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Is swearing at an toilet disorderly conduct???

Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2007 9:17 am
by stevie_d_64
http://www.thetimes-tribune.com/site/ne ... 5898&rfi=6

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[b[West Side woman faces jail time for swearing at toilet[/b]

BY KIMM R. MONTONE
STAFF WRITER
10/16/2007

A West Scranton woman could face up to 90 days in jail and a fine of up to $300 for allegedly shouting profanities at an overflowing toilet while inside her Luzerne Street home.

Dawn Herb, whose potty mouth caught the attention of an off-duty police officer, was charged with disorderly conduct recently, prompting her to fire off a letter to the editor and vow to fight the charge.

“It doesn’t make any sense. I was in my house. It’s not like I was outside or drunk,� said Ms. Herb, who resides at 924 Luzerne St. along with her four young children. “A cop can charge you with disorderly conduct for disrespecting them?�

The obscenities hit the fan when she battled her overflowing toilet around 8 p.m. Thursday, she said.

Although Ms. Herb doesn’t recall exactly what she said, she admitted that she was frustrated and let more than a few choice words fly. Unfortunately, it was near an open bathroom window.

“The toilet was overflowing and leaking down into the kitchen and I was yelling (for my daughter) to get the mop,� she said. “A guy is yelling, ‘and I yelled back, ‘Mind your own business.’ �

Her next-door neighbor, Patrick Gilman, a city police officer who was off-duty at the time, apparently had enough of Ms. Herb’s foul mouth and asked her to keep it down, police said. When Ms. Herb didn’t stop, he called the police.

Patrolman Gerald Tallo responded and charged Ms. Herb with disorderly conduct.

The citation accuses the defendant of using obscene language or gestures “with intent to cause public inconvenience, annoyance or alarm or recklessly (creating) a risk ...�

“There was no intent to do anything,� Ms. Herb said. “I just feel so violated and irritated ... I don’t even have a criminal record.�

Efforts to reach Patrolmen Gilman and Tallo were unsuccessful.

Scranton Public Safety Director Ray Hayes said if anyone feels they were unjustly accused, they can address it before a judge.

“At the end of the day, the opinion that counts is of the magisterial judge,� he said. “It may be something open to interpretation. The officer has his own and this person had the opposite opinion.�

The use of obscene language or gestures is an offense under the state criminal code. But cursing at a police officer isn’t a punishable offense, said Mary Catherine Roper, an attorney with the American Civil Liberties Union based in Philadelphia.

“It cannot be the basis for a citation. You can’t prosecute somebody for swearing at a cop or a toilet,� she said. “We bring one of these cases a year and sue some police departments because they do not remember that they are not the language police.�

Contact the writer: kmontone@timesshamrock.com


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I wonder what the Texas statutes say???

I just couldn't resist when I saw this... ;-)

Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2007 9:34 am
by seamusTX
PC §42.01. DISORDERLY CONDUCT.
(a) A person commits an offense if he intentionally or knowingly:
(1) uses abusive, indecent, profane, or vulgar language in a public place, and the language by its very utterance tends to incite an immediate breach of the peace;
IMHO, a person cannot be prosecuted for swearing on private property in Texas. They could be possibly be prosecuted under a noise ordinance.

The obscenity statute applies to visual representations, not speech.

- Jim

Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2007 11:27 am
by KBCraig
Of course, this took place in Pennsylvania, so the rules are different. So different, in fact, that a man is in jail on $100,000 bond for yelling at a police dog that startled him!

http://kdka.com/topstories/local_story_282202055.html

Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2007 11:36 am
by seamusTX
“A police dog is a police officer. There is no difference under the law,� [Judge] Ricciardi tells KDKA.
So I guess police dogs can vote and be prosecuted for crimes in Pennsylvania. :???:
According to the police report, King placed his hand on his back pocket and threatened to “shank� the dog. After police arrested him and patted him down, they discovered King was carrying a knife.
I think that's what got him the high bail.

- Jim

Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2007 1:24 pm
by OverEasy
I guess we are all lucky that the lady in PA didn't have a CHL and didn't shoot the toilet.
There, Stevie D, that ought to make this thread "legal" for the forum.

You're welcome, OE :grin:

Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2007 2:30 pm
by stevie_d_64
Thanks...

I even missed the "foul" language in the article...Mods caught that one...Thanks...

I just thought this was funny from an LE viewpoint...

Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2007 4:02 pm
by Will938
seamusTX wrote:
PC §42.01. DISORDERLY CONDUCT.
(a) A person commits an offense if he intentionally or knowingly:
(1) uses abusive, indecent, profane, or vulgar language in a public place, and the language by its very utterance tends to incite an immediate breach of the peace;
IMHO, a person cannot be prosecuted for swearing on private property in Texas. They could be possibly be prosecuted under a noise ordinance.

The obscenity statute applies to visual representations, not speech.

- Jim
That and the supreme court has ruled that the utterance of obscenities by themselves are not unlawful speech. They must be directed at someone.

Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2007 8:01 pm
by Venus Pax
Will938 wrote: That and the supreme court has ruled that the utterance of obscenities by themselves are not unlawful speech. They must be directed at someone.
Do they consider the toilet to be someone?

Does anyone else find this whole story incredibly amusing?

Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2007 8:27 pm
by Skiprr
I thought only Senator Larry Craig, due to a restraining order, was prohibited from swearing at public toilets. Or was that swearing in public toilets?

Ahem.

To keep it on topic, I agree with Will938 and seamusTX. :grin:

Posted: Wed Oct 17, 2007 11:58 am
by stevie_d_64
Venus Pax wrote:
Will938 wrote: That and the supreme court has ruled that the utterance of obscenities by themselves are not unlawful speech. They must be directed at someone.
Do they consider the toilet to be someone?

Does anyone else find this whole story incredibly amusing?
Yes... ;-)

I tend to say nice things to my toilet(s)...I try not to upset them as they tend to react in a negative fashion if they get yelled at...

Posted: Wed Oct 17, 2007 12:17 pm
by txinvestigator
seamusTX wrote:
PC §42.01. DISORDERLY CONDUCT.
(a) A person commits an offense if he intentionally or knowingly:
(1) uses abusive, indecent, profane, or vulgar language in a public place, and the language by its very utterance tends to incite an immediate breach of the peace;
IMHO, a person cannot be prosecuted for swearing on private property in Texas. They could be possibly be prosecuted under a noise ordinance.

The obscenity statute applies to visual representations, not speech.

- Jim
Private Property CAN be a public place. Disorderly Conduct CAN be charged on private property.

This charge would not fly in Texas under PC 42.01 a(1) because inside her home is NOT a public place and the language did not tend to incite an immediate breach of the peace.

Posted: Wed Oct 17, 2007 12:32 pm
by seamusTX
txinvestigator wrote:Private Property CAN be a public place. Disorderly Conduct CAN be charged on private property.
Like a mall.

I should have said in a residence.

- Jim

Posted: Wed Oct 17, 2007 3:18 pm
by stevie_d_64
Hey! Stop it! Y'all are gettin' too serious!!!

Remember, potty humor is yer friend... :lol:

Posted: Wed Oct 17, 2007 8:13 pm
by boomerang
It's my potty and I'll cry if I want to.

Posted: Wed Oct 17, 2007 8:14 pm
by DFWCHLer
boomerang wrote:It's my potty and I'll cry if I want to.
20 lashes with a wet noodle for that sentence and its impersonation of humor. :razz: