TexasCHLforum.com

We'll have to wait and see how this one ends. The police are still investigating the incident.

A man was pumping gas when a green car drove up, and the man said that driver flashed a gun, police said.

“He tried to leave, but he says the car followed him and flashed his gun again,� Carey said. The man, who said he was threatened, then opened fire, authorities said.

http://www.woai.com/news/local/story.as ... 1796670d33

Wow, seems he got off pretty easy since there were no weapons found.

The shooting happened closed to 7 p.m. Saturday at an Exxon

ah! apparently written by an idiot.

man, sounds like a cluster bomb, but one that may have been avoided.
dude better have bullet holes in his car also, or he might be in some hot water.

The shooting happened closed to 7 p.m. Saturday at an Exxon

I hope that's just a typo. It's a TV web site. You can't expect them to be good writers.

Let's make this a learning experience. What do you do if you're pumping gas or otherwise in a situation where you can't immediately beat feet, and someone in a car points a weapon at you?

I can't think of a sure-fire solution.

- Jim

seamusTX wrote:Let's make this a learning experience. What do you do if you're pumping gas or otherwise in a situation where you can't immediately beat feet, and someone in a car points a weapon at you?

Cover - your car may not be the world's best bullet-stopper, but the engine and wheels are pretty tough against handguns, and a lot of people won't or can't shoot effectively at a concealed target. *BIG* bonus points if you can lure them in front of a security camera in the process. (no mention of gas station security tapes in the text at least - that would go a long way toward establishing that he was at least being followed/harassed, and maybe give some insight into the presence of a weapon or other object that would have looked like one - and I can't think of many major gas stations that don't have cameras on the pump area)

Verbalize while drawing your weapon - order them as loudly as you can to drop the gun - your goal here is to attract attention to their gun, and maybe get them to comply in the process.

You're playing it by ear from here - best thing to do if you have time is try to get 911 dialed ASAP, and repeat your command where the dispatcher's recorder can hear it.

seamusTX wrote:

The shooting happened closed to 7 p.m. Saturday at an Exxon

I hope that's just a typo. It's a TV web site. You can't expect them to be good writers.

Let's make this a learning experience. What do you do if you're pumping gas or otherwise in a situation where you can't immediately beat feet, and someone in a car points a weapon at you?

I can't think of a sure-fire solution.

- Jim

Interesting scenario. You might not want to hide behind the gasoline pump. I can just see the real-life "special effects" a spark from a bullet would cause in one of those!

1) Take cover behind the largest, most solid chunk of metal you can - your car, with hopefully the engine block between you and their shots as well. DO NOT hide behind the gasoline pump!
1-A) Disconnect/shut off gas pump if you have opportunity. It's within the realm of possibility that the nozzle/hose could be struck by a stray round, spraying gasoline all over.

2) Evaluate situation. Are you able to "beat feet," or are you pinned down? If you are able to, get out of the pumping areas, to minimize the chance of sparks around gasoline. If not, you're probably gonna have to put up resistance of some kind, and hope they don't shoot the pump. Personally, in this situation especially, I'd try to "downscale" the confrontation if at all possible (throw them my wallet, talk to them, etc.). Again, I don't believe a gas station's pumping area is a good place for a firefight (as if there WERE such a thing as a "good place for a firefight"), and exchanging shots is more than ever a last resort. That gasoline can be volatile stuff.

3) If you DO have to fight, place your shots with extreme care, especially if they're in front of/hiding behind more gas pumps. Yeah, catching them in a remake of "Apocalypse" would serve them right, except that you'd likely be caught in the inferno too, if one was started. Your primary objective is to survive, not to shoot the bad guy, and starting a fire from a stray shot is not "good survival skills."

(BTW, yes, I do know that gas stations have fire-suppression systems. I'm assuming these systems are broken because Moronic Mugger has shot them, either intentially or accidentally.)


These are what I can come up with. I'm sure there are several points that can be improved/corrected/deleted/added as necessary, by those more learned in the matter.

[Edited for clarity in a couple points]

" ... best thing to do if you have time is try to get 911 dialed ASAP... "

A BIG +1!! I can't believe I didn't mention that.

Tack that on as item 1-B. Draw cell phone, dial 911, and let the dispatch hear what's happening. Be sure to loudly declare where you are, especially if you dial and set the phone down so you have two hands for your weapon.

Thane wrote:

seamusTX wrote:

The shooting happened closed to 7 p.m. Saturday at an Exxon

I hope that's just a typo. It's a TV web site. You can't expect them to be good writers.

Let's make this a learning experience. What do you do if you're pumping gas or otherwise in a situation where you can't immediately beat feet, and someone in a car points a weapon at you?

I can't think of a sure-fire solution.

- Jim

Interesting scenario. You might not want to hide behind the gasoline pump. I can just see the real-life "special effects" a spark from a bullet would cause in one of those!

1) Take cover behind the largest, most solid chunk of metal you can - your car, with hopefully the engine block between you and their shots as well. DO NOT hide behind the gasoline pump!
1-A) Disconnect/shut off gas pump if you have opportunity. It's within the realm of possibility that the nozzle/hose could be struck by a stray round, spraying gasoline all over.

2) Evaluate situation. Are you able to "beat feet," or are you pinned down? If you are able to, get out of the pumping areas, to minimize the chance of sparks around gasoline. If not, you're probably gonna have to put up resistance of some kind, and hope they don't shoot the pump. Personally, in this situation especially, I'd try to "downscale" the confrontation if at all possible (throw them my wallet, talk to them, etc.). Again, I don't believe a gas station's pumping area is a good place for a firefight (as if there WERE such a thing as a "good place for a firefight"), and exchanging shots is more than ever a last resort. That gasoline can be volatile stuff.

3) If you DO have to fight, place your shots with extreme care, especially if they're in front of/hiding behind more gas pumps. Yeah, catching them in a remake of "Apocalypse" would serve them right, except that you'd likely be caught in the inferno too, if one was started. Your primary objective is to survive, not to shoot the bad guy, and starting a fire from a stray shot is not "good survival skills."

(BTW, yes, I do know that gas stations have fire-suppression systems. I'm assuming these systems are broken because Moronic Mugger has shot them, either intentially or accidentally.)


These are what I can come up with. I'm sure there are several points that can be improved/corrected/deleted/added as necessary, by those more learned in the matter.

[Edited for clarity in a couple points]

Bullets have a tough time igniting gasoline; however, your point is well made to not needlessly test that.

Every gas station has a cutoff switch, usually a big button near each set of pumps. I scope out its location while fueling on the off chance that some idiot will start a fire.

I don't know if one switch cuts off the whole station.

- Jim

seamusTX wrote:Every gas station has a cutoff switch, usually a big button near each set of pumps. I scope out its location while fueling on the off chance that some idiot will start a fire.

I don't know if one switch cuts off the whole station.

It does. The only exception might be at a travel plaza type place, where the gasoline and truck islands are completely separate.

Kevin

Thane wrote: 2) Evaluate situation. Are you able to "beat feet," or are you pinned down? If you are able to, get out of the pumping areas, to minimize the chance of sparks around gasoline. If not, you're probably gonna have to put up resistance of some kind, and hope they don't shoot the pump. Personally, in this situation especially, I'd try to "downscale" the confrontation if at all possible (throw them my wallet, talk to them, etc.). Again, I don't believe a gas station's pumping area is a good place for a firefight (as if there WERE such a thing as a "good place for a firefight"), and exchanging shots is more than ever a last resort. That gasoline can be volatile stuff.

While a Gas pump might not be the best cover, it might not be as bad as it might seem.
1: There really isn't as much gasoline as one might think in the pump There is probably more fuel in the hose external to the pump, than there is in the internal to the pump/meter station.

2: Firing copper and lead bullets aren't going to cause sparks. Most of us don't load tracer rounds. bullets causing exploding gastanks is a Hollywood thing. Gasoline isn't so easy light off it requires a proper airgas mixture and a fairly hot ignition source.

3 If the pup were turned on if as bullet caused gas to spill the vapor recovery system will probably cause the pump to shut off it shouldnt continue pump out all over the ground. At any rate its probably a good idea to rehook the nozzle before getting involved in a gun fight.

While a bullet probably isn't going to set off a fire/explosion, I bet the muzzle flash would, if it were in close enough proximity to vapors.

I think mythbusters did a set on if a gunshot would set off a fuel explosion. They did it off of a car's fuel tank though, and if I recall correctly, they couldn't get an explosion.

Still, having seen that, I'd rather not take cover behind a gaspump if possible :/

nitrogen wrote:I think mythbusters did a set on if a gunshot would set off a fuel explosion. They did it off of a car's fuel tank though, and if I recall correctly, they couldn't get an explosion.

In order for gasoline vapor to explode, it has to be mixed with air in the right proportion.

Gas tanks of modern cars contain little air because of the vapor recycling system.

The danger of fire is significant, though.

- Jim

NcongruNt wrote:While a bullet probably isn't going to set off a fire/explosion, I bet the muzzle flash would, if it were in close enough proximity to vapors.

It could easily if the air fuel mixture is proper. If there were a lot of gasoline on the the ground on a hot day one could possibly ignite the gasoline. However I don't thing one would get that much gas out of a pump station. I think its value of cover would outweigh the the risk of explosion. While I would be grateful for better options. You have to take the cards your dealt. Under this scenerio you have cover on one side as the car another side is the pump. I wouldn't worry about the pump exploding while someone is shooting at me.