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Re: Major advancements for Texas CHL holders
Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 2:22 pm
by The_Busy_Mom
Bitterclinger wrote:Remember, back in 1776 the original program was free, required 0 hours of training, and had NO registration or licensing of any kind. I'd like to see all of the states return to that program. From that perspective, the progressives and opportunists should be glad to have gotten what they were able to get from prohibition thus far. These bills represent a minor victory, but the pendulum will swing back the other way when progressives outside of Texas can no longer tolerate living in the states they ruin, and decide to move here.
If you think it's called the "Bill of Rights" because "Bill of Things Properly Trained Taxpayers Could Do If They Met All The Requirements and Could Afford to Pay Additional Taxes in the Form of License Fees" was too long then maybe you have an honest argument. A stupid argument, but an honest argument. No. I suspect everybody knows EXACTLY what "shall not be infringed" means, but they either, A) don't like it because an armed citizenry is harder to control, and/or B) there is nothing in it which would help line the pockets of lawyers, lawmakers or CHL instructors.
Well, I can tell you that I am not a CHL instructor for the money. And as I posted a while back, I wasn't even alive, nor voting age, when the laws that affected our gun-carrying abilities were implemented. I am simply helping to educate those around me so that they can carry within the law, and do my part to change the law from the inside out. The more people we have carrying within the law, then maybe the greater chance we have to get back to the original meaning of 'shall not be infringed'. But shame on your for not having enough sight to understand that your 'lump-'em-all-together' approach won't win you what you want. Keep Calm, Carry On.
TBM
Re: Major advancements for Texas CHL holders
Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 3:16 pm
by tarkus
Without taking sides on the magnitude of these changes, one thing seems clear. If the reduction in training is a major advancement, then the current training requirements are a major infringement.
Re: Major advancements for Texas CHL holders
Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 4:30 pm
by Pacifist
Jim Lockey wrote:I can't find if Perry has signed HB48 or not?
Thanks again for all that you do.
HB48 was just signed in the Senate. Next stop is the good governor's desk.
Re: Major advancements for Texas CHL holders
Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 5:53 pm
by Keith B
tarkus wrote:Without taking sides on the magnitude of these changes, one thing seems clear. If the reduction in training is a major advancement, then the current training requirements are a major infringement.
It takes baby steps to gain back our gun rights. When the original CHL statutes were put in place in 1995 it had taken 11 years of hard work to even get the legislators to pass the bill. Over the next 18 years through the continued diligence and hard work by Charles Cotton, the TSRA and others we have slowly gained ground. While we would all like to gain it all back in one fell swoop, that is not going to happen. There are too many anti-gun legislators and lobbyists that fight against it. Bottom line, we owe Charles a big debt of gratitude for his going on 30 years of dedication to concealed carry in Texas. His vigilance during session to seeing we get as much as we can passed thorough the legislature by watching over the bills and helping craft their verbiage so they have the best chance of making it to the floor and passing the vote is extremely valuable to the cause!
Re: Major advancements for Texas CHL holders
Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 6:24 pm
by texanjoker
I appreciate the work you do Mr. Cotton. Any result is better then no results and coming from CA several years ago it is nice to see us going forward vs. backwards!
Re: Major advancements for Texas CHL holders
Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 7:04 pm
by K.Mooneyham
texanjoker wrote:I appreciate the work you do Mr. Cotton. Any result is better then no results and coming from CA several years ago it is nice to see us going forward vs. backwards!
I was stationed in California TWICE for a total of 10 years (2 year break in the middle). Compared to California, the laws in Texas are EXCELLENT, and getting better. For me, all the hard work by Mr. Cotton and so many others is very evident.
Re: Major advancements for Texas CHL holders
Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 7:49 pm
by tomtexan
Hats off to Mr. Cotton and others for their diligent work and determination!
Re: Major advancements for Texas CHL holders
Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 7:57 pm
by switch
Originally, HB 47 reduced the initial class to 4 hours. I think the Senate bill (and the amended bill finally passed) was changed to 6 hours. Therefore the statement 4 to 6 hours is incorrect. It should be 6 hours and that does NOT include the range time.
Re: Major advancements for Texas CHL holders
Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 8:09 pm
by Keith B
switch wrote:Originally, HB 47 reduced the initial class to 4 hours. I think the Senate bill (and the amended bill finally passed) was changed to 6 hours. Therefore the statement 4 to 6 hours is incorrect. It should be 6 hours and that does NOT include the range time.
Nope, the enrolled Senate bill SB864 still says not less than 4 and no more than 6 hours.
Re: Major advancements for Texas CHL holders
Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 8:27 pm
by switch
You are right. I had looked at that several times. Guess I was looking at different versions. :(
Re: Major advancements for Texas CHL holders
Posted: Sun May 26, 2013 5:50 am
by tobasco
I think it's a mistake to lower the bar for CHL. If anything I would want to increase the overall requirements. CHL holders are sort of an elite group right now and I think they should be. If someone has plastic then you know they are responsible and committed enough to have gone through the hoops to carry. I'm against constitutional carry for this reason but that seems to be what we are evolving towards in Texas. I know that most people in this thread disagree, but before you do I would wonder if you are taking for granted the high quality of the current body of CHL holders are and assuming it will always be that way. Having 100% of the population carrying would be excellent but not at any price.
Ironic that the changes will take place September 1st. I just hope it's not a new Eternal September.
Re: Major advancements for Texas CHL holders
Posted: Sun May 26, 2013 6:01 am
by papabear
I dont post much but thanks to you Mr. Cotton.
Re: Major advancements for Texas CHL holders
Posted: Sun May 26, 2013 6:17 am
by jmra
tobasco wrote:I think it's a mistake to lower the bar for CHL. If anything I would want to increase the overall requirements. CHL holders are sort of an elite group right now and I think they should be. If someone has plastic then you know they are responsible and committed enough to have gone through the hoops to carry. I'm against constitutional carry for this reason but that seems to be what we are evolving towards in Texas. I know that most people in this thread disagree, but before you do I would wonder if you are taking for granted the high quality of the current body of CHL holders are and assuming it will always be that way. Having 100% of the population carrying would be excellent but not at any price.
Ironic that the changes will take place September 1st. I just hope it's not a new Eternal September.
So you want to be one of the "elite" and you are opposed to something that is (was) a constitution right. You're right most (I would hope the vast majority) of people on this thread will disagree with you.
How do you define "shall not be infringed"?
Re: Major advancements for Texas CHL holders
Posted: Sun May 26, 2013 6:55 am
by Jumping Frog
tobasco wrote:I think it's a mistake to lower the bar for CHL. If anything I would want to increase the overall requirements. CHL holders are sort of an elite group right now and I think they should be. If someone has plastic then you know they are responsible and committed enough to have gone through the hoops to carry. I'm against constitutional carry for this reason but that seems to be what we are evolving towards in Texas. I know that most people in this thread disagree, but before you do I would wonder if you are taking for granted the high quality of the current body of CHL holders are and assuming it will always be that way. Having 100% of the population carrying would be excellent but not at any price.
Ironic that the changes will take place September 1st. I just hope it's not a new Eternal September.
Are you sure you don't live in New York? Being part of the ruling class elite is a way of life there. Maybe you'd be more comfortable in that environment.
As far as the "great unwashed masses", they have not been a problem in states that do allow Constitutional carry. In fact, I trust the common sense of the normal, everyday, average American a heck of a lot more than I trust the common sense of the Ruling Class.
Re: Major advancements for Texas CHL holders
Posted: Sun May 26, 2013 7:03 am
by Beiruty
I am NOT starting a flame war. However, The 2ndA, starts with "A well regulated......
CHL as well as gun ownership should be somehow regulated as it is high responsibility. "Wackos with guns" are real the enemy of our gun rights. It is just fresh in our mind what Loranza did of uncalculated harm to our rights.