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Do to my recent encounter with Law Enforcement due to a traffic accident, I got to thinking about something that has long been a discussion to varying degrees in our community...

By law we are required to notify Law Enforcement to fully ID ourselves and our carry status when asked to do so...

I believe the intent of that requirement from the beginning was intended to be a courtesy to Law Enforcement, and not one bent upon some discussions as a breach of any kind of trust or mistrust between the two communities...

That being said, I believe the general temperament of Law Enforcement in this state is very neutral to downright (I don't give a hoot) to your "gun" issue thing...

I want to know if anyone feels like if the law was changed to remove the penalties and other issues the state may have to have this requirement to "notify" stricken from the law we carry under in this state...A few other states do not require this to happen, and they seem to get along just fine without creating this "tension" in most encounters the public has with its Law Enforcement...

I believe we should be trusted to not be a problem or concern to those who protect and serve, simply because of the hoops we jump through to get the certification...

I'll try to poll this in this thread and see where we fall on this in a statisical form...

I agree that the law doesn't serve much practical purpose, but I also believe it is harmless and that the penalties aren't all that tough. It just isn't worth the political cap. There are two big issues to be fought over in '09 that are issues of saving lives. Parking lots and school carry.
Flashing a CHL isn't a big deal when asked for an ID and to me its just not worth fighting for at this time

Liberty wrote:I agree that the law doesn't serve much practical purpose, but I also believe it is harmless and that the penalties aren't all that tough. It just isn't worth the political cap. There are two big issues to be fought over in '09 that are issues of saving lives. Parking lots and school carry.
Flashing a CHL isn't a big deal when asked for an ID and to me its just not worth fighting for at this time

stevie_d_64 wrote:By law we are required to notify Law Enforcement to fully ID ourselves and our carry status when asked to do so...

Not quite..........

Although a good number of LEO's probably believe just what you said above is true, but it is NOT. (completely).

We are only required by Law to present our CHL, when asked for identification, WHEN WE ARE CARRYING.
If we are not carrying there is no Law that requires us to show the CHL.

Now, with that being said,.......I still voted to eliminate all the Laws concerning this and I did it because of the misconceptions of many LEO's that don't know the law and can escalate an otherwise routine stop to a lecture on the 2A and State Laws that they know nothing about.

Also, many Texas residents can legally carry a pistol on their person (in their car) without a CHL AT ALL! Why is it necessary for us to produce CHL when carrying and others (who have not gone thru the process we have) do not have to show anything but their DL?

AEA wrote:
Now, with that being said,.......I still voted to eliminate all the Laws concerning this and I did it because of the misconceptions of many LEO's that don't know the law and can escalate an otherwise routine stop to a lecture on the 2A and State Laws that they know nothing about.

If there are still that many LEOs who don't understand the law, making more changes isn't going to lead to better understanding of the laws. I don't believe that it is that widely misunderstood today. We read many reports of CHL holders being stopped by LEOs. Very few of these reports involve misunderstanding of the the officers view of CHL laws, and it seems that those reports of such misunderstandings are pretty old. We have a saying in my line of of work. "If it ain't broke don't fix it."

The real reason for resenting having to display our CHLs is that non CHL holders who are carrying don't have to show any ID when requested under some circumstances and don't have to volunteer anything regarding their carry status. Should this be fixed?

We will still be required to display our CHL at some point. Any change is likely to actually increase the penalty for not having it on us.

Before this gets into a re-hash of years of previous discussions, agreements and dissagreements..."AEA" is correct on the technical aspects and intent of the present law...

What I am introducing, is that there seems to be an extreme indifference towards the CHL community from Texas Law Enforcement (statewide) to our following the requirements in the law...

If it has gotten to the point where you are stopped for any reason, you follow the law and present all credentials, ID, proof of current insurance, registration, a note from your mother etc etc...And the one thing that can subtlely change the demeanor of the contact with Law Enforcement is treated like...[insert chirping cricket sound effects]...

Then I would propose that provision in the law remain in place, but "notification" becoming an option to disclose this at anytime during the interaction, and that the penalties, whatever they become be removed from the law for not disclosing this little tidbit of information at the onset...

We all know they will find out anyway...That goes without saying...

What I'm getting at is that over the last 12-13 years our state has grown up a bit, and that some of these things in the law have become a bit outdated since the laws inception...We've matured, and proven the naysayers (who we conceded many over-bearing things that are in the law today) wrong...And we will continue to do so...

Sure, we'll get a few things tweeked every session, and that has worked really well thanks to a lot of us on this board, and other groups who work hard to get those things done...

I have to think about this one, so I haven't voted yet. I have mixed feelings about it.

My option isn't up there. I don't mind showing my CHL and informing the officer that I have a gun, but I don't like the idea of someone having the right to take my weapon from me.

Since the LEO is going to find out about your CHL anyway, I think its best to be forthcoming and get that out on the table right up front.

Many states seem to function just fine without a duty to notify. There's no reason Texas couldn't get along just fine without it.

KBCraig wrote:Many states seem to function just fine without a duty to notify. There's no reason Texas couldn't get along just fine without it.

That was my reasoning, as well.

quidni wrote:

KBCraig wrote:Many states seem to function just fine without a duty to notify. There's no reason Texas couldn't get along just fine without it.

That was my reasoning, as well.

and I also believe this reasoning should be applied to OC also.

I had an opportunity to speak with a deputy on a duty call last week. I made mention of the CHL as a courtesy. Her response was inline with the thinking here, saying, "It's getting to where you don't even need that." as a nod to the new car carry.
I'm sure many officers are seeing it that way.

I have been a cop, and I am now a civilian. I have always notified an officer that I am armed. I did so as a police officer, I did so prior to CHL and I have no issue doing it now. Those that carry under the right to carry in the car should also. The officer, if told knows that you are probably ok if you offer the information. If he finds it himself he might go into his "what is he not telling me" mode.
Cops are a suspicous sort, as they should be. Information is thier friend. So are you if you provide it. Just my two cents.

How been suggested that anyone with a weapon(gun) has to reveal their "card to carry" upon being stopped or questioned. (Yes, only when carrying). This would include, CHL, LEO. One can guess who is against that idea.