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oohrah wrote: Sat Apr 24, 2021 11:39 amI know I will get a lot of pushback on this, so don't expect me to respond to your arguments.

Oohrah, I am sorry to see you post this comment because I honestly expected better of you. One of my favorite things about this board is that we can hold opposite opinions on any variety of topics and discuss them and learn from each other. We don't always convince the other of our positions, heck maybe that should be that we don't usually convince each other, but we can discuss things and convince talk about the various points. You attitude strikes me, and I am not saying you are but this is how it comes across to me, as someone saying I have made up my mind and don't try to confuse me with facts.

While I do have a different opinion on constitutional carry than you, I am much more concerned about your lack of being willing to discuss it. I think that hurts all of us when we cannot discuss things rationally, especially when we disagree.

crazy2medic wrote: Sat Apr 24, 2021 8:51 pm Other States have Constitutional Carry, but somehow the Citizen of Texas are not up to the task? Why are they smarter than Texans?

There are some folks, even those with a LTC, who don't truly believe in our 2nd amendment rights. I have read it several times and find nothing in the constitution about getting special training to exercise our rights. Any of them.

It's everyone's right but it also concerns me thinking about all the people who could possibly be carrying while unqualified to do so. So I understand those who are nervous about potential outcome.

Hoping not to hijack this thread so have started seperate topic

Distressed about lack of Constitutional Carry Support (Long)
https://texaschlforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=83&t=100353

I am planning on writing/calling those 3 Senators still on the fence and would encourage everyone else to as well (I have already done so with Dan Patrick and my Senator is who instead trying to introduce gun control legislation across Texas).

In fact, if you are against Constitutional Carry you might want to get with the gun control legislators to support your agenda. Some suggestions:
1. Prevent individuals from carry unlicensed handguns in their cars while out in public. Many of these individuals currently do not have training and education and are a threat to the public as a whole.
2. Increase training time for LTC, we want all these individuals to be super responsible not just a little responsible.
3. Charge more for the LTC process. It makes it more valuable and weeds out the individuals who are not serious about carrying a handgun.
4. Join my Texas Congresswoman in opposing open carry of long guns. In fact, you should not be able to carry (concealed or open) long guns in the state of Texas without training and legal education. By doing this you would stop the rash of crimes that are currently occurring across Texas with open carry long guns.

Again, open to discussion and change of mind, but at this point SUPPORT CONSTITUTIONAL CARRY, at the same time I support training and education.

I sometimes hear the argument that all of our constitutional rights have limitations. I don’t see that with the second amendment at all.

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

That includes any test, instructions, and teaching. I view those as infringements (in my little mind).

Also anyone who thinks that the “proficient qualification” means you know how to handle a firearm is smoking funny cigarettes.

carlson1 wrote: Sat Apr 24, 2021 11:31 pm I sometimes hear the argument that all of our constitutional rights have limitations. I don’t see that with the second amendment at all.

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

That includes any test, instructions, and teaching. I view those as infringements (in my little mind).

Also anyone who thinks that the “proficient qualification” means you know how to handle a firearm is smoking funny cigarettes.

anygunanywhere wrote: Sun Apr 25, 2021 2:55 am

carlson1 wrote: Sat Apr 24, 2021 11:31 pm I sometimes hear the argument that all of our constitutional rights have limitations. I don’t see that with the second amendment at all.

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

That includes any test, instructions, and teaching. I view those as infringements (in my little mind).

Also anyone who thinks that the “proficient qualification” means you know how to handle a firearm is smoking funny cigarettes.

I just watched a You Tube Video by Colonel West (from 12 days ago and seen by myself for the first time today). He makes the points much more eloquently with added information on Constitutional Carry, especially in the state of Texas

In this thread, I believe oohrah stated, “I do NOT support Constitutional carry….”

Granted I am a junior member in this forum, but how do you square the above statement with your oath of enlistment (below)?

“I, __________, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same;…”

I am more than willing to be educated on this but realistically if you support the Constitution you should probably support Constitutional Carry.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V3Tf-wXrzPo

Does anyone really think the D's would pass on such an opportunity? No, they always act in a unified, team effort. If they had 18 senators, and needed 18 votes, whatever legislation it was, it would pass, no questions.

EP45 wrote: Sun Apr 25, 2021 10:50 am I am more than willing to be educated on this but realistically if you support the Constitution you should probably support Constitutional Carry.

I support the Constitution and I support Constitutional carry but I am not comfortable thinking that every Joe and Joan around me may be carrying while not having any training or practice. It's possible to support it and still not like it.

LDB415 wrote: Sun Apr 25, 2021 1:51 pm I support the Constitution and I support Constitutional carry but I am not comfortable thinking that every Joe and Joan around me may be carrying while not having any training or practice. It's possible to support it and still not like it.

Fortunately there is no guaranteed right to be comfortable with one's exercising their Constitutional rights huh?

What makes you think there aren't people that have no training and practice running around carrying guns now? Especially in Houston. You think the criminals are trained? People get LTCs now and their only "training" they have is their proficiency test and they never do anything beyond that and carry anyway.

extremist wrote: Sun Apr 25, 2021 2:17 pm

LDB415 wrote: Sun Apr 25, 2021 1:51 pm I support the Constitution and I support Constitutional carry but I am not comfortable thinking that every Joe and Joan around me may be carrying while not having any training or practice. It's possible to support it and still not like it.

Fortunately there is no guaranteed right to be comfortable with one's exercising their Constitutional rights huh?

What makes you think there aren't people that have no training and practice running around carrying guns now? Especially in Houston. You think the criminals are trained? People get LTCs now and their only "training" they have is their proficiency test and they never do anything beyond that and carry anyway.

Yep, the highlighted in red, that right there. Gang members and other violent felons sure aren't going to classes and getting any sort of training.

K.Mooneyham wrote: Sun Apr 25, 2021 2:30 pm

extremist wrote: Sun Apr 25, 2021 2:17 pm

LDB415 wrote: Sun Apr 25, 2021 1:51 pm I support the Constitution and I support Constitutional carry but I am not comfortable thinking that every Joe and Joan around me may be carrying while not having any training or practice. It's possible to support it and still not like it.

Fortunately there is no guaranteed right to be comfortable with one's exercising their Constitutional rights huh?

What makes you think there aren't people that have no training and practice running around carrying guns now? Especially in Houston. You think the criminals are trained? People get LTCs now and their only "training" they have is their proficiency test and they never do anything beyond that and carry anyway.

Yep, the highlighted in red, that right there. Gang members and other violent felons sure aren't going to classes and getting any sort of training.

I am well aware on both points. I am not happy about those either. But I support the right of the legal portion mentioned to exercise their Constitutional right, even if foolishly. I see those numbers growing if this passes. As I said before, I support it because that is the right thing. I do not like that many will be foolish about it. I don't really see how any reasonable person could have an alternate opinion. YMMV

Expanding, I'm quite glad the criminals aren't training and practicing. It's the others I'm not thrilled about.

LDB415 wrote: Sun Apr 25, 2021 3:38 pm Expanding, I'm quite glad the criminals aren't training and practicing. It's the others I'm not thrilled about.

“I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery.”

― Thomas Jefferson