]

I'm not sure I do see the parallel, TAM. I'm left handed, my wife is left handed, my 2 daughters are left handed, my Dad was left handed, my Granmother was left handed, 3 out of my 5 grandchildren are left handed. I was never forced to write 'right handed'. My condolences to you that you were forced to do something contrary to your being.

I was born in 1947 and grew up in a right handed world. There were no right handed rifles. I learned how to use a bolt action .22 and I didn't even know the difference. Same with a shotgun. And an original Colt 1911, army issue(I was 15 at the time). It is just the way it was. Didn't know any different. And allllll of the other guns I've owned since then are 'right handed'. It's just the way it was.

I think George Bush is left handed...certainly our incumbent President is left handed. Was Ronald Regan left handed? Not sure, but a possibility.

I'm not handicapped. Never have been, never will be in that regard.

I have sympathy for the LGBT community, but only to the extent that they all have an unbearable cross to bear, by their own choice.

[mojo84]

I'm not sure I do see the parallel, TAM. I'm left handed, my wife is left handed, my 2 daughters are left handed, my Dad was left handed, my Granmother was left handed, 3 out of my 5 grandchildren are left handed. I was never forced to write 'right handed'. My condolences to you that you were forced to do something contrary to your being.

I was born in 1947 and grew up in a right handed world. There were no right handed rifles. I learned how to use a bolt action .22 and I didn't even know the difference. Same with a shotgun. And an original Colt 1911, army issue(I was 15 at the time). It is just the way it was. Didn't know any different. And allllll of the other guns I've owned since then are 'right handed'. It's just the way it was.

I think George Bush is left handed...certainly our incumbent President is left handed. Was Ronald Regan left handed? Not sure, but a possibility.

I'm not handicapped. Never have been, never will be in that regard.

I have sympathy for the LGBT community, but only to the extent that they all have an unbearable cross to bear, by their own choice.

Think sarcasm.

I was also forced in kindergarten to write with my right hand. Well, until my mom realized what they were doing. When she finished with them, I could have written with my toes or teeth if I wanted to.

[The Annoyed Man]

Think sarcasm.

Oh I was definitely being sarcastic. joe817, go back and reread in that light.....

[joe817]

I'm not sure I do see the parallel, TAM. I'm left handed, my wife is left handed, my 2 daughters are left handed, my Dad was left handed, my Granmother was left handed, 3 out of my 5 grandchildren are left handed. I was never forced to write 'right handed'. My condolences to you that you were forced to do something contrary to your being.

I was born in 1947 and grew up in a right handed world. There were no right handed rifles. I learned how to use a bolt action .22 and I didn't even know the difference. Same with a shotgun. And an original Colt 1911, army issue(I was 15 at the time). It is just the way it was. Didn't know any different. And allllll of the other guns I've owned since then are 'right handed'. It's just the way it was.

I think George Bush is left handed...certainly our incumbent President is left handed. Was Ronald Regan left handed? Not sure, but a possibility.

I'm not handicapped. Never have been, never will be in that regard.

I have sympathy for the LGBT community, but only to the extent that they all have an unbearable cross to bear, by their own choice.

Think sarcasm.

I was also forced in kindergarten to write with my right hand. Well, until my mom realized what they were doing. When she finished with them, I could have written with my toes or teeth if I wanted to.

Huh?? Wait! OHHHH! Ok, understand. Sorry. My sense of humor has diminished over the last 2 years. Tnx for pointing that out mojo84. Me apologies TAM.

[mojo84]

[philip964]

I'm left handed in a right handed world. I grew up learning to use both sides of my body and brain.

I've felt sorry for the right handed ever since,

[The Annoyed Man]

Me apologies TAM.

No apologies necessary.

Sometimes it takes the absurdity of "demanding special concessions for the left-handed" to point out the absurdity of demanding the same for a tiny portion of the population who are confused about what goes where, and where they fit in all of that.