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I am listening to the second hour of the March 29 edition of Tom Gresham's GunTalk. A caller at the 36:25 mark made the following suggestion:

If you are attacked and stop the attacker, when the police arrive, say that you want to file a complaint against the attacker.

I guess this would be robbery, burglary, or aggravated assault, as appropriate.

Wha'd'y'all think about this?

I'm inclined to think in the midst of a chaotic situation with injuries or corpses present, it wouldn't fly. You could certainly file a complaint later.

- Jim

I hope I never have to find out; however, I think it wouldn't hurt and could possibly set the stage for deciding who is the aggressor and who is the aggressee.

That's something Massad Ayoob recommends in order to indicate to the police who the bad guy is.

How is it possible to file a complaint on a person that is no longer living?

Criminal charges can't be filed on a dead person, at least in this country.

Justifiable homicide is rare. About 200 criminals are fatally injured by non-LEOs a year*. Non-fatal injuries and capturing a criminal without injury are more frequent.

*http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/cius_04/offenses ... urder.html

- Jim

However only the doctor (or EMS) can determine that a person is legally dead. And until then you should make sure that the police pursue the prosecution of the person to the fullest extent of the applicable law. If that becomes not necessary in the future because he cannot be charged due to being dead, then it';sdone.

AEA wrote:How is it possible to file a complaint on a person that is no longer living?

TexasVet beat me to this thought by about a minute. To expand on his comment, even if the BG expires from the GG's efforts to stop the threat, it would be most unwise for the defender to approach the downed subject to examine him to determine his status. It is highly likely that police will arrive before anyone who is authorized to pronounce death makes it to the scene. Until that time, one could reasonably assert that he wants to file a criminal complaint against the suspect to help establish the roles of attacker and defender in the investigation. The complaint would of course become moot if the suspect is later determined to be deceased.

The point isn't to actually file a complaint. The point is to point out the bad guy to the police so that you don't get tagged with the bad guy label.

stroo wrote:The point isn't to actually file a complaint. The point is to point out the bad guy to the police so that you don't get tagged with the bad guy label.

Exactly - a much clearer statement of the point I was trying to make.

Maybe I'm naive, but I don't think the police will have much trouble figuring out who's who given this scenario:

• a woman or middle-aged or older man, neatly dressed, reasonably well groomed, with a CHL, versus
• a young guy with sagging pants and no shoelaces, who looks like he slept with the dogs, carrying a piece-of-junk handgun or illegal knife and no ID

This probably wouldn't work for me on account of my tonsorial challenges.

- Jim

tonsorial

Neat word!

Clint Smith also advises upon the arrival of LEO to tell him that you want him (the guy laying on the ground) arrested. His reasoning was that it would show up in the police report and if you have to go to trial, and when read in court, it would make you look like the GG in the mind of the jury ...because who is the one that is arrested, the BG.

I don't know, this was basically his thoughts, in my words. I have wondered about that and I am glad to see a discussion on the topic.

-geo

If a defender ends up on trial, something in the justification for the use of force has gone very wrong, or else the DA is out to get him.

I'm not sure that anything that you say to the police at the time of the incident would help, other than, "He tried to kill me and I shot to stop him." (You can always throw in the ever-popular "I was in fear of my life.")

Keep in mind that bad guys very often claim self-defense in situations that were actually fights, romantic rivalries, disputes over drug deals, etc.

- Jim

seamusTX wrote:If a defender ends up on trial, something in the justification for the use of force has gone very wrong, or else the DA is out to get him.

I'm not sure that anything that you say to the police at the time of the incident would help, other than, "He tried to kill me and I shot to stop him." (You can always throw in the ever-popular "I was in fear of my life.")

Keep in mind that bad guys very often claim self-defense in situations that were actually fights, romantic rivalries, disputes over drug deals, etc.

- Jim

Adding "Please place him under arrest. I will press charges." wouldn't hurt a thing. You'd probably have to add a couple of words like "with that knife on the ground" about how he tried to kill you so the LEO's can figure out what to charge him with.

bryang wrote:Clint Smith also advises upon the arrival of LEO to tell him that you want him (the guy laying on the ground) arrested. His reasoning was that it would show up in the police report and if you have to go to trial, and when read in court, it would make you look like the GG in the mind of the jury ...because who is the one that is arrested, the BG.

Failing all else, blubbering incoherently and maybe barfing on the cop's shoes (stress reaction) will at least buy you some time. Don't calm down too quickly when your lawyer calls back, though, or it'll look fake.