TexasCHLforum.com

G&A just released their Best Concealed Carry States In 2013 and Texas ranks #14. Low score was given for Application Fee, which they say is among the most expensive in the country.

14. Texas
Permit Issuance: 20
Reciprocity: 18
Training Time: 8
Application Fee: 2
Stand Your Ground: 9
Best States for Gun Owners: 8
Duty to Inform: 5
Pre-Emption: 5
Issued to Non-Residents: 5
TOTAL: 80
Texas is a famously gun-friendly state, and so are its concealed carry laws—with exception to licensing fees. Cost of a new resident license is among the worst on this list at $140. Texas recognizes licenses from 41 states, has a Stand Your Ground law with no duty to retreat, and immunity from civil lawsuits.

What do you think about the results? Most of the scores make sense, I guess I didn't realize the application fees here were so much higher than other states.

It sounds about right. We've come a long way - but there are improvements that can and will be made.

I'm glad we have Charles and the rest of the TSRA on our side.

The fee hasn't changed with the lower requirements for class time? I know most of the CHL class costs are less, but the application?

LAYGO wrote:The fee hasn't changed with the lower requirements for class time? I know most of the CHL class costs are less, but the application?

According to the fee schedule published after the 9/1 changes went into effect, the standard application fee is still $140 with renewals at $70.

Several of the discounts changed I think, like active peace officers and active/retired judicial officers went to $25.

LAYGO wrote:The fee hasn't changed with the lower requirements for class time? I know most of the CHL class costs are less, but the application?

The application fee is paid to the state, and IIRC it is supposed to be set to cover the cost of processing the application, but I think it does a bit more than that...

Thus the length of the class itself doesn't have anything to do with the application fee. You might think that the fee paid to the instructor should vary with time, but the instructor might disagree.

SeamusTX had some posts a few years ago where he was trying to figure out how the income from CHLs compared to what DPS was allocated to run the CHL program. I think he suspected that the income significantly exceeded the cost, but also don't think he was ever successful in nailing this down.

Of course $140 is the standard fee -- the fees for veterans and oldsters and such have been whittled down quite a bit.

I do think $140 is excessive for getting a license to do what is supposed to be a constitutionally protected right - and in light of what other states seem to be able to charge for doing the same thing.

I wonder if they factored in the length of time the license is good for when comparing fees.

poppo wrote:I wonder if they factored in the length of time the license is good for when comparing fees.

Good point, according to their description of the criteria, it doesn't appear they considered it:

Application Fee: Application fees were scored with a maximum of 10 points based on the statutory cost paid by civilians to their state of residence in order to obtain the permit. Fees were not scored based on renewal or out-of-state permit costs, military/law enforcement/veteran rates or senior citizen discounts. Fees also do not include the cost of any necessary training course(s). States with unrestricted carry automatically earned the maximum number of points.

It is also interesting to note that 4 of the top 15 states are "unrestricted", or constitutional, carry. And there are at least two instanced in the top 10 where two or more states received the same score but not the same "rank".

The other thing not considered is where you can and can not carry and signage required to prohibit concealed carry.

To be perfectly honest when I eliminate the items which have little to no impact on me personally, Texas (along with several other states) receive a max score. Throw in a score for what I've stated above about off limit areas/signage and some of those other highly ranked states start to get dinged.

jmra wrote:The other thing not considered is where you can and can not carry and signage required to prohibit concealed carry.

To be perfectly honest when I eliminate the items which have little to no impact on me personally, Texas (along with several other states) receive a max score. Throw in a score for what I've stated above about off limit areas/signage and some of those other highly ranked states start to get dinged.

Signage is not universal. California has no signs to worry about. You have to know the off-limits places and avoid them. Of course, this problem is ameliorated by having so few CCW permits issued. San Diego had fewer than 2,000 when I had one, and it has probably decreased slightly with the new Sheriff who, although not "no issue" is "rather not." LA, SF and a few others are "no issue."

I don't recall all the places, but courthouses, bars, schools, maybe a few others. A property occupier cannot prohibit you from carrying if not in one of the enumerated classes, although a private club can, I think. It's not a crime, they just kick you out.

My permit said "for business purposes only" whatever that means. I guess if someone threatened me personally, I had to run and hide, but if it was strictly business I could shoot back.

[youtube]http://youtube.com/watch?v=Bo7zkd0kRS4[/youtube]

JALLEN wrote:Signage is not universal. California has no signs to worry about. You have to know the off-limits places and avoid them. Of course, this problem is ameliorated by having so few CCW permits issued. San Diego had fewer than 2,000 when I had one, and it has probably decreased slightly with the new Sheriff who, although not "no issue" is "rather not." LA, SF and a few others are "no issue."

I don't recall all the places, but courthouses, bars, schools, maybe a few others. A property occupier cannot prohibit you from carrying if not in one of the enumerated classes, although a private club can, I think. It's not a crime, they just kick you out.

My permit said "for business purposes only" whatever that means. I guess if someone threatened me personally, I had to run and hide, but if it was strictly business I could shoot back.

http://legallyarmed.com/ccw_statistics.htm
http://www.governing.com/gov-data/state ... mates.html


As of July 2012, there were approximately 35,000 active permits in California—a state with population of 38 million at the time.
As of January 2013, there were approximately 584,850 active permits in Texas—a state with a population of approximately 26 million at the time.

I'll take Texas. . . . warts and all.

mewalke wrote:... I guess I didn't realize the application fees here were so much higher than other states.

My PA non-resident license cost $20.

My UT non-resident license was $51. UT renewals are $15.

My original OH license was $54.

Just sayin' . . .

Jumping Frog wrote:

mewalke wrote:... I guess I didn't realize the application fees here were so much higher than other states.

My PA non-resident license cost $20.

My UT non-resident license was $51. UT renewals are $15.

My original OH license was $54.

Just sayin' . . .

My TX CHL is now $5 a year.

jmra wrote:

Jumping Frog wrote:

mewalke wrote:... I guess I didn't realize the application fees here were so much higher than other states.

My PA non-resident license cost $20.

My UT non-resident license was $51. UT renewals are $15.

My original OH license was $54.

Just sayin' . . .

My TX CHL is now $5 a year.

I am not a fan of "favored classes" getting substantial discounts when everyone else is paying $140.

mewalke wrote:What do you think about the results? Most of the scores make sense, I guess I didn't realize the application fees here were so much higher than other states.

Until this year, the training requirements were also higher than most other states with no demonstrated benefit.

Jumping Frog wrote:

jmra wrote:

Jumping Frog wrote:

mewalke wrote:... I guess I didn't realize the application fees here were so much higher than other states.

My PA non-resident license cost $20.

My UT non-resident license was $51. UT renewals are $15.

My original OH license was $54.

Just sayin' . . .

My TX CHL is now $5 a year.

I am not a fan of "favored classes" getting substantial discounts when everyone else is paying $140.

If I weren't one of them I wouldn't be either. Ticks me off that LEOs pay less for glocks than I do. Of course I could become a LEO if it bothered me that much. Would you like the number to a military recruiter?