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Is this true?
Posted: Wed Nov 26, 2008 11:04 pm
by RiverRat
from CHL-Texass Newsletter - N0v 1, 2008
A second case was a young man here in Austin who did not have a concealed
handgun license. He was stopped with a loaded handgun in his console. He told
the policeman about the handgun. He was arrested and charged with illegally
carrying in spite of the new laws that passed September, 2007. His attorney pled
him guilty and as part of the punishment he had to come and take a class. He
can't apply for a license because of the plea.
We have been told that the powers that be don't feel the deputies and policemen
capable of deciding if you are "legally where you are, not doing any of the
exceptions, and have the right to have the handgun in your car." What ever the
problem is, tell anyone who does not have a CHL license to be careful carrying a
handgun in their vehicle especially in the city areas.
Sounds like more confusion as prior to the "traveling" redefinition. Anyone know any facts related to this? My step daughter has been carrying in her car after we told her it is legal...Sept 2007 bill...she has been working part time as a courier.
Re: Is this true?
Posted: Wed Nov 26, 2008 11:11 pm
by stroo
Unless there are circumstances we don't know about, and there may be, his lawyer failed him spectacularly.
Re: Is this true?
Posted: Wed Nov 26, 2008 11:11 pm
by AEA
This person should get himself a better lawyer and sue the City and his former lawyer!
Appeal the case and get a bunch of money at the same time. Then go ahead and apply for his CHL and buy the best Custom Gun that he want's......money being no object!
Re: Is this true?
Posted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 6:19 am
by Morgan
Yeah, I fail to see how "travel" can be defined narrowly. I looked in a number of law dictionaries and none of them define "travel" and the dictionary is PLENTY broad... basically "going from one point to another." By definition, if I get in my car and drive 2 houses down, I've traveled.
Re: Is this true?
Posted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 7:55 am
by AEA
"Travelling" has NOTHING to do with what the guy was doing..........
"legally where you are, not doing any of the exceptions, and have the right to have the handgun in your car."
This is what the OP stated and this is what Austin DA/Police Chief obviously do not understand.
Or.......do understand completely and choose to circumvent the law as it is written.........
I cannot quote the Law but I bet I know it better than they do.....
As long as you are Legally eligible to purchase a handgun in the state of Texas and you are not a member of any Gang and have no intentions of causing anyone any harm and are not in a Legally Defined "Gun Free Zone" then they have no case against you. You can carry the pistol in your car loaded as long as it remains concealed.
Sounds to me like Chuckie R. has got some associates in Austin. Hopefully they will meet his same fate.....
Re: Is this true?
Posted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 7:58 am
by Liberty
AEA wrote:"Travelling" has NOTHING to do with what they guy was doing..........
"legally where you are, not doing any of the exceptions, and have the right to have the handgun in your car."
This is what the OP stated and this is what Austin DA/Police Chief obviously do not understand.
Or.......do understand completely and choose to circumvent the law as it is written.........
I cannot quote the Law but I bet I know it better than they do.....
As long as you are Legally eligible to purchase a handgun in the state of Texas and you are not a member of any Gang and have no intentions of causing anyone any harm and are not in a Legally Defined "Gun Free Zone" then they have no case against you. You can carry the pistol in your car loaded as long as it remains concealed.
Sounds to me like Chuckie R. has got some associates in Austin. Hopefully they will meet his same fate.....
You left out one potential huge loophole. You cant be breaking any laws with the exception of minor traffic offences.. I believe the if you litter. for example you can be busted for Unlawful
carry.
Re: Is this true?
Posted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 8:07 am
by AEA
Yep, ya got me..........forgot about that part as I can only assume that anyone that met all the others would not be breaking any laws.
I am not sure however that litter would be considered a law broken for the charges he faced with regard to the handgun.
I never saw anything in the OP's text that the guy was littering. But for arguments sake, I guess he could have been littering, or trying to tell the Cop what the law really was, or arrogant, or didn't move fast enough for them, or whatever it might have taken to get him into the Jail and into the court.
Bottom line is he was taken advantage of in Court and it needs to be appealed and rectified.
Re: Is this true?
Posted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 9:19 am
by MBGuy
If you are carrying in your car under the Motorist Protection Act, do you even have to inform the LEO that you have a firearm in the car? I know under CHL you do, but I don't think you have to tell them up front that you're carrying in the car. Do they even have a right to ask? In Austin, or even Houston/DFW/SA, I'd be afraid to answer honestly.
Re: Is this true?
Posted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 9:53 am
by SCone
Every LEO I've ever met with the window down has asked, "Do you have any weapons or drugs in the car?" It is an offense to lie to an officer.
Re: Is this true?
Posted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 10:25 am
by RiverRat
I am still curious as to the facts related to the case. I haven't found anything.
IMHO, You don't get stopped by police without some cause, even in Austin. He might have been a gang member or worse. The weapons charge might have been a plea bargain. A bunch of 20 yr old hoods (south of Brownsville citizens) were shooting at police recently in NW Austin.....one using an AK (his last exposure to firearms).
The news media never gives enough facts to make any determinations.
Re: Is this true?
Posted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 10:27 am
by bdickens
Really, now?
Re: Is this true?
Posted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 10:28 am
by John
SCone wrote:Every LEO I've ever met with the window down has asked, "Do you have any weapons or drugs in the car?" It is an offense to lie to an officer.
Not that i've been stopped often, but i have never actually been asked that question. Maybe it's because i hand them my TDL and CHL when they come to the window though.
As to the orginal post, would like to know more about the situation. Maybe there was more than a minor traffic violation. Wonder too if he indicated that he wasn't "traveling", I.E. going to the store... bags of groceries...
Re: Is this true?
Posted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 11:18 am
by flintknapper
SCone wrote:Every LEO I've ever met with the window down has asked, "Do you have any weapons or drugs in the car?" It is an offense to lie to an officer.
I believe that is incorrect unless:
False Report to a Police Officer
Texas Penal Code Section 37.08
You commit this offense if, with intent to deceive, you knowingly make a false statement that is material to a criminal investigation and you make that statement to a peace officer conducting the investigation; or (2) any employee of a law enforcement agency that is authorized by the agency to conduct the investigation and you know that is what he or she is doing. This offense is a Class B Misdemeanor.
Also, you are required to truthfully give your "correct" Name, Address and Date of Birth if asked by an officer. Other than that (sans an investigation) you can lie all you want (or just be silent).
Re: Is this true?
Posted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 1:26 pm
by Liberty
flintknapper wrote:SCone wrote:Every LEO I've ever met with the window down has asked, "Do you have any weapons or drugs in the car?" It is an offense to lie to an officer.
I believe that is incorrect unless:
False Report to a Police Officer
Texas Penal Code Section 37.08
You commit this offense if, with intent to deceive, you knowingly make a false statement that is material to a criminal investigation and you make that statement to a peace officer conducting the investigation; or (2) any employee of a law enforcement agency that is authorized by the agency to conduct the investigation and you know that is what he or she is doing. This offense is a Class B Misdemeanor.
Also, you are required to truthfully give your "correct" Name, Address and Date of Birth if asked by an officer. Other than that (sans an investigation) you can lie all you want (or just be silent).
While it might be OK to lie to a Texas cop, don't go lying to a Fed. They locked up Skooter Libby and Martha Stuart not for anything they did wrong, but just for fibbing about it.
Re: Is this true?
Posted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 8:13 pm
by bdickens
Not really. What they did was lie about stuff that was material to an ongoing investigation.