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FL - Grocery store "shootout"
Posted: Tue Apr 29, 2008 2:44 pm
by thejtrain
Only, it was just the perp who was doing the shooting.
Palm Beach Post
Tuesday, April 29, 2008
WEST PALM BEACH — It could've been a typical spat between grocery store customer and manager, with the customer announcing he planned to take his business elsewhere. But then the customer drew his gun. The store manager drew his and so did the assistant manager.
It all happened at 5 p.m. Monday at the IGA Supermarket at 1000 36th St. in West Palm Beach. And in the end, West Palm Beach police arrested customer Marshall Hugo Grant for attempted first-degree murder, shooting into an occupied dwelling, aggravated assault with a firearm and carrying a concealed firearm.
Police reported Tuesday morning that Grant, 73, entered the store through the exit despite manager Marino Hernandez's warning not to enter that way. The confrontation escalated, Grant drew a handgun; assistant manager Roberto Espinal drew his handgun. Hernandez also pulled a gun. Grant backed out of the store, firing three times as he went, the arrest report states.
The managers, who witnesses said never returned fire, ended up surrounding Grant, who hid behind a vehicle while continuing to fire, according to the police report. Grant eventually surrendered his weapon to the managers, once they told him police were on their way.
Grant appeared Tuesday morning before Judge Nancy Perez, who ordered him held without bond while he undergoes a psychiatric examination.
Say what we might about the tactics of the employees (whether they should have shot the perp to stop the threat, etc.), this is a great, GREAT illustration of the difference between those who carry illegally and their indifference to "shootouts" (it's obvious the gun-grabbers are talking about THOSE folks when playing up the "it'll be like the OK corral again!" canard) and those who take the time, money, & energy to carry legally and
their steadfast, even sometimes risky, avoidance of shootouts.
Sorry if this was posted already, I couldn't find it if it was.
JT
Hat tip:
Of Arms and the Law
Re: FL - Grocery store "shootout"
Posted: Tue Apr 29, 2008 4:46 pm
by Blinking Dog
Yes, it appears the legal, licensed to carry folks drew but assessed the situation and held their fire, while the guy carrying illegally just blasted away.
Too bad the anti's probably won't see the lesson here.
Re: FL - Grocery store "shootout"
Posted: Tue Apr 29, 2008 7:25 pm
by shootthesheet
I wouldn't want to but I would have fired to stop the old guy from shooting. It was an act of God that he didn't kill some innocent person. Those of us who believe that a gun is the great equalizer should take this situation as a way to prepare. An aggressor with a gun is not always who we might think of as a problem. People under 18 and over 70 can be as much a danger as the "Gang Bangers" and the thugs. They don't necessarily have to dress any way or even be male. It is the one we don't expect that will get us while we are off guard.
Older people often feel threatened by things most of us wouldn't consider threatening. Even if the person is confused or yelling or whatever, treat them with respect and kindness and call a LEO. Otherwise they may react this way or have health issues that could harm them. Maybe the old guy should have had supervision and maybe the guys in the store need to learn how to deal with older people. It sounds to me like they needed to find a way to deal with him without letting it go to this point. But, since I wasn't there, what do I know.
Re: FL - Grocery store "shootout"
Posted: Tue Apr 29, 2008 8:54 pm
by flb_78
Seems like a lot of nothing for just entering through an exit at a supermarket.
Re: FL - Grocery store "shootout"
Posted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 3:06 am
by Glock 23
shootthesheet wrote:\
Older people often feel threatened by things most of us wouldn't consider threatening. Even if the person is confused or yelling or whatever, treat them with respect and kindness and call a LEO. Otherwise they may react this way or have health issues that could harm them. Maybe the old guy should have had supervision and maybe the guys in the store need to learn how to deal with older people. It sounds to me like they needed to find a way to deal with him without letting it go to this point. But, since I wasn't there, what do I know.
so because he was "old", no one should tell him what the rules are and he doesnt have to follow them?
As for finding a way to deal with him - it wasnt the managers who escalated the dispute (at least not to the lethal level).
flb_78 wrote:Seems like a lot of nothing for just entering through an exit at a supermarket.
yea, but what if he does this all the time despite managers telling him not to? And cant a business refuse to serve anybody for any reason? (excluding discrimination)
Re: FL - Grocery store "shootout"
Posted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 6:27 am
by bdickens
Paranoid people, sure but not older people.
I really doubt very much that "Older people often feel threatened by things most of us wouldn't consider threatening." I've seen enough stories about "older people" who didn't seem threatened by anything!