TexasCHLforum.com

docbrazos wrote:In times past my LGS kept 5 to 10 copy's of my DL and CHL on file at all times. Each 4473 had one stapled to the back of the form. Made the ATF happy and simplified inspections. Also simplified purchase as I didn't have to prove up every time!
Sorta like dealers that won't sell a gun without a photo ID (DL) even though you have a CHL which should be all the ID one needs.....but that's not the way it works.

I'm sure it did make the ATF happy. Having a detailed registry of everyone's guns would also make them happy.

jmra wrote:Yes, you still have to fill out the paperwork. I've never had anyone make copies of my DL or CHL nor would I allow them to.

Every time I buy a gun they photograph my DL and CHL. That has been done at more then one store.

texanjoker wrote:

jmra wrote:Yes, you still have to fill out the paperwork. I've never had anyone make copies of my DL or CHL nor would I allow them to.

Every time I buy a gun they photograph my DL and CHL. That has been done at more then one store.

That might be because you are LEO. They've seen the LEO/CHL crime rate comparison.

I know, you have a CHL and you are of outstanding character and I am thankful to have people like you serving the public. just ribbing you some.

I can't tell you why other than the fact I don't buy much from the LGS. Mostly I've bought from sporting goods stores or gun shows. One thing I do insist on is that my DL and CHL does not leave my sight. I have purchased at Cabelas and Bass Pro but that was before all the craziness with the roped off lines I hear about.

RX8er wrote:

JP171 wrote:

azwe wrote:Refusing to let me copy your ID voids all current and future sales.

well gee umm, good enough for me, keep your merchandise that is over priced and I don't need anyway and I'll spend my money to enrich someone else's life. it is in violation of us government regulations and law to copy some of my ID's and State law for others and my own personal guidelines for my Texas DL issued by DPS as well as my CHL also issued by DPS

What laws make it illegal to copy an ID and state law, a drivers license? And by this I mean not ones specifically calling out for fraudulent purposes.

I know in some normal cases of business, it is done perfectly legal. Go to the doctor and they make a copy of your DL and insurance card. Go to the bank with a large cash deposit and they get a fingerprint and a copy of your DL.

Federal law makes it illegal and punishable by 5 years in a federal pen for copying my us army ID, texas law makes it a class c misdemeanor to copy my texas military ID, so aww darn. I have never had my DL copied at any MD's office

jmra wrote:

texanjoker wrote:

jmra wrote:Yes, you still have to fill out the paperwork. I've never had anyone make copies of my DL or CHL nor would I allow them to.

Every time I buy a gun they photograph my DL and CHL. That has been done at more then one store.

That might be because you are LEO. They've seen the LEO/CHL crime rate comparison.

I know, you have a CHL and you are of outstanding character and I am thankful to have people like you serving the public. just ribbing you some.

I can't tell you why other than the fact I don't buy much from the LGS. Mostly I've bought from sporting goods stores or gun shows. One thing I do insist on is that my DL and CHL does not leave my sight. I have purchased at Cabelas and Bass Pro but that was before all the craziness with the roped off lines I hear about.

I got a good laugh out of that one

JP171 wrote:

RX8er wrote:

JP171 wrote:

azwe wrote:Refusing to let me copy your ID voids all current and future sales.

well gee umm, good enough for me, keep your merchandise that is over priced and I don't need anyway and I'll spend my money to enrich someone else's life. it is in violation of us government regulations and law to copy some of my ID's and State law for others and my own personal guidelines for my Texas DL issued by DPS as well as my CHL also issued by DPS

What laws make it illegal to copy an ID and state law, a drivers license? And by this I mean not ones specifically calling out for fraudulent purposes.

I know in some normal cases of business, it is done perfectly legal. Go to the doctor and they make a copy of your DL and insurance card. Go to the bank with a large cash deposit and they get a fingerprint and a copy of your DL.

Federal law makes it illegal and punishable by 5 years in a federal pen for copying my us army ID, texas law makes it a class c misdemeanor to copy my texas military ID, so aww darn. I have never had my DL copied at any MD's office

What is the penal code / reference for these two laws?

Keith B wrote:

knotquiteawake wrote:So if your CHL was revoked for committing a felony and you didn't return it to them you can still use it to skip the background check and purchase a gun (as a felon)? I didn't realize you could skip the background check, I thought it mostly just allowed you to skip putting down the SS# on the forms.

They will more than likely take your CHL if you are convicted of a felony and not give it back. And if you answer falsely that you are not currently under indictment for a felony, then you have lied anyway.

They don't wait till you're convicted to take it. They take it when you're charged.

JP171 wrote:

azwe wrote:Refusing to let me copy your ID voids all current and future sales.

well gee umm, good enough for me, keep your merchandise that is over priced and I don't need anyway and I'll spend my money to enrich someone else's life. it is in violation of us government regulations and law to copy some of my ID's and State law for others and my own personal guidelines for my Texas DL issued by DPS as well as my CHL also issued by DPS

100% popycock.

Well, after reading all of your posts it sparked a memory of when I bought my first firearm here in the state of Texas with my new Texas CHL. The sales associate DID copy both my DL and CHL. So, now they have it and I dont know why I didnt catch that. If I'm allowed to name the store I will but I guess I'll be taking my business elsewhere.

rockinar wrote:

JP171 wrote:

azwe wrote:Refusing to let me copy your ID voids all current and future sales.

well gee umm, good enough for me, keep your merchandise that is over priced and I don't need anyway and I'll spend my money to enrich someone else's life. it is in violation of us government regulations and law to copy some of my ID's and State law for others and my own personal guidelines for my Texas DL issued by DPS as well as my CHL also issued by DPS

100% popycock.

yep gotta love this poppycock baby

The photocopying of U.S. Government identification cards is a violation of Title 18, U.S. Code Part I, Chapter 33, Section 701 and punishable by fine and imprisonment.

the preceding is from the ALARACT that I received, what you didn't get the memo? oh I guess your not in the chain then.

oh and more importantly even than that I said NO can you not understand NO? if you can't please emigrate to Jamaica where they don't understand the word no either you'll feel right at home

RX8er wrote:

JP171 wrote: What is the penal code / reference for these two laws?

18 USC § 701 - Official badges, identification cards, other insignia.

Whoever manufactures, sells, or possesses any badge, identification card, or other insignia, of the design prescribed by the head of any department or agency of the United States for use by any officer or employee thereof, or any colorable imitation thereof, or photographs, prints, or in any other manner makes or executes any engraving, photograph, print, or impression in the likeness of any such badge, identification card, or other insignia, or any colorable imitation thereof, except as authorized under regulations made pursuant to law, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than six months, or both.

rockinar wrote:

Keith B wrote:

knotquiteawake wrote:So if your CHL was revoked for committing a felony and you didn't return it to them you can still use it to skip the background check and purchase a gun (as a felon)? I didn't realize you could skip the background check, I thought it mostly just allowed you to skip putting down the SS# on the forms.

They will more than likely take your CHL if you are convicted of a felony and not give it back. And if you answer falsely that you are not currently under indictment for a felony, then you have lied anyway.

They don't wait till you're convicted to take it. They take it when you're charged.

EDIT... Yes it will be suspended ("come and get it?")

GC §411.186. REVOCATION. (a) The department shall revoke a
license under this section if the license holder:
(1) was not entitled to the license at the time it was issued;
(2) made a m aterial misrepresentation or failed to disclose a
material fact in an application submitted under this subchapter;
(3) subsequently becomes ineligible for a license under Section
411.172, unless the sole basis for the ineligibility is that the license
holder is charged with the commission of a C lass A or Class B
misdemeanor or equivalent offense, or of an offense under Section
42.01, Penal Code, or equivalent offense, or of a f elony under an
information or indictment;
(4) is convicted of an offense under Section 46.035, Penal Code;
(5) is determined by the department to have engaged in conduct
constituting a reason to suspend a license listed in Section 411.187(a)
after the person's license has been previously suspended twice for the
same reason; or
(6) submits an application fee that is dishonored or reversed if the
applicant fails to submit a cashier's check or money order made payable
to the “Department of Public Safety of the State of Texas” in the amount
of the dishonored or reversed fee, plus $25, within 30 days of being
notified by the department that the fee was dishonored or reversed.
(b) If a peace officer believes a reason listed in Subsection (a) to revoke
a license exists, the officer shall prepare an affidavit on a form provided
by the department stating the reason for the revocation of the license and
giving the department all of the information available to the officer at the
time of the preparation of the form. The officer shall attach the officer's
reports relating to the license holder to the form and send the form and
attachments to the appropriate division of the department at its Austin
headquarters not later than the fifth working day after the date the form is
prepared. The officer shall send a copy of the form and the attachments to
the license holder. If the license holder has not surrendered the license or
the license was not seized as evidence, the license holder shall surrender
the license to the appropriate division of the department not later than the
10th day after the date the license holder receives the notice of revocation

Looks like,,,
It would take a convection, and OR an officer to submit an affidavit showing cause for a revocation.
EDIT.. Suspension is of course a different deal.... and will happen upon charge.
GC §411.187. SUSPENSION OF LICENSE

When a person is charged with a crime, the CHL is suspended pending the outcome of the case. If the person is subsequently convicted, then the CHL is revoked.

sjfcontrol wrote:When a person is charged with a crime, the CHL is suspended pending the outcome of the case. If the person is subsequently convicted, then the CHL is revoked.

Yes suspended.... sorry I meant to imply only that it was not automatically revoked after a charge.

E.Marquez wrote:

RX8er wrote:

JP171 wrote: What is the penal code / reference for these two laws?

18 USC § 701 - Official badges, identification cards, other insignia.

Whoever manufactures, sells, or possesses any badge, identification card, or other insignia, of the design prescribed by the head of any department or agency of the United States for use by any officer or employee thereof, or any colorable imitation thereof, or photographs, prints, or in any other manner makes or executes any engraving, photograph, print, or impression in the likeness of any such badge, identification card, or other insignia, or any colorable imitation thereof, except as authorized under regulations made pursuant to law, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than six months, or both.

Thanks for the federal law but I'm not talking federal ID, just wanted to get that one out of the way so we can move back to what the topic at hand is. Federal IDs Can be grouped in to commercial establishments and for official use only. Go to the VA and they will legally make all the copies they want.

I am only really talking about the state of Texas identification and how this topic started. It was said that if I, or anyone copies a driver license, it is illegal and I challenge this as it has been stated there are laws for it. Again, where is the Texas law that says I am breaking the law if I copy a Texas driver license?

Outside of the request quoted about, I am not asking for the federal laws. I happen to have a couple federal ID and as of about 2008, they stated sending out the mailers to remind me that I cannot and should not allow anyone to copy my ID except for official government use. They even give a hotline number that I can call to see if someone is legit or not.