TexasCHLforum.com

I was wondering what kind of response you get from places that post the 30.06 sign.?

And has anyone asked them, now they have a sign place to keep the good guys out, what does there place of business have in place to keep the bad guy out ?

And do they really thing the sign will keep a bad guy from bring in a weapons ?

Also, has a business removed the sign after you talked to them ?

BAT

The one place I've asked - Rockwall Toyota - gave me a confusing answer. They said a company was hired to post all legally required signs at their new dealership. They tried to give the impression that the 30.06 signs were either required by their insurance company or Toyota and were installed by this company. (I checked with a friend in the industry and that is not the case) Then the store director told me that he was a CHL holders himself. I met with the owner of the dealership and got the same basic story, but no commitment to remove the signs - which remain up today. I learned later that the owner was a Californian that moved here to open this dealership. The California mentality could explain the signs.

Their decision cost them a sale as I purchased a new Toyota elsewhere. I really should have faxed them a copy of the sales receipt along with a note telling them why they lost the sale.

Commander wrote:Their decision cost them a sale as I purchased a new Toyota elsewhere. I really should have faxed them a copy of the sales receipt along with a note telling them why they lost the sale.

It's not too late.

Since only 3-4% of the population in Texas has a CHL license, and this sign applies to CHL holders, then I'd guess only 3-4% of the population has any idea what it is for. I've spent the last 15+ years in various management positions in Retail and HR and the only people I've ever met who understood the sign were fellow CHL holders.

In my opinion, there are several reasons it is posted:
* With full knowledge and intent - i.e. gun shows
* Because somebody from corporate sent them a packet of signs to post
* A friend/associate told the manager if they didn't then people could carry guns in their store

The challenge with those who post the sign without knowledge/intent is they generally do not understand or care about the impact on CHL holders. Talking to them is like my wife trying to explain the differences between two types of makeup base. I see her lips moving and I want to understand but it's just not in my DNA.

Lodge2004 wrote:Since only 3-4% of the population in Texas has a CHL license, and this sign applies to CHL holders, then I'd guess only 3-4% of the population has any idea what it is for.

Sadly, the percentage is even lower than that. Using the July 2008 U.S. census estimates and the 2007 DPS CHL holders plus instructors data, only 1.19% of the total populatino in Texas has a license. Hopefully we made an additional dent in that in 2008, but we'll need to get from 291,000 licensees to 730,000 to reach 3%...which would be a worthy goal!

While I'm sure every lost sale is important to a retailer, especially in this economy, if they go only by the marketplace numbers they may not be too worried about excluding only 1.19% of their potential customer base if they feel doing so provides some sort of (false) sense of security to the other 98.81%. Communicating to retailers why excluding those law-abiding 291,000 CHLers is not a good idea is one place the new Texas CHL Forum, Inc. might help us.

And in getting that 291,000 count closer to 730,000!

Skiprr wrote:

Lodge2004 wrote:Since only 3-4% of the population in Texas has a CHL license, and this sign applies to CHL holders, then I'd guess only 3-4% of the population has any idea what it is for.

Sadly, the percentage is even lower than that. Using the July 2008 U.S. census estimates and the 2007 DPS CHL holders plus instructors data, only 1.19% of the total populatino in Texas has a license. Hopefully we made an additional dent in that in 2008, but we'll need to get from 291,000 licensees to 730,000 to reach 3%...which would be a worthy goal!

While I'm sure every lost sale is important to a retailer, especially in this economy, if they go only by the marketplace numbers they may not be too worried about excluding only 1.19% of their potential customer base if they feel doing so provides some sort of (false) sense of security to the other 98.81%. Communicating to retailers why excluding those law-abiding 291,000 CHLers is not a good idea is one place the new Texas CHL Forum, Inc. might help us.

And in getting that 291,000 count closer to 730,000!

I guess it depends on the retailer. but 1.9% can make a huge difference in bonuses and profits to some retailers. One retailer once told me that one complaint equals 10 unhappy customers that will not come back. Most unhappy customers don't bother to complain. They just don't come back.

Skiprr wrote:

Lodge2004 wrote:Since only 3-4% of the population in Texas has a CHL license, and this sign applies to CHL holders, then I'd guess only 3-4% of the population has any idea what it is for.

Sadly, the percentage is even lower than that. Using the July 2008 U.S. census estimates and the 2007 DPS CHL holders plus instructors data, only 1.19% of the total populatino in Texas has a license. Hopefully we made an additional dent in that in 2008, but we'll need to get from 291,000 licensees to 730,000 to reach 3%...which would be a worthy goal!

While I'm sure every lost sale is important to a retailer, especially in this economy, if they go only by the marketplace numbers they may not be too worried about excluding only 1.19% of their potential customer base if they feel doing so provides some sort of (false) sense of security to the other 98.81%. Communicating to retailers why excluding those law-abiding 291,000 CHLers is not a good idea is one place the new Texas CHL Forum, Inc. might help us.

And in getting that 291,000 count closer to 730,000!

Chas pointed out in a previous post of mine (http://www.texasshooting.com/TexasCHL_F ... =chl+stats" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;) That there are over 300K CHLers. The stats just haven't been updated on the DPS site yet.

Edit: also when counting the stats I don't think you want to look at the total population, you want to look at the eligible popultion (over 21, no felonies, etc)

LarryH wrote:

Commander wrote:Their decision cost them a sale as I purchased a new Toyota elsewhere. I really should have faxed them a copy of the sales receipt along with a note telling them why they lost the sale.

It's not too late.

Send them a copy of what could have been theirs...

Lodge2004 wrote:Since only 3-4% of the population in Texas has a CHL license, and this sign applies to CHL holders, then I'd guess only 3-4% of the population has any idea what it is for. I've spent the last 15+ years in various management positions in Retail and HR and the only people I've ever met who understood the sign were fellow CHL holders.

In my opinion, there are several reasons it is posted:
* With full knowledge and intent - i.e. gun shows
* Because somebody from corporate sent them a packet of signs to post
* A friend/associate told the manager if they didn't then people could carry guns in their store

The challenge with those who post the sign without knowledge/intent is they generally do not understand or care about the impact on CHL holders. Talking to them is like my wife trying to explain the differences between two types of makeup base. I see her lips moving and I want to understand but it's just not in my DNA.

There are two types of makeup base?

If the 2% are active enough they can get anything done. Consider the absolute complacency of the American public in general.

I have gotten 3 signs pulled down and one that remained up only because they had no choice. Fight every one that is put up by reporting it here and other sites. Encourage anyone who has the ability to carry in the state to write or call the place to get them to remove it.

Remember, 2% is only the amount of Texas CHL holders. Every person that can legally carry in the state can and should work to help improve our laws and decrease our restrictions. How many states CCW holders are legal in Texas and how many CCW holders in each of those states? I have helped change laws in several states in the last few years. That is why I miss packing.org because we were able to organize at a national level and help each other. The NRA e-mail alerts are good for that too. If there is a state we are licensed to carry in then post it here and we can write or call who we need in other states to help improve their laws. I don't think Kansas would even have CCW if it were not for out of state people contacting the right people and telling them they would not spend a penny in their state if they did not pass CCW. Same for changes in other states. It is up to us and on us. Just because the law exists one way doesn't mean it has to stay that way. Just because some business post does not mean they will not change their minds. It just takes good people doing something to change things.

Whether the percentage is 1.9 or 3, the real question is "What percentage of potential customers am I turning away?".
In the case of new car dealerships, I'd be willing to bet that a CHL holder is much more likely to buy a new car every few years than the public at large.
But that's speculation on my part.

I'd love to see some real demographic numbers on just what sort of people CHL holders are compared to the general poplation:

Do we tend to have higher credit scores?
Average income?
Percentage who own their home?
How often do we buy new cars?

We already know none of us have a criminal record. none.

I think if we had a clearer demographic picture of just who we are, in terms that a business owner can relate to, we could make our case better.

Rex B wrote:We already know none of us have a criminal record. none.

For every rule there's an exception...

For those who may be interested into looking at what state licenses cover where.

http://www.handgunlaw.us/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Fangs wrote:

Rex B wrote:We already know none of us have a criminal record. none.

For every rule there's an exception...

Are you suggesting that a person with a criminal record can legally obtain a CHL in Texas?

I guess a felon who served his sentence could petition the governor for reinstatement of gun rights.
Is that what you allude to?

. .