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I was having breakfast with my parents today and my dad was reading an article in the newspaper about another home invasion that resulted in the homeowner being killed. My dad looks up at my mom and myself and says he wants to get a firearm and take a class to get training.
My mom is a nurse who works the day shift, so depending on her schedule, my dad is alone in the house for most of the week during the day.

My dad is not interested in getting a CHL (yet), but is more focused on home protection. Considering his age (63), fitness, eye sight, etc, I figured it would be a good idea for him to go with a shotgun instead of a handgun. I was thinking of maybe a 20 gauge since a 12 gauge might have too much kick for him to handle. I want something that wont intimidate him, can easily control, and operate. What do you guys think? Good idea? Any other gauges to consider?

I will teach him the basics of gun safety, operating said weapon, etc but we both would feel more comfortable if he could attend a introduction/basic shotgun handling course (maybe something we can both attend) since he has never handled or fired any firearm before. Does anyone know of any training courses offered in the Houston area that might be tailored for someone his age? Thanks for the help

12ga with 2 3/4" 00 buck is not an intimidating load. And with practice it becomes a lot easier. I have an 870 HD 7+1 in 12 ga and love it. My 120# wife handled it just fine. Whatever your choice the practice is what makes the better and safer shooter. Only problem with a scattergun only is it can be awkward in the home. But boy it sure is intimidating. Good luck.

I don't know what his fitness and eyesight situations are, but 63 isn't relevant. I'd certainly let him try handguns and shotguns rather than trying to steer him to shotguns.

As for the 12 gauge, I shoot a 12 gauge just fine, and I'm female.

Texas10X wrote:I don't know what his fitness and eyesight situations are, but 63 isn't relevant. I'd certainly let him try handguns and shotguns rather than trying to steer him to shotguns.

As for the 12 gauge, I shoot a 12 gauge just fine, and I'm female.

Cubbyjb - Don't sell your father short. There are a lot of 63+ men on this forum who can outshoot those half their age.

At age 63, my mom shot a 12 gauge, an M1 Garand and a .357 Colt Python. And she was good with all of them.

Have him take the NRA Basic Pistol course; it is a good introduction to safely handling and shooting handguns.

You can search for a course here: http://www.nrainstructors.org/searchcourse.aspx" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

There is a reason a handgun is the most common firearm for self defense. They are portable and handy. Much easier for him to carry a handgun in a car (which he is allowed to do under MPA).

Jumping Frog wrote:Have him take the NRA Basic Pistol course; it is a good introduction to safely handling and shooting handguns.

Recommended for shooters of all ages.

cubbyjg wrote:. . . Considering his age (63), fitness, eye sight, etc, I figured it would be a good idea for him to go with a shotgun instead of a handgun. I was thinking of maybe a 20 gauge since a 12 gauge might have too much kick for him to handle.

I will find you Kid!

Chas.

I figured a shotgun would keep things simple but i will let him try out a couple of handguns as well to see what he likes.

63 shouldn't be a problem unless he has health issues. I'm 58 and I haven't noticed any reduced ability except for the eyesight. I shot my Mod 29 last month and it still didn't knock me down or anything. Then my wife shot it and she survived too.

Charles L. Cotton wrote:

cubbyjg wrote:. . . Considering his age (63), fitness, eye sight, etc, I figured it would be a good idea for him to go with a shotgun instead of a handgun. I was thinking of maybe a 20 gauge since a 12 gauge might have too much kick for him to handle.

I will find you Kid!

Just what I was thinking.

Unless he has a significant medical or fitness issue we're unaware of, a 63-year-old man shouldn't have any real limitations when it comes to a choice of firearms. To cut cubbyjg some slack, though, I've always said that "old" starts at 20 years older than you are right now. So to him, his father may be "old."

I do love me a good shotgun for HD. Hard to beat if you're in your safe room and covering the entrance. But it isn't necessarily the best option if you have to clear the structure. Shotguns are heavier and less maneuverable than handguns (again, if there is some medical condition we don't know about); less portable and therefore possibly less likely to be quickly at hand if there comes a kick to the door; shotguns are not very retainable at the EQC distances that would occur if someone does obtain entrance to the home; understanding a solid defensive manual-at-arms is slightly more complex (IMHO) with a shotgun than a handgun (fire positions, speed loading, ammo swapping, stoppage reduction, etc.); and as mentioned shotguns don't work particularly well if MPA carry is ever desired.

My solution? Get both! And a rifle!

Seriously, if your father is showing interest in buying a firearm, I'd capitalize on it and get him exposure to as much as he's willing. Since you're in the Houston area, our own TraCoun teaches NRA courses--including basic pistol, basic shotgun, basic rifle, personal protection in the home, and more--out of PSC in Friendswood. The courses are inexpensive and well worth the time; info can be found at http://www.argenttraining.com/.

While the interest level is high, exposing him to both shotguns and handguns doesn't have any downsides. Even if he chooses one over the other right now, basic training exposure to each will give him more knowledge and a broader frame of reference for the future.

If a shotty, I also agree that 20-guage should only be necessary if there is a medical condition that dictates it. A 12-guage, especially an autoloader or a pump with a recoil-reducing stock, is the better option. Magnum loads are absolutely not necessary for effective defensive purposes; standard 2 3/4" 12-guage rounds out of a cylinder bore do very nicely, thank you.

Good luck, and we're happy your father is showing interest!

I've come to the conclusion that a shotgun is better for home defense.

If your awoken in the middle of the night i like the odds of having multiple pellets available in a single shot. I also like knowing the pellets will potentially be absorbed in the walls and my odds of harming loved ones in rooms behind the perp are reduced as opposed to a pistol shot.

Plus you just point in the general direction and pull the trigger. The spread will cover more ground.

A HPD officer and serveral others have told me "Racking a pump gun is a pretty intimidating sound, if the perp isn't smart enough to take the hint god bless him".

I agree with this thought logic and now have a 12 ga self defense shot gun close buy at night.

I will be 70 soon. Reading the first post I felt for sure I was ready for the glue factory.

I make it to the range once a week if possible. Hopefully I will be doing this for many more years.

Chuck

Rugerboy50 wrote:Plus you just point in the general direction and pull the trigger. The spread will cover more ground

With all due respect, you couldn't be more wrong on that. A shotgun is not the "scattergun" that everyone seems to think. That is a Hollywood myth.

When you get a chance, try firing buckshot at paper targets 10 to 20 feet away. You sould find a spread of only 6 - 12", depending on the ammo, barrel length, and a couple of other variables. 10 to 20 feet would be about normal in-home distance.

I know of a great many of my old high school hunting buddies that had no problem with new 12 ga shotguns but were absolutely terrified of the kick from my dad's old Stevens 520 16 ga. Dad still goes after vermin ( skunks, snakes, swarms of black birds) out at the farm with it each year and he's about to hit 76 years of age. (although he may complain about a sore shoulder a day or so after defending a peanut field against invading birds nowadays)

Nice soft modern actions and recoil pads really can tame a 12 ga down.

Pawpaw wrote:

Rugerboy50 wrote:Plus you just point in the general direction and pull the trigger. The spread will cover more ground

A shotgun is not the "scattergun" that everyone seems to think. That is a Hollywood myth.

When you get a chance, try firing buckshot at paper targets 10 to 20 feet away. You sould find a spread of only 6 - 12", depending on the ammo, barrel length, and a couple of other variables. 10 to 20 feet would be about normal in-home distance.

Yeppers. Out of a typical 12-guage defensive shotgun's 18.5" cylinder barrel, the baseline formula for the spread of double-ought buckshot is two centimeters for every meter in distance traveled. That's about 0.8" for every 3.3 feet. At 20 feet, that's less about a 5" spread. Definitely handy, but comes nowhere near not having to aim. Reduced-recoil loads spread less and produce patterns that are more dense.

Generally speaking, the smaller the shot size, the faster it spreads...but also the less effective it is as a threat-stopper. Under most circumstances, 00-buck is defensively effective out to 30, maybe 35 yards; #4 shot out to 15 yards, maybe a little farther.

And if over-penetration is a concern, shot spread probably is, too. If you go for smaller shot and larger spread it's going to be both less likely to penetrate deep enough to stop the threat, and it's going to become a less-than-good idea if you need to take a reasonably accurate shot anywhere near a family member or other innocent.

I've known some guys who think that opting for a rifled shotgun barrel will improve the accuracy situation. It will if you're shooting appropriate slugs, but accuracy--and certainly effectiveness--is suspect if shooting multiple pellets. The problem is that, as the pellets are compressed and fired down the bore, they catch the grooves and landings of the rifling and start to spin. But converse to the way you want a single object--a rifle bullet or a shotgun slug--spinning, what happens is that, upon exiting the barrel, the pellets start to expand in a fairly even, circular pattern.

Not what you want with a cluster of pellets. The advantage of a shot shell is the inches-wide area at the point-of-aim where you get a random but contained pattern of hits. With a rifled bore, what you end up with is a circular pattern of hits...with none of the hits at the point-of-aim: they're all around the POA in a nice circle. Not desirable.

So Pawpaw has it right. Scatterguns, today, are mostly movie props...and of course we all know that any shotgun blast in the movies throws the bad guy off his feet and five feet backward.

A corollary: The above is a big reason I, personally, never recommend shotguns that have pistol grips only. They look cool, but you simply can't make an accurate shot with them using standard 12-guage 00-buck. At under 10 feet, they are maneuverable and highly effective with point-shooting, but much beyond that it becomes difficult to even think about accurate shots. The shotgun is stable if you hold the grip tight to the body, but lift it up to try to get a decent sight picture and controlling the thing after the shot introduces a whole new set of problems. Hold it too close to your face in attempting good sight alignment and you may receive a slightly revised nose. Don't ask me how I know this. I was very young.