TexasCHLforum.com

Posted: **Sat Mar 28, 2009 8:29 pm**

My wife took her CHL class today, She was told that Houston and a few other cities have ordinances prohibiting the carrying of weapons within their city limits unless you have a CHL.

State law lets you carry in your vehicle concealed without a CHL, but she was told particularly in Houston you have to have a CHL to carry in your car, can I get a ruling here before i call DPS on monday?

thanks

Posted: **Sat Mar 28, 2009 8:36 pm**

CHL instructor is very incorrect. There's a state law that says that cities cannot have laws more restrictive then the state's. Im sure someone will be along shortly to give you the exact wording and location of the law.

Posted: **Sat Mar 28, 2009 8:37 pm**

thanks, i am surfing the dps site as well
and how was the snow event

Posted: **Sat Mar 28, 2009 8:38 pm**

State law prohibits municipalities from passing weapons ordinances more restrictive than state law:

LOCAL GOVERNMENT CODE §229.001. FIREARMS; EXPLOSIVES. (a) A municipality may
not adopt regulations relating to the transfer, private ownership, keeping, transportation, licensing, or registration of firearms, ammunition, or firearm supplies.

The City of Houston and Harris County wish they could, and try, and can make life miserable for law-abiding people.

All one can do is keep one's nose clean and know one's rights. I've spent quite a bit of time and driven many miles in Houston with no trouble.

- Jim

Posted: **Sat Mar 28, 2009 8:46 pm**

thank you so much
i will print the spec and hang it at the clubhouse, was that in the handbook or did you pull it from another source?

Posted: **Sat Mar 28, 2009 9:29 pm**

I would be a little concerned about your CHL instructor not being as knowledgeable as he should be and in fact, I might ask the question, what else has he misled you in. I would also call him back and challenge him on that ruling so he doesn't repeat it and maybe even ask HIM, what else do you need to study up on??? That is a very important position to be a CHL instructor and he should be the most knowledgeable person in the room.

Posted: **Sat Mar 28, 2009 10:05 pm**

I agree that CHL instructors should have current knowledge of the law. I believe they have a duty to do so.

I wouldn't stake the instructor in question out for the coyotes and buzzards quite yet, though.

In the September 2005-2007 period, state law made carrying a handgun in a vehicle without a CHL a defense to prosecution. The Harris County DA at that time (since resigned in disgrace) took every opportunity to prosecute people who had committed no offense.

Now it is legal to carry a concealed handgun in a vehicle with conditions that have been repeated about 1,000 times in this forum. I have not heard of problems since September 2007.

If the CHL instructor is not in the Houston area, he may not be aware of the current state of affairs.

- Jim

Posted: **Sat Mar 28, 2009 10:07 pm**

yup
going to g see him on Sunday afternoon at the range, after i debriefed my wife she had other questions that may or may not have been covered the best way.

I am jealous though she pulled down almost a 300 (287)on the shootin part.

Posted: **Sat Mar 28, 2009 10:46 pm**

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that a woman who is not flaunting some kind of outlaw attitude is not going have trouble with the police in that part of Texas (east of Dallas) other than possibly condescending attitudes.

Even in Harris County at the worst of times, it seemed only men had problems.

You can never out-shoot your wife. Don't even try. Don't ask me how I know.

- Jim

Posted: **Sat Mar 28, 2009 11:42 pm**

powerboatr wrote:yup
going to g see him on Sunday afternoon at the range, after i debriefed my wife she had other questions that may or may not have been covered the best way.

I am jealous though she pulled down almost a 300 (287)on the shootin part.

Now I'm REALLY confused. She scored 287 out of 300 in a Texas CHL Shooting Proficiency Test?

Posted: **Sun Mar 29, 2009 12:00 am**

Did they change the test? It used to be 50 rounds = 250 points.

Posted: **Sun Mar 29, 2009 12:20 am**

seamusTX wrote:State law prohibits municipalities from passing weapons ordinances more restrictive than state law:
LOCAL GOVERNMENT CODE §229.001. FIREARMS; EXPLOSIVES. (a) A municipality may
not adopt regulations relating to the transfer, private ownership, keeping, transportation, licensing, or registration of firearms, ammunition, or firearm supplies.
The City of Houston and Harris County wish they could, and try, and can make life miserable for law-abiding people.

I guess it's a bit late to start a push this time, but how 'bout trying to get knives added to that in 2011, so we don't have to worry about San Antonio's ridiculous ordinances?

Posted: **Sun Mar 29, 2009 8:05 am**

Sure. It could be as simple as getting the word firearms in LGC §229.001 changed to weapons. You can talk to your representative and senator, but you have to line up several more of each. Part of the problem there is that there is no statewide organization that will work for this kind of change.

How much of a problem is it, really? Does anyone know of any person who was otherwise law-abiding (not drunk, fighting, or committing some other crime) being prosecuted for possession of a knife contrary to a city ordinance?

There is a lot of "noise" in city ordinances. Here, we have a city ordinance that prohibits CHL holders from carrying firearms on city property, including parks. It is unenforceable. I think everyone knows that, as no arrests are made and no one talks about it.

Sec. 24-16. Carrying concealed handgun.
(a) Definitions. Concealed handgun shall mean a handgun, the presence of which is not openly discernible to the ordinary observation of a reasonable person.
Premises shall mean any building or portion of a building that is owned or operated by the city, including, but not limited to City Hall, the municipal court building, playgrounds, Moody Civic Center, police department building(s), fire department buildings or sub-stations, the municipal airport. Premises shall not mean streets, sidewalks, walkways, or alleys.
(b) Offense. It shall be unlawful for any person to carry a concealed handgun upon any premise owned by or operated by the city.
(c) Defenses.
(1) It is not a defense to prosecution under this section that a person possessed a handgun and was licensed to carry a concealed handgun under Article 4413(29ee), Revised Statutes.
(d) Penalty. The violation of any provision of section 24-16 shall be unlawful and a misdemeanor offense punishable by a fine not exceeding five hundred dollars ($500.00).

[Later] San Antonio has such an ordinance also:

Sec. 21-157. Carrying of weapons, including concealed handguns, on city-owned premises prohibited; posting of notice.
(a) It is the intent of the city council to prohibit any person other than a commissioned security officer employed by the city and licensed peace officers from carrying or possessing weapons including concealed handguns on city-owned premises, including city-owned buildings, parking garages, lots, and other parking areas but excluding city-owned or operated public parks, streets and sidewalks.
(b) It is the intent of the city council that the term weapon shall include a firearm, handgun, club, illegal knife, knife, and any prohibited weapon listed in Texas Penal Code Section 46.05(a) and have the same meaning as said items are defined in Section 46.01, Texas Penal Code.
(c) The city council directs the city manager, or his designee to post the appropriate signs and such other notice, in accordance with Section 30.05 of the Texas Penal Code (the Criminal Trespass Law), to carry out the city council's above-stated intent.
(d) The city manager is authorized to take all steps reasonable and necessary to deny entry or continued presence on city-owned premises to all such persons possessing weapons including concealed handguns, including prosecution of such violators for the offense of criminal trespass.

http://www.municode.com/resources/gatew ... 508&sid=43" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

You have to navigate to Article VI, Section 21-157 to see this ordinance.

- Jim

Posted: **Mon Mar 30, 2009 7:33 am**

No. You have the right to bear arms. You have no right to bear knives.

Posted: **Mon Mar 30, 2009 7:53 am**

frazzled wrote:No. You have the right to bear arms. You have no right to bear knives.

If knives aren't arms, then what were Roman soldiers armed with?

The term was around long before gunpowder.

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