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Both are 9mm 124gr +P fired from my Beretta M9 into a jug of water, through several layers of cardboard, then the ground.
Top is Remington Golden Sabre. Bottom is Speer Gold Dot.

The Remington's jacket separated & was caught by the cardboard while the lead was dug out of the ground.
The Speer stayed in 1 piece.

I will test the cheap Remington 115gr JHP I got from Walmart that I have been carrying in my Kel-Tec P-11 next time I go out there.

The Speer because...

AdioSS wrote:The Speer stayed in 1 piece.

Dave2 wrote:The Speer because...

AdioSS wrote:The Speer stayed in 1 piece.

Exactly ... bonded bullets are a very good thing

Speer Gold Dot. Higher weight retention seems to be MUCH better... The FBI likes bonded bullets, and they pretty much wrote the book on ballistics testing for personal use after the huge incident where their bullets failed to do enough damage, so since they choose bonded, so do I.

I have used a speer Gold Dot .45 in self defense (against a pig... OK, not self defense... I was waiting in a tree lol), and it dropped him to the GROUND in his tracks. Worked great. Expanded just as shown. It is now behind the firearms counter at the Academy in North Richland hills, as well as a Black Talon I put through it just to see how well it would expand.

Personally, I chose to go with Winchester Ranger T-Series. They are essentially the modern day black talons. Just no black coating. And they have dropped enough pigs at my ranch to have me sold. If a 300 pound pig slides to a stop after one of these, I'm pretty sure a BG would at least slow down considerably. (just in case, I keep the whole magazine loaded with them )

Just my 2 cents...

...Gold Dot in any jacketed round...

gold dot

Count me in on the Gold Dot. It's all about weight retention.

firefighter3217 wrote: I have used a speer Gold Dot .45 in self defense (against a pig... OK, not self defense... I was waiting in a tree lol), and it dropped him to the GROUND in his tracks.

I had less exciting results from a .230gr Gold Dot fired out of a G21SF at a pitbull. It was charging me and I hit it at the base of the neckline and it trotted off a few houses down before laying down and "going to sleep." The pit was about 2 ft away when I fired - it is possible that it was "too close" for the bullet to expand properly, but I wasn't impressed.

I still carry it because where else would I turn, but man....

Gold dots.

AdioSS wrote:Both are 9mm 124gr +P fired from my Beretta M9 into a jug of water, through several layers of cardboard, then the ground.
Top is Remington Golden Sabre. Bottom is Speer Gold Dot.

The Remington's jacket separated & was caught by the cardboard while the lead was dug out of the ground.
The Speer stayed in 1 piece.

I will test the cheap Remington 115gr JHP I got from Walmart that I have been carrying in my Kel-Tec P-11 next time I go out there.

Of those two, I'd definitely go with the Gold Dot (in fact, that's what is in my CZ75 .40 in my nightstand). I'd like to see the same sampling with the Hornady Critical Defense in 9mm or .40. I'd offer to do it myself, but I don't have any place that I can shoot anything other than paper targets.

firefighter3217 wrote:Speer Gold Dot. Higher weight retention seems to be MUCH better... The FBI likes bonded bullets, and they pretty much wrote the book on ballistics testing for personal use after the huge incident where their bullets failed to do enough damage, so since they choose bonded, so do I.

I have used a speer Gold Dot .45 in self defense (against a pig... OK, not self defense... I was waiting in a tree lol), and it dropped him to the GROUND in his tracks. Worked great. Expanded just as shown. It is now behind the firearms counter at the Academy in North Richland hills, as well as a Black Talon I put through it just to see how well it would expand.

Personally, I chose to go with Winchester Ranger T-Series. They are essentially the modern day black talons. Just no black coating. And they have dropped enough pigs at my ranch to have me sold. If a 300 pound pig slides to a stop after one of these, I'm pretty sure a BG would at least slow down considerably. (just in case, I keep the whole magazine loaded with them )

Just my 2 cents...

Any chance you need any help with those piggies? :)

beardking wrote:

firefighter3217 wrote:Speer Gold Dot. Higher weight retention seems to be MUCH better... The FBI likes bonded bullets, and they pretty much wrote the book on ballistics testing for personal use after the huge incident where their bullets failed to do enough damage, so since they choose bonded, so do I.

I have used a speer Gold Dot .45 in self defense (against a pig... OK, not self defense... I was waiting in a tree lol), and it dropped him to the GROUND in his tracks. Worked great. Expanded just as shown. It is now behind the firearms counter at the Academy in North Richland hills, as well as a Black Talon I put through it just to see how well it would expand.

Personally, I chose to go with Winchester Ranger T-Series. They are essentially the modern day black talons. Just no black coating. And they have dropped enough pigs at my ranch to have me sold. If a 300 pound pig slides to a stop after one of these, I'm pretty sure a BG would at least slow down considerably. (just in case, I keep the whole magazine loaded with them )

Just my 2 cents...

Any chance you need any help with those piggies? :)

help isn't the word I'd use... I can handle them, but I always appreciate company when out shooting them. I bought an Ar just for the purpose of killing hogs, and it's decked out appropriately. But every once in awhile I just have to see what a particular bullet will do to a pig, thus I sit in trees with my .45...

Shoot me off a PM with your rough location and email if you want... I'll let ya know next time I go shooting wilbur. Oh, the ranch is right near Brownwood...

gigag04 wrote: I had less exciting results from a .230gr Gold Dot fired out of a G21SF at a pitbull. It was charging me and I hit it at the base of the neckline and it trotted off a few houses down before laying down and "going to sleep." The pit was about 2 ft away when I fired - it is possible that it was "too close" for the bullet to expand properly, but I wasn't impressed.

I still carry it because where else would I turn, but man....

If in doubt, empty the magazine...

Another vote for Gold Dot here. I tested on a stack of wet phone books covered in a layer of denim. I also tested against PoweRball and a couple Black Talon I still had laying around.

Gold Dot was clear winner.

Interestingly, the evil Black Talon had the HPs filled with material and they did not expand at all. PoweRball as expected, flew into pieces with little in the way of penetration.

Not very scientific, but interesting. (And fun)